Maguire

[Will1981]

2 minutes ago, ROB-THE-BLUE said:

£60m + Smalling

I doubt we want Smalling we are only being linked with ball playing defenders.

[Foxxed]

18 minutes ago, BenTheFox said:

If £70 million + comes in for Maguire, we'd regret not selling him. 

We don't need the money. But we do need a solid ball playing defence for Puel's preferred style. And Harry is one of the best ball playing defenders there is. I'd regret not having a player best suited to Claude's style.

[SouthStandUpperTier]

1 minute ago, BenTheFox said:

And the likes of Brentford and Southampton (up until recently) have used it very successfully here. 

I think the summer 2016 transfer window was a wake-up call for our club. We realised, despite our title win, that established big name players still didn't want to come, and those players we turned into established big names (mostly) wanted to move on to bigger clubs.

[Stinkenzo]

60m + Smalling Jones and Rojo.

 

Smalling Jones Rojo Evans Benkovic Soyunc Morgan Benaloane Johnson should probably just be about enough.

[Sunbury Fox]

1 minute ago, BenTheFox said:

And the likes of Brentford and Southampton (up until recently) have used it very successfully here. 

Southampton almost getting relegated last season shows the high risks involved, though. This approach works best for the likes of Sevilla, Monaco and Dortmund. The difference between those clubs and us is massive, though. They have more history, are pretty much guaranteed to qualify for Europe each year and in the case of Monaco and Sevilla are really attractive places to live (and in Monaco's case a tax haven, which suits players on their ridiculous wages).

[ClaphamFox]

6 minutes ago, SouthStandUpperTier said:

But that's how a lot of clubs our size operate. Buy low, sell high. Buy low again. And so on. It's risky business, and you don't really get any attachment to the players as they're in and out the door quickly. But as I said, many clubs, particularly on the continent, use this model successfully.

It's basically the model for any team that isn't challenging for domestic titles and playing in the Champions League. The best players will only see us as their ultimate destination (as opposed to a stop along the way) if we're consistently in the top 4/5 in the Premier League and are playing regularly in the Champions League. 

[Gerard]

3 minutes ago, SouthStandUpperTier said:

But that's how a lot of clubs our size operate. Buy low, sell high. Buy low again. And so on. It's risky business, and you don't really get any attachment to the players as they're in and out the door quickly. But as I said, many clubs, particularly on the continent, use this model successfully.

 

I'm more than happy to use this model. 

 

Players will always want to make the step up to more elite clubs if they're good enough and unless we make the step up with them as a club they'll want to go. If your scouting is excellent then this shouldn't be a concern and as a club we're in the ideal position to buy some of the best young players in the world and develop them as we're not overly relegation threatened and we haven't got the pressure and expectation of European qualification or winning trophies.

 

If you consistently buy well you don't have to worry about making a profit as the opportunity to make a profit will present itself often and usually on your terms. Keep buying the best young talent, keep selling them to clubs who can't afford to develop players and want the finished article. Keep making a profit and get a reputation for a university for young players to graduate and then at some point the dream is to keep a group of these players together and start to challenge the elite. 

[BenTheFox]

3 minutes ago, Sunbury Fox said:

Southampton almost getting relegated last season shows the high risks involved, though. This approach works best for the likes of Sevilla, Monaco and Dortmund. The difference between those clubs and us is massive, though. They have more history, are pretty much guaranteed to qualify for Europe each year and in the case of Monaco and Sevilla are really attractive places to live (and in Monaco's case a tax haven, which suits players on their ridiculous wages).

Southampton's downfall came more with appointing an inadequate manager in Pellegrino and giving him too long, as well as not filling obvious gaps in the squad. I honestly don't believe it came about by just selling their best players. 

[Gerard]

6 minutes ago, Sunbury Fox said:

Southampton almost getting relegated last season shows the high risks involved, though. This approach works best for the likes of Sevilla, Monaco and Dortmund. The difference between those clubs and us is massive, though. They have more history, are pretty much guaranteed to qualify for Europe each year and in the case of Monaco and Sevilla are really attractive places to live (and in Monaco's case a tax haven, which suits players on their ridiculous wages).

 

All but six clubs in the Premier League fear relegation. Southampton have been the benchmark for that model but 70% of the league is only one poor season away from relegation.

[Sunbury Fox]

Just now, Gerard said:

 

All but six clubs in the Premier League fear relegation. Southampton have been the benchmark for that model but 70% of the league is only one poor season away from relegation.

Yes,  but that's not my point.  My point is that looking to sell high and buy low works best where a club is really attractive to the best young players. The clubs that I've mentioned are attractive for the reasons I give above. In our case, however, we won't get the top young talent because as you say we could easily be relegated in any season and are unlikely to get into Europe, unless the big 6 cartel mop up both cups too. So the players we attract are more likely to be rough diamonds rather than guaranteed stars of the future. So the risks are way higher for us.

[ALC Fox]

I think the club being after 2 CBs is to cover our backs in case a Drinkwater style situation happens with Maguire, i.e. a last minute approach with the player handing in a transfer request.

 

If it doesn't happen, then we have ample cover and real strength in depth in the position, and we can still offload players like Benny to a club overseas and Johnson on loan to the Championship or League One.

 

Rudkin's learning, I think.

[STUHILL]

We know that Man U will be buying a CB in this window and I do think Maguire is high up on their list. 

 

I imagine Mourinho is one stubborn git and will happily pressure his club to spend big on a player like Maguire. He has a history of it. 

 

I think the owners would cave at around £70million plus add-ons, which is a huge fee! 

 

If Maguire has declared a strong interest in moving, then there could be some legs with this one, especially with us signing 2 CB's...

 

Be gutted if he did go, as he really will be a top player for years! If he doesn't go this window though, he would definitely be off in Jan or next Summer. 

 

I'd like to hold on to him 12 more months but anything around £70m and over, and I could understand the owners accepting that. 

[Gevans_97]

Remember Puel stating he wanted to build his team around Maguire? 

 

Granted this was before the WC and performances have changed his value but considering the owners' usual stance on transfers like this I am hopeful he stays, along with bringing in Soyuncu that's a very nice (potential) back 3.

[StriderHiryu]

5 minutes ago, Gerard said:

 

I'm more than happy to use this model. 

 

Players will always want to make the step up to more elite clubs if they're good enough and unless we make the step up with them as a club they'll want to go. If your scouting is excellent then this shouldn't be a concern and as a club we're in the ideal position to buy some of the best young players in the world and develop them as we're not overly relegation threatened and we haven't got the pressure and expectation of European qualification or winning trophies.

 

If you consistently buy well you don't have to worry about making a profit as the opportunity to make a profit will present itself often and usually on your terms. Keep buying the best young talent, keep selling them to clubs who can't afford to develop players and want the finished article. Keep making a profit and get a reputation for a university for young players to graduate and then at some point the dream is to keep a group of these players together and start to challenge the elite. 

Good post.

 

I made a thread about this in the main forum on this topic. I think it's realistically the only "proven" model you can use to help drive a sustainable business behind the scenes to help grow a club over time in the moden era of FFP. We have smaller revenues that the clubs above us so in order to beat those clubs we have to have a longer term plan to grow the clubs stature, revenues and success over a number of years.

 

- Hire a manager with proven experience in introducing young talent into the first team and developing players.

- Invest in a world class training facility.

- Scour the continent and country to find young players with high potential and metrics that are superior to players in their age group.

- Play a team with a number of young players supported by 3/4 veteran players in key positions to make sure it doesn't go completely south.

- Sell those players on for a massive profit which covers both the cost of players that we sign that don't make it and that can go into the club coffers to allow for reinvestment in stadium, academy, commerical activities, etc.

- Over time continue to do this to reguarly compete for Europe, then for the Champions League, then who knows?

 

Like you, I am personally quite happy with the approach and in fact prefer it to "buying the title." Man City played breathtaking football and got to 100 points, an incredible achievement. But if you've outspent very other club in Europe in terms of net spend you'd expect to win it. That's why our title was the definitive one to win. We earned it, we didnt buy it!

[Nod.E]

36 minutes ago, BenTheFox said:

Not if we've got sufficient replacements lined up. He'll go at some point and we'll never get a fee that good again. 

Who cares?

Why on earth are fans so bothered about fees?

We don't see it and the owners don't need it. 

I don't care if United offer £500m, I want to see Maguire in a Leicester shirt next season.

[ALC Fox]

2 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

We know that Man U will be buying a CB in this window and I do think Maguire is high up on their list. 

 

I imagine Mourinho is one stubborn git and will happily pressure his club to spend big on a player like Maguire. He has a history of it. 

 

I think the owners would cave at around £70million plus add-ons, which is a huge fee! 

 

If Maguire has declared a strong interest in moving, then there could be some legs with this one, especially with us signing 2 CB's...

 

Be gutted if he did go, as he really will be a top player for years! If he doesn't go this window though, he would definitely be off in Jan or next Summer. 

 

I'd like to hold on to him 12 more months but anything around £70m and over, and I could understand the owners accepting that. 

I agree if we're only about maximising the money we get for him, this summer might be the best time.

 

Next summer he may not have that World Cup premium. Not sure if TV rights will contribute to a huge increase in transfer fees again or not.

 

In 2 summers' time he may well have lifted the European Championship trophy with England, when his value could go through the roof once again, but I don't think he'd still be with us by then regardless.

 

However, from a footballing perspective, I'd want to keep him as long as possible. I don't get the 'he ain't that good' argument. He's just won our Player of the Year and Player's Player of the Year awards and plenty of pundits and ex-pros seem to be intimating that he'll go right to the tippy top.

[Nick]

Whilst the two new defenders are welcome additions - it does make me nervy that Slab Head is a goner to the Reds. 

[moore_94]

£25m and Martial please

[Walshie is God]

1 minute ago, Swan Lesta said:

Whilst the two new defenders are welcome additions - it does make me nervy that Slab Head is a goner to the Reds. 

Seems likely although mercury reporting harry still not for sale

[Saxondale]

3 minutes ago, Nod.E said:

Why on earth are fans so bothered about fees?

We don't see it and the owners don't need it. 

I don't care if United offer £500m, I want to see Maguire in a Leicester shirt next season.

Yes, yes, yes and yes. And yes some more.

 

All this "good business" crap does my head in.

 

We could sell Vardy for £500bn, but £500bn in bundles of cash ain't gonna score many goals.

[BenTheFox]

4 minutes ago, Nod.E said:

Who cares?

Why on earth are fans so bothered about fees?

We don't see it and the owners don't need it. 

I don't care if United offer £500m, I want to see Maguire in a Leicester shirt next season.

Well if that's the case then how come we're in the black as far as net spend is concerned this window? If money is no object then surely we'd have spent good money on another creative player seeing as we've just lost our creative ever? You also have to bare in mind that we've got a new training ground and stadium expansion to cover. We're not the bottomless pit that you and others seem to think we are. 

[Bluearmyfox28]

We won’t sell now. With the statements the club have made about him not being for sale etc. The amount of sh*t Puel & the owners would get off the fans would be unreal selling this late. I think if it’s to happen he’ll go in January. Be very very surprised if we sold up now.

[STUHILL]

1 minute ago, Bluearmyfox28 said:

We won’t sell now. With the statements the club have made about him not being for sale etc. The amount of sh*t Puel & the owners would get off the fans would be unreal selling this late. I think if it’s to happen he’ll go in January. Be very very surprised if we sold up now.

Puel also said a few days ago that he was happy with the balance of the squad and would only sign someone else, if we lose one of our valuable players...

[psychonaut]

4 minutes ago, Bluearmyfox28 said:

We won’t sell now. With the statements the club have made about him not being for sale etc. The amount of sh*t Puel & the owners would get off the fans would be unreal selling this late. I think if it’s to happen he’ll go in January. Be very very surprised if we sold up now.

The club are hardly going to make statements that he is for sale. Saying a player is not for sale is meaningless in todays market. Football is unfortunately a business which means every player has a price. 

[Fox in the North]

He could always follow up last season with an equally impressive second season. He’d still be in a long term contract and I’d imagine we’d make similar money from him. I’d be very surprised if Maguire’s form dips drastically this season if he plays for us.