Clearout

[mozartfox]

1 minute ago, fuchsntf said:

Until yesterday..his small cameo comeback secured the RB position,and he was playing well...

I defo don't want ,him to be covering us next season.He was a top RB,in our great decent period.But like Morgan,who's had also a good season,we have to move on!!  CB is covered,but we need another RB,if we want to utilise Pereira in a more forward role....Amartey coming back will still mean we need cover!!

Top post!   We have to move on.   

[Cadno'r Cymoedd]

1 hour ago, coolhandfox said:

To be fair he tried to play a few forward balls that the fans have be calling out for.

 

I think Puel felt he had to rest Ndidi and Mendy as they have had a heavy workload during December.

 

With Iborra in Spain,  Silva looking to get a move home to Portugal, that only left Hamza, James and King.

Stop talking sense. 

Edited 7 January 2019 by Cadno'r Cymoedd

[Wdywd]

The biggest thing for me is we have got a serious problem in midfield if no one else comes in. We're an injury away from Matty James starting Premier League games again.

 

People getting a bit carried away with wanting to sack 15 players this morning but most of them can slot in as cover in the first team and it would be fine. But in midfield it does not look great

[RowlattsFox]

3 minutes ago, mozartfox said:

They were 3 years younger and more mobile.   That back 4 yesterday was hideously immobile.   

To be fair they weren't that mobile then.

 

It just acts as a reminder how perfectly that season went and how certain players were at a level they could never imagine. We won the league with Okazaki as our support striker despite him being generally abysmal in front of goal.

[fuchsntf]

3 minutes ago, STUHILL said:

Why out of interest?

 

I get the players themselves need to take some responsibility but Puel takes no responsibility for these talented players under-performing when they have performed well before/elsewhere?

 

I think as much as there is an OTT Puel bashing/blaming going on, there is also an equal amount of turning a blind eye to many of Puel's faults/failings. 

 

Oh Puel,like any manager has is failings....But he can't  as any manager,turn the experienced players into PL players...that comes from within the player.

To be fair,I thought Iborra especially,should of got more gametime!!!  ..Silva honestly I have no idea,how we could of tried to integrate him any better.

I actually thought our 1st game against Manutd,he played well...then he stuttered in every other showing!!

Plus many players don't or find it difficult to  adapt to the PL,some decent players with top CVs,just don't cut it...

The club and Puel had to give them this first part of the season....and obviously it's hurt us and left massive empty spaces,in the front 6..

When players miss the cut,you can't put it on the manager,especially when he gave them chances and tried slightly different tactics,to get them going!!I

Puel got full responses across the defence.He's persevering rightly with Ndidi,and rekindled Mendys career at Leicester.So he's had 6 players performing..

Include Amartey before injury...Not bad in a rebuilding phase,when expected experienced top buys mis-fired!!

It's a shame that those mis-firing were going to be the new engine-room!!

[hackneyfox]

31 minutes ago, Wdywd said:

The biggest thing for me is we have got a serious problem in midfield if no one else comes in. We're an injury away from Matty James starting Premier League games again.

 

People getting a bit carried away with wanting to sack 15 players this morning but most of them can slot in as cover in the first team and it would be fine. But in midfield it does not look great

Most of them quite clearly can't slot in as cover, they are so far off the quality of the first eleven (even an unbalanced first eleven).

Who do you think out of those 15 or so actually deserves to be kept?

[oadby.fox]

41 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

At the beginning of the season,not now!!!  Iborra, Silva,were big previous buys where many ,believed they would kick on and be our midfield stalwarts,

with Ndidi. And to be honest Ndidi has been struggling...

Diabate young lad newbuy, was thought to be future potential,after starting well..

...Nacho This high. Cost youngster,was ready to make this season is break!!

5 players not stepping up,can't be put at Puel s door...

 

Then...

We /Puel was never going to be given a big budget for players until,others could be moved on.Ghezzal  was a fill in,and cover.nothing more.!!

And he doesn't deserve the debasing comments he gets!!

player recruitment needs,was never going to be realised this Season,after the club not Puel could find no interested parties for many of our

surplus to requirements players...

I understand that many expected that Iborra and Silva would kick on (including myself) but they haven't and you could even argue that they have never really been giving much of a chance or sustained run in the side. It seems as though we are now looking to move them on which is why they are now part of the 'clear out' - The three players I mentioned (Shinji,James,King) were the ones which we should have moved on in the summer.

 

My post wasn't really aimed at attacking Puel but rather those who are in charge of the transfer dealings. Having said that, I am sure that Ghezzal and Diabate are both Puel signings, but I suppose that can be balanced against the signing of Ricardo who has been great. Since you brought it up though, there should be question marks about why Ndidi seems to be gradually getting worse under Puel's management and why both Iborra and Silva have deteriorated to the extent that the latter goes from being a key player for Portugal in their Euro win to not being able to make the bench for cