DANGEROUS TIGER Posted 29 July 2018 Share Posted 29 July 2018 6 hours ago, Buce said: I'm certain that some kind of socialism is inevitable. I'm equally certain I am certainly not. Labour are the sole cause of the austerity measures that we suffer from today. They borrowed billions of pounds they had no way of paying back at excessive interest rates That is fact, and now we all suffer from climbing the hole they put us in. Let them back in, and the country will be well and truly -ucked. Mass immigration is also a result of their policies, causing social problems, and public unrest. The very word "socialism", makes me cringe, nowadays, I'm sorry to say. Harold Wilson was the last decent Prime Minister Labour had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lifted*fox Posted 29 July 2018 Share Posted 29 July 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 29 July 2018 Share Posted 29 July 2018 3 hours ago, DANGEROUS TIGER said: I am certainly not. Labour are the sole cause of the austerity measures that we suffer from today. They borrowed billions of pounds they had no way of paying back at excessive interest rates That is fact, and now we all suffer from climbing the hole they put us in. Let them back in, and the country will be well and truly -ucked. Mass immigration is also a result of their policies, causing social problems, and public unrest. The very word "socialism", makes me cringe, nowadays, I'm sorry to say. Harold Wilson was the last decent Prime Minister Labour had. No. This isn't fact, it's compete balls from somebody who clearly doesn't have the foggiest how the economy works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charl91 Posted 29 July 2018 Share Posted 29 July 2018 3 hours ago, DANGEROUS TIGER said: I am certainly not. Labour are the sole cause of the austerity measures that we suffer from today. Labour caused the global financial crisis? Who knew. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alf Bentley Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 9 hours ago, Charl91 said: Labour caused the global financial crisis? Who knew. On the principle that they were in office when the crisis occurred, presumably. On that principle, isn't about time that the Tories got the blame for World War Two? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 3 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said: On the principle that they were in office when the crisis occurred, presumably. On that principle, isn't about time that the Tories got the blame for World War Two? I don't mind Labour but DT is correct about Harold Wilson after all it's the only World Cup we've ever won. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bovril Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 I'm just imagining Chris Morris reading this headline. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 Mixed her up with a call girl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 Sky have been running a poll on Brexit. Given it has 12m customers and they do weight scoring etc their polls generally give similar results to other pollsters. Seems like we might be seeing public support for Brexit waning significantly: Sky Data has released the results of an extensive poll on Brexit. Its headline figure is that 78% of people think the government is doing a bad job of negotiating Brexit, up 23 points from when Sky last polled on this in March. This reflects the findings of many other polls suggesting confidence in how the government is handling Brexit is falling, including ours last week. Here are some of the other poll findings. 65% of people think the government will get a bad Brexit deal, the poll suggests - up 15 points from March. Amongst leave voters, 51% think the government will get a bad deal. People are increasingly likely to think that Brexit will be bad for the economy (52%), the country generally (51%) and themselves personally (42%), the poll suggests. Half the public support a three-option referendum on the final deal, leaving with no deal, or staying in, the poll suggests. Some 40% of people opposed the idea. With a preferential voting system, staying in would win, the poll suggests. Asked to choose between those options, not leaving the EU would be the preferred option for 48%, with 27% preferring to leave the EU with no deal, and 13% choosing the government deal - 8% say they would not vote, 3% don’t know ... Were a referendum to take place asking for second preferences, in the final round remaining in the EU would have a clear lead over no deal Brexit by 59% to 41%, excluding those answering don’t know and those who would not vote. https://news.sky.com/story/public-opinion-is-shifting-sharply-against-brexit-sky-data-poll-reveals-11453220 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 On 29/07/2018 at 12:15, toddybad said: People need to stop equating labour with communism. It is neither right, nor okay, to claim that labour are far left and so the equivalent of the alt-right. Most of the labour programme was mainstream centre policy 30 years ago. Politics has veered rightward since then. Maybe it would help if you didn't have people like Andrew Murray advising the leader, someone who was literally a member of the communist party. No one is saying Labour are communists, but there are some horrible extreme people now working at the top of the organisation and that can't be ignored. If Theresa May had an ex BNP member in her staff I'm sure the left would rightly be critical of it whatever party policy was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Foxin_mad Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 (edited) 5 minutes ago, MattP said: Maybe it would help if you didn't have people like Andrew Murray advising the leader, someone who was literally a member of the communist party. No one is saying Labour are communists, but there are some horrible extreme people now working at the top of the organisation and that can't be ignored. If Theresa May had an ex BNP member in her staff I'm sure the left would rightly be critical of it whatever party policy was. Exactly you are judged by the company you keep. Corbyn and McDonnell are both far left extremists, they hand around with extremist 'friends' and fringe groups, they heap praise on far left extremist governments like Venezuela failing to condemn any actions they take against their people. The party may not be far left but there can be absolutely no doubt that its is being ran by far left extremist lunatics. Edited 30 July 2018 by Foxin_mad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 Deutsche Bank moves euro clearing from London to Frankfurt https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/jul/30/deutsche-bank-moves-euro-clearing-from-london-to-frankfurt?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 3 minutes ago, toddybad said: Deutsche Bank moves euro clearing from London to Frankfurt https://www.theguardian.com/business/2018/jul/30/deutsche-bank-moves-euro-clearing-from-london-to-frankfurt?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard Remember when bankers were wànkers? Could not care less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 2 minutes ago, Strokes said: Remember when bankers were wànkers? Could not care less. True, but jobs is jobs: The London Stock Exchange, which owns the London-based LCH clearing house, has warned that the loss of euro clearing could cost the City 100,000 jobs. Its shares had fallen by more than 1% in early trading in the wake of Deutsche Bank’s announcement. A spokeswoman for Eurex said it had a market share of 8% of euro clearing, up from virtually zero a year ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kopfkino Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 5 minutes ago, Strokes said: Remember when bankers were wànkers? Could not care less. This is really weird 3 minutes ago, toddybad said: True, but jobs is jobs: The London Stock Exchange, which owns the London-based LCH clearing house, has warned that the loss of euro clearing could cost the City 100,000 jobs. Its shares had fallen by more than 1% in early trading in the wake of Deutsche Bank’s announcement. A spokeswoman for Eurex said it had a market share of 8% of euro clearing, up from virtually zero a year ago. This isn't happening Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 5 minutes ago, Kopfkino said: This is really weird This isn't happening I'm sure it is hyperbole but it's still footsteps in the wrong direction. The gulf between what vote leave said then and what Brexiters call for now is stark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Kopfkino Posted 30 July 2018 Share Posted 30 July 2018 4 minutes ago, toddybad said: I'm sure it is hyperbole but it's still footsteps in the wrong direction. The gulf between what vote leave said then and what Brexiters call for now is stark. I just don't like how they've used Rolet's words there when at the time he said himself it won't happen. It's not useful and I find it most frustrating that about 20-25% of each side have gone pure bloodthirsty mental whilst the rest of us sit in the middle just wanting a strong economic relationship and for it to all be over with. 10 hours ago, toddybad said: Sky have been running a poll on Brexit. Given it has 12m customers and they do weight scoring etc their polls generally give similar results to other pollsters. Seems like we might be seeing public support for Brexit waning significantly: Sky Data has released the results of an extensive poll on Brexit. Its headline figure is that 78% of people think the government is doing a bad job of negotiating Brexit, up 23 points from when Sky last polled on this in March. This reflects the findings of many other polls suggesting confidence in how the government is handling Brexit is falling, including ours last week. Here are some of the other poll findings. 65% of people think the government will get a bad Brexit deal, the poll suggests - up 15 points from March. Amongst leave voters, 51% think the government will get a bad deal. People are increasingly likely to think that Brexit will be bad for the economy (52%), the country generally (51%) and themselves personally (42%), the poll suggests. Half the public support a three-option referendum on the final deal, leaving with no deal, or staying in, the poll suggests. Some 40% of people opposed the idea. With a preferential voting system, staying in would win, the poll suggests. Asked to choose between those options, not leaving the EU would be the preferred option for 48%, with 27% preferring to leave the EU with no deal, and 13% choosing the government deal - 8% say they would not vote, 3% don’t know ... Were a referendum to take place asking for second preferences, in the final round remaining in the EU would have a clear lead over no deal Brexit by 59% to 41%, excluding those answering don’t know and those who would not vote. https://news.sky.com/story/public-opinion-is-shifting-sharply-against-brexit-sky-data-poll-reveals-11453220 I only just saw this. It seems that the ERG's craziness is finally beginning to be opposed by the public. Them telling everyone how bad May's Brexit (don't see how it's so opposed) is has been heard as how bad Brexit is. They could save Brexit by showing some pragmatism and understanding there are other ways but I somewhat doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heathrow fox Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 15 hours ago, MattP said: Maybe it would help if you didn't have people like Andrew Murray advising the leader, someone who was literally a member of the communist party. No one is saying Labour are communists, but there are some horrible extreme people now working at the top of the organisation and that can't be ignored. If Theresa May had an ex BNP member in her staff I'm sure the left would rightly be critical of it whatever party policy was. The BNP are a openly racist party who would start deporting people based on their race and religion tomorrow if they could.It’s very different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 This could all get quite interesting if the labour policy ends up changing. If public support for no deal, and Brexit in general, continues to wane, it'll really put the Tories in a difficult position when the rest of parliament is calling for a second referendum. Corbyn's Brexit policy likely to be challenged at Labour conference https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/31/corbyn-brexit-policy-likely-to-be-challenged-at-labour-conference?