Muzzy_Larsson

The Cartel The Closed Shop Championship

Been an open secret for a while now he's Barca bound, particularly if Messi is staying which it seems he might be now.

Money shouldn't be the be all and end all in football though, I think that's the point people are trying to make, there comes a time where you have to say enough is enough. Let these 'elite' clubs, a lot of which were mediocre sides who have achieved nothing until a Russian oligarch or Sheikh decided to play real life football manager, go off and play in their superleague. Let them play each other at 10am on a Sunday morning so they can hoarde even more money from the asian tv markets, let them fill their grounds with football tourists and sell their soul and any atmosphere these grounds ever had. Like anything there is a saturation point, people will get tuned off by watching Man City v PSG three and four times a season. Football at it's best is raw and authentic and this sort of thing would be none of that. I'm not daft enough or an idealist to the point where I don't realise money rules the game now, of course it does but it's getting out of control and football is in danger of eating itself because of it. At least sports like NFL and whatever else have salary caps etc to maintain some sort of competitive edge.

And join the cartel that everyone on here hates and become part of this clutch of clubs that become so hungry they'll eat themselves. Not for me, that happens and much of the magic that makes Leicester what they are becomes lost. Mia san mia.

I don't agree with the wildcard thing in principle, it's abhorrent but as much as Arsenal have been on the decline they have still went deep into European competition during that time in reaching the final and latter stages of the EL so it's not strictly based on what they've done in the past. European co-efficients have always worked on a rolling five year basis. Leicester may be a stronger side this season and last domestically but in European terms hey're not even close to Arsenal yet in terms of european performances. Even this season Arsenal have been pants but have found a way to get to the latter stages again. That's why Leicester need to be doing better than what they done this season in Europe and it needs to be consistent if the next level is reached. It's so important, it's not only an extra revenue stream but qualifying and competing regularly is self-fulfilling in terms of taking that next step. The whole thing is a self-serving cartel though and a joke, purely to satisfy the already super rich clubs who have essentially thrown their toys out the pram because greed has consumed them and they want guaranteed even more money. Growing up I was fascinated by the champions league, even the music made my hairs stand up, seeing Europe's best roll into Glasgow and very often leave with a bloody nose were the best days of my life supporting Celtic. Now the way it's going, where basically the clubs with the wealthiest owners or from the richest leagues in a commercial sense are the only ones who can compete isn't something I'm bothered about being part of.

Done a decent job late in his career when he came up to Celtic. One of the best crossers of a ball I've seen.

He'd be a mazda mx-5 Vardy - Porsche 911 Barnes - Dodge Challenger Iheanacho - Bentley Ndidi - Hummer

Yeah you can't argue with that but on the flip side there are plenty of great coaches who have had similar and made a pigs ear of it. Equally there are guys who work great on a shoestring but can't handle working at bigger clubs, with greater resources and better players.

They were good yes but they were almost unrecognisable from the players that dominated club and international football a few years later. Xavi for one, I'd be curious to know how many of those 300 appearances were even starts. Messi, like you say was a 3rd place Ballon d'or finisher then as he devloped basically won it every single year on the trot under pep. Like you say they were good players, unquestionably but Pep turned them into some of the best players we'll ever see in the history of football, in one of the best sides in the history of football, not any manager could do that. I'm not his biggest fan btw but it's churlish to try and play down the guy's ability as a coach. A lot of his issues at Bayern and Man City, in Europe anyway came from teams working out how to nullify tiki-taka and him taking a bit longer than he should have to adjust from his orthodox version of that.

Yeah pretty much, maybe not on the same scale but it was widely reported at that time Aberdeen were paying their top players twice as much as what old firm players were on and that was largely the reason they were able to hold on to guys like Miller and McLeish.

I'd agree Fergie is the master and on another level to Guardiola. That said, you can't ignore the context fo Fergie at Aberdeen either, it's similar to the accusation that's levied at Pep on this same thread, when he was the Aberdeen manager they were outspending both old firm clubs, by a good bit in terms of wages. tt was the only period in fairly recent histoy Aberdeen done that.

Never insinuaed they were. The part your ignoring though is the core of the side that won it previously was Ronaldinho, Deco, Etoo, Puyol etc. Guardiola's side the core was Iniesta, Xavi, Busquets, Messi and Pique. He took every one of those players and developed them to a level that was lightyears beyond where they were in 2006.

Nah a runner and not much else. Although he was linked with a loan deal quite heavily when Rodgers was at Celtic so perhaps Rodgers likes him.

I think that's the bit where we're disconnected though, when he took over the Barcelona job many of those players weren't already the best in the world, very good players yes, but not the best. The best managers can do both, as Guardiola has proved a Barcelona, now with someone like Foden. Sir Alex Ferguson is another example of someone who was great at both. He took guys like Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets and Pique and developed them to a level never thought possible. The former two weren't even considered first picks before he arrived.

Going deep into European competition, even if it is the EL on a regular basis would be the most obvious added revenue stream. Wages to turnover ratio of even 80-90% to me doesn't seem sustainable and/or wise.

Good points. Player bonuses usually quite hefty also on the back of CL qualification/participation.

Out of curiosity what's the demand like for an increased capacity? Is there a season ticket waiting list?

Seen quite a bit of him this season, he's still quite raw but defintely has a lot of good attributes, big and strong, a threat in both boxes, decent turn of pace and like any Barcelona academy graduate can use the ball well. I'd be amazed though if he didn't sign a new contract with Barcelona soon though given how much he has featured this season. He's decent at right back also.

£30m basically for being in the group stages all things considered. Maybe a little less for English sides as they need to share the TV pot, whereas in Scotland one team tends to have all of that. The better you perform in the groups and the further you go in the competiton the greater the financial rewards obviously.

The irony of it all is it's a very small time way to think/act. The whole notion of a 'big club' is so antequated and the playground like jostling of my club is a bigger club than yours is a total red neck.

I don't particularly like him but let's get real re Pep here, the guy is different class and his impact on football has been such that he's transformed the entire game to a degree. The "could he do it at this club" argument is a complete misnomer and a bit pointless really, he's too good a manager to end up at a club that isn't an elite club. Which brings me onto Rodgers. It's ironic given the world class thread from yesterday but I believe Rodgers is most definitely a world class manager, there's a clutch of about 5 managers/coaches in the world right now who are out on their own and he's very much in that company imo. The difference between Pep and Rodgers is simply they're trajectory. Pep was a high profile player, who off the back of that was fast tracked into a job at the very highest level of the game, at a club he'd spent the bulk of his career and knew inside out. He performed amazingly in that job and as such that's his level now as a manager, Europe's elite clubs. Rodgers' trajectory is different, he had no profile to speak of, he wasn't even a professional football player so his trajectory has been far more incremental, moving up a rung of the ladder at a time, sometimes even taking a step back to take two forwards. I'm not meaning this to piss on anyone's chips but in my mind it's a matter of time before Rodgers ends up at a Man City, Bayern Munich, Barcelona, etc. If he can sort out how his sides tend to under achieve in Europe these clubs will really sit up and take notice. The EL exit this season may have been a blessing in disguise in that sense.

Yeah next two years are huge for him if he's going to make it at any sort of decent level, his development has really stalled the past couple of years.

Sorry crossed wires mate, I was talking about Martial not Karamoko.

The Celtic squad is full of international players and we are shit, so as subjective as it is I don't think that's a valid interpretation of world class at all.

Same tbh, it's an absolute zero risk scenario.