Brexit Discussion Thread.

[Webbo]

Interesting opinion piece from the Telegraph yesterday.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/24/dear-remainers-you-lost-stop-whinging-on-facebook/

 

I can see his point regarding the need to pull together in the aftermath here, but I also think it's a bit rich for the Brexiteers to turn around and ask for help 'to do the best for the country' from the Bremainers now. If they were so certain of a bright future outside of the EU, then they can do the work to build it by themselves, surely? With all the credit that entails if they get it right, and the blame if it goes wrong. The Remainers are under no obligation to 'work with the (silm) majority' in any way. If they actively blocked the progress the Brexiters were trying to make, then that would be a problem...but instead merely doing nothing? 

 

Also, it appears that the Remain side don't have a monopoly on patronisation.

We have to pull together, both sides of the argument have to combine to get a deal that suits everyone.

[leicsmac]

God I agree buce, never have I witnessed so many openly stupid, ignorant people. From both sides but it does seem a little top heavy at this end unfortunately. Hysterical drivel to outrageous nonsense, I'm glad I decided to hide away for the weekend (even if I did it expecting a completely different outcome).

 

True. That's the payoff with direct democracy. I guess at least it means that such attitudes on all sides are now out in the open where they can be challenged, though.

[leicsmac]

We have to pull together, both sides of the argument have to combine to get a deal that suits everyone.

 

I hear what you're saying, probably agree with it too. But you can't blame people for choosing instead to sit on the fence, as long as they don't get in the way.

 

Honestly, I think unity after this is an idealistic pipedream. I'd like to see it happen, but...

[KFS]

Not that it was my vote, but you could try reading the other thread, or this one.

Key words being 'logical' and 'outweigh' here Babylon. Woken up this morning and the pound isn't only fvcked but our long term credit prediction has fallen. Again, someone please try and help me understand why this was a good decision?

[Leicester_Loyal]

Key words being 'logical' and 'outweigh' here Babylon. Woken up this morning and the pound isn't only fvcked but our long term credit prediction has fallen. Again, someone please try and help me understand why this was a good decision?

It's been one day. This is a lifetime decision, lets calm down and reassess the situation in a month or two, when the economy has stabilised and more than likely picked back up.

[Dr The Singh]

It's not the racism (as abhorent as it is) that I'm drawing attention to. The first melt firmly believes that all immigrants (blacks and asians included) will now be 'sent home', the second that Leicester's hosiery trade will now miraculously be resurgent because we've left the EU.

The most important vote in a generation has been decided, in part, by people who have absolutely zero understanding of what they were voting for.

So, I'll ask you again: would you be comfortable with such people serving on a jury, with you as a defendant?

Whether comfortable or not, it's there right. This is now an opportunity for all to unite and give a clear message to these memories. This includes MPs, media and the public

[apple987]

Really doing my head in all this scaremongering from remain voters after the vote. Its ridiculous, what are they trying to achieve.

It's done, now get on with it. It's almost like they are trying to force through a second referendum.

Also does anyone share my conspiracy theory that cameron actually wanted brexit? I've just got a feeling after he failed to get a good deal in February, that he thought out was best.

[m4DD0gg]

Key words being 'logical' and 'outweigh' here Babylon. Woken up this morning and the pound isn't only fvcked but our long term credit prediction has fallen. Again, someone please try and help me understand why this was a good decision?

 

Jesus the pound is weak against the dollar which it has been for some time, against the euro it is the same level it was at in February. 

 

The UK markets were down by just 3% at the end of yesterday which is nothing!

 

I would not pay to much heed to ratings agencies either.

 

End of the day the vast majorities of remain were in london, scotland and nth ireland whom all have specific reasons for wanting to stay.

 

The bulk of england had an overwhelmingly high vote to exit because they simply want a change in the 3 undeniable areas that the out camp campaigned for; Border control, Financial control and true sovereignty.........they are virtually impossible to argue against and the reason the majority of UK citizens voted for exit.

 

It makes me laugh how some think this will be an over night fix, it will take months if not years to come to fruition.

 

I strongly believe that in the long term this is the best decision for this country.

[Voll Blau]

Really not been happy with the way elements of the Remain vote have tried to play on the apparent demographics of the Leave vote. I know people who are a) old b) lacking educational qualifications and c) both, who voted Remain. Would be disgusted if the tables were turned and they had been denigrated in the same way. Part of me thinks that sort of perceived snobbery is what lost us the vote.

 

As for this whole petition for London to secede (started by a bloke originally from Harborough!) - well, that seems to confirm it for me. Maybe if London had listened to the rest of the country and Labour had listened to the concerns of its disenfranchised traditional vote in the Midlands and North, and actually put someone up to show effective and positive leadership for Remain, this would never have happened.

 

It's probably the protest votes that have tipped the balance here, and now we all need to stand together to ensure the Leave politicians deliver their promises to help the communities which gave them the win. Communities which, I fear, will be the hardest hit by a future lack of EU funding.

[GaelicFox]

It's not the racism (as abhorent as it is) that I'm drawing attention to. The first melt firmly believes that all immigrants (blacks and asians included) will now be 'sent home', the second that Leicester's hosiery trade will now miraculously be resurgent because we've left the EU.

The most important vote in a generation has been decided, in part, by people who have absolutely zero understanding of what they were voting for.

So, I'll ask you again: would you be comfortable with such people serving on a jury, with you as a defendant?

On radio one in Yorkshire there was a conversation with a leave voter

Interviewer : why did you vote leave

Voter : to stop the polish coming and then to open the pit

Interviewer : The Pit ? You think now we have left we can open the local pit ?

Voter : yes it's the EU's fault that thatcher closed the pit

Interviewer: the pit was closed in 1979 because it ran dry

Voter : ahh that's what thatcher told us and the EU paid her off to close all the pits so we buy German electricity

Interviewer: ok let's leave it there your argument is a little weak

FFS

LOL

[Merging Cultures]

I've heard this a lot, " it was a vote against austerity", it's bollox. The plebs aren't voting how they should it must be the Tories fault is just the sort of elitist rubbish that cost the remain vote.. If the EU had given Cameron a few concessions, at least pretended to care what the electorate, of all Europe wanted, none of this would have happened.

Exactly this. They wouldn't negotiate, so we left. Their follow on comments have really vindicated that. They are now trying to dictate when we leave. I hope we are stronger in our negotiations with them on the way out.

[leicsmac]

Really doing my head in all this scaremongering from remain voters after the vote. Its ridiculous, what are they trying to achieve.

It's done, now get on with it. It's almost like they are trying to force through a second referendum.

Also does anyone share my conspiracy theory that cameron actually wanted brexit? I've just got a feeling after he failed to get a good deal in February, that he thought out was best.

 

I refer you to the point above. The people who voted Remain are under no obligation to do anything in the way of collaboration, and if those who voted Leave really believe that it was the best decision, they'll be able to bring the UK through to a better future without help anyway. And if they do, that is when they'll be able to turn around to the Remain crowd, thumb their noses and say that they told them so.

[Dodgy Bob]

Does seem like the entire underclass has voted leave in some kind of misguided protest. I wonder what society will be like in three or five years time when nothing like what those voters wanted to happen has even come close to happening.

On reflection Cameron quitting was a no brainer and I'm not surprised the slimey twats like Boris wanted him to stay on. Whoever takes on the job now will be trying to please a society with the most bizarre expectations of all time and is almost guaranteed to get the blame when reality hits. All these people thumping their chests and talking about how they were going to put the great back in Great Britain and now they've actually won, the leadership position is like a hot coal, none of the shifty twats want anything to do with it. They know hard times are a'coming.

[Charl91]

So are you naive enough to think the stay vote also doesn't have millions of people who don't have a clue what they are really voting for?

 

They know what they're voting for, on account of having lived while being in the EU for most/all of their lives. They're voting for things to carry on as they are.

[The Guvnor]

Were just going to have to disagree here and walk on, chap.

I eagerly await the election where a party promising to reduce the state pension to a sustainable level and take serious action on house prices gets a ringing endorsement from all those over 50's who seriously care about the young people in this country. However, I am absolutely certain that won't happen any time soon.

 

You know what Bob I think you're right, a real shame you have those narrow minded views about home owners who are 50 years young and over.

[Ghost Troop]

The thing that really worries me and that may do the country the most harm, at least in the short to mid term is the uncertainty. We really don't know what will happen or when? Bad for market confidence, currency, investment, etc. Best approach, cross your fingers.

[The Blur]

I still haven't heard a sensible and logical reason for backing the Brexit and I've been watching/ reading the news all day. Can someone who voted out please help?

Not looking to spark off an argument, in fact I'm resigned to this now given its been forced on me despite supporting Remain. Any factual responses to help me feel better will be greatly appreciated. So, no "immigration will come down" or "more money to the NHS".

Thanks

 

I voted Remain but I really enjoyed reading the argument below (it is bit too altruistic but very admirable though) which is good argument as any I have heard from Leave voters.  

 

 

 

The EU is supposed to be an inclusive leveller for the region. Designed to distribute the wealth to bring up countries, end divide, promote peace and unity amongst its members and break down barriers. A liberal organisation with human rights and forward thinking at the forefront of its doings.

Its perfectly understandable why so many people are so upset as it really is something that would safeguard the future of not just us, but everyone in the region.

The reason I voted leave is because the EU in its current format doesnt live up to these ideals. Its an elitist organisation embroiled with large business and corporations that once again, looks after the interests of the few, rather than the many.

You look at the Greece situation, Spanish unemployment, Portugals economic woe, the continuing corruption in Eastern Europe (which plays a pretty large part in migrants leaving the area) and wonder, what about their future? Then look at the lack of action when Russia invaded Ukraine or the uncoordinated and inhumane response to the migrant crisis and it really points out where the priority is.

The way the current EU operates doesnt combine at all with the ideals that remain campaigners are talking about.

I know that a fair number of leave voters did so because they dont like the fact a Polish Deli has opened on their High Street. That is wrong. My hope in voting leave, is that as one of the only net contributors to the organisation, other net contributors dont want to shoulder the burden and the people of those countries follow a similar pattern, forcing a referendum and destabilise the Union in its current format.

Then my hope is the Union dismantles and from it, a new organisation is born. One that recognises that people need to be listened too and will actually not screw the poor for a dollar. A new union that actually does provide hope to everyone and tackles issues like corruption head on, and look to help the people of those countries rather than just encourage the ones that are capable of rebellion to leave and set up shop in another country. I want a Union to form that will be fit for purpose and that I can be proud of and know that it is the right thing to be a part of and not just blindly follow ignoring its flaws.

To me those who voted remain did so with an inward view. They thought of themselves on this shore. They didnt give a thought to the 14 year old Romanian girl forced into the sex industry and left unprotected. No thought was given to the Greek father of 4 who burns his house down with his family inside as the despair of poverty has gotten too much. All this talk of embracing the world was really about protecting the establishment. Protecting the wealth that we enjoy.

My thoughts may well be pie in the sky and in todays world unrealistic. But the world as it was yesterday was not the world I want my kids to grow up in where we just pretend to be concerned for the world and blindly ignore the issues that cause the pain. Today for a moment when I saw the result, I saw my vision and I saw what could happen. I saw that this organisation that has shamelessly fooled us all into thinking it was anything other than what it is, kicked in the teeth and on the ropes. Just for a moment, I thought the world might change for the better.

Then Cameron resigned, Corbyn was dealt a vote of no confidence, those who claimed to be liberal showed their selfish, narrow mindedness, Sturgeon showed her opportunistic nature. The country argued, hurled insults and divided itself further. As quick as my hope arrived it vanished in the bullshit of modern self righteousness (which i'm as guilt of as anyone!).

Normality will resume, the markets will settle and Article 50 probably wont be implemented. It'll be vetoed and this whole thing will look like a soap opera put on to further the careers of a few. We'll be duped into thinking things have changed when really they'll have stayed the same.

Still, maybe we can all admit it was pretty exciting and at least agree on that.

[yorkie1999]

Does seem like the entire underclass has voted leave in some kind of misguided protest. I wonder what society will be like in three or five years time when nothing like what those voters wanted to happen has even come close to happening.

On reflection Cameron quitting was a no brainer and I'm not surprised the slimey twats like Boris wanted him to stay on. Whoever takes on the job now will be trying to please a society with the most bizarre expectations of all time and is almost guaranteed to get the blame when reality hits. All these people thumping their chests and talking about how they were going to put the great back in Great Britain and now they've actually won, the leadership position is like a hot coal, none of the shifty twats want anything to do with it. They know hard times are a'coming.

f**kin anarchy when they realise their doles been stopped and that it's hard work getting up at 5 and shoveling 10 tonnes of coal to earn a pittance instead of lying in bed all morning and breeding. 

[johnny the fox]

As a bitter twisted old bastard with a deep resentment of the young i wanted to fook up their future so i feel pretty good today..

[Countryfox]

I went to pick the missus up from work this morning, and while I was waiting, I got chatting to a couple of hospital cleaners. Both had voted Leave and were delerious with excitement at the prospect of 'things getting back to how it used to be'. I asked them what they meant.

The first replied that she'd be able to get a council house now we're sending all the wogs and pakis (sic) home; the second that Leicester will once again be the centre of the hosiery trade (I used to work at Corahs, yer know, trained overlocker me).

To those of you who would defend the right of such monumentally stupid people to actually have a fvcking vote, let me ask you a question: If you were up in court, would you really be ok with these morons being on the jury?

I'd be very happy to have them on the jury Bucey !! I'd wear my Union Jack t shirt, shave my hair off ... And make sure I mentioned that I used to work at Corahs (which I did by the way) ... And I reckon I might just get away with murder ....

[johnny the fox]

Interesting opinion piece from the Telegraph yesterday.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/06/24/dear-remainers-you-lost-stop-whinging-on-facebook/

 

I can see his point regarding the need to pull together in the aftermath here, but I also think it's a bit rich for the Brexiteers to turn around and ask for help 'to do the best for the country' from the Bremainers now. If they were so certain of a bright future outside of the EU, then they can do the work to build it by themselves, surely? With all the credit that entails if they get it right, and the blame if it goes wrong. The Remainers are under no obligation to 'work with the (silm) majority' in any way. If they actively blocked the progress the Brexiters were trying to make, then that would be a problem...but instead merely doing nothing? 

 

Also, it appears that the Remain side don't have a monopoly on patronisation.

remainers.. not bitter then.. that's the attitude.. lets go mardy because we didn't get our way so we are not going to play anymore.. imagine thinking like this.. lets hope its a fook up and the country goes down the tubes so we can be proved right...dear oh dear..

[DJ Barry Hammond]

I've heard this a lot, " it was a vote against austerity", it's bollox. The plebs aren't voting how they should it must be the Tories fault is just the sort of elitist rubbish that cost the remain vote.. If the EU had given Cameron a few concessions, at least pretended to care what the electorate, of all Europe wanted, none of this would have happened.

Webbo, I'm not suprised you don't agree because it's been a habit of yours for a while, but it's an opinion on what's taken hold and if you looked closer at what I'm suggesting I think many would find it difficult to disagree.

The conditions for the out vote to be as it was were created by the government - flanked by a Labour Party that was now catering for a completely different demographic.

I've not criticised the people voting the way they did. I'm not disagreeing with that choice. But I am pointing to critical outside impacts that contributed to the countries ultimate decision. I'm anylising and casting comment on what factors were key.

[Webbo]

People voted against the EU because they didn't like the EU all this analysing is just excuse making.

[leicsmac]

remainers.. not bitter then.. that's the attitude.. lets go mardy because we didn't get our way so we are not going to play anymore.. imagine thinking like this.. lets hope its a fook up and the country goes down the tubes so we can be proved right...dear oh dear..

 

Put it however you like. They still don't have to play ball - even though probably it's not the best idea going forward.

 

The Leave voters and the campaign that drove them delivered the decision, it's entirely up to them to make sure the conclusion of it all is a good one. And for what it's worth, I hope they do.

[The Doctor]

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2016/jun/24/brexit-big-blow-to-uk-science-say-top-british-scientists?CMP=fb_gu

 

Just glad my career isn't directly in research...