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 8 minutes ago, toddybad said: This could all get quite interesting if the labour policy ends up changing. If public support for no deal, and Brexit in general, continues to wane, it'll really put the Tories in a difficult position when the rest of parliament is calling for a second referendum. Corbyn's Brexit policy likely to be challenged at Labour conference https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/31/corbyn-brexit-policy-likely-to-be-challenged-at-labour-conference?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard You’re dreaming if you think there will be a second referendum I think. The only way that will happen is if May is toppled and it’s part of a manifesto of a newly elected government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breadandcheese Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 9 minutes ago, Strokes said: You’re dreaming if you think there will be a second referendum I think. The only way that will happen is if May is toppled and it’s part of a manifesto of a newly elected government. I think there are some big dangers coming up for May. Barnier has rejected her Chequers plan and it is looking increasingly likely that we won't get a deal done before March 29th. Two things could happen, both of which will threaten May's leadership. If May offers more concessions to the EU beyond her Chequers plan that could bring about votes of no confidence from brexiteers amid accusations of a sellout by the PM. If May looks to extend the brexit deadline so that it appears to the brexiteers that she would rather have a "bad" deal than no deal. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Strokes said: You’re dreaming if you think there will be a second referendum I think. The only way that will happen is if May is toppled and it’s part of a manifesto of a newly elected government. Perhaps. The fact the tory quislings bottled it in the face of a possible vote of confidence/general election, putting party before country, has put the anti Brexit fight in parliament on the back foot somewhat. You have to assume those people would vote for a deal as they didn't your with their conscience last time. The fact is that parliamentarians don't really support Brexit though. They're still doing it because they have to do it. If no deal looks likely (and let's be honest may will try to conceded everything to avoid that so long as she can spin the concessions as not concessions) then it'll be hard for mps to accept. Besides, despite remainer moaning, we've embarked on two years of negotiations. Leavers have had two years to give us a viable plan and have failed. Vote leave campaigned of a ticket of getting a good deal, not no deal. Most Brexiters were talking about the Norway option during the campaign but now claim that would be something in opposition to the will of the people. If public opinion significantly shifts against Brexit, is it genuinely democratic to force it through without the public having the right to confirm it's wishes? Edited 31 July 2018 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 2 hours ago, toddybad said: This could all get quite interesting if the labour policy ends up changing. If public support for no deal, and Brexit in general, continues to wane, it'll really put the Tories in a difficult position when the rest of parliament is calling for a second referendum. Corbyn's Brexit policy likely to be challenged at Labour conference https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jul/31/corbyn-brexit-policy-likely-to-be-challenged-at-labour-conference?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard Two questions for those who support a second referendum? 1. Why should I believe that those who refuse to respect the result of the first referendum would then decide to respect the second one if it went to leave again? 2. When would the third referendum be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 (edited) Meanwhile, more "criticisms of Israel" - and this guy is a member of the NEC. https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/jul/31/corbyn-ally-says-jewish-trump-fanatics-make-up-antisemitism-claims Quote Corbyn ally says 'Jewish Trump fanatics making up' antisemitism claims Labour MP calls for NEC member Peter Willsman to be suspended after comments are recorded One of Jeremy Corbyn’s allies on Labour’s ruling body has been recorded saying that Jewish “Trump fanatics” are “making up” some of the allegations of antisemitism in the party. Peter Willsman, a member of the party’s national executive committee, was taped at a meeting this month when the NEC refused to adopt in full the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance’s definition of antisemitism. Willsman said he would “not be lectured” by Jewish supporters of the US president “making up duff information without any evidence at all”. As others attending the meeting asked Willsman to stop speaking, he continued, raising his voice to say: “I think we should ask the ... rabbis: where is your evidence of severe and widespread antisemitism in this party?” Later in the recording, released on Monday by the Jewish Chronicle, Willsman could be heard asking members of the NEC to raise their hands if they had witnessed antisemitism in the party. In an apparent response to some raising their hands, he replied: “I’m amazed. I’ve certainly never seen any.” Edited 31 July 2018 by MattP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buce Posted 31 July 2018 Share Posted 31 July 2018 20 minutes ago, MattP said: Meanwhile, more "criticisms of Israel" - and this guy is a member of the NEC. https://www.theguardian.com/news/2018/jul/31/corbyn-ally-says-jewish-trump-fanatics-make-up-antisemitism-claims What exactly is anti-semitic about any of that? Does being Jewish give protected status from criticism now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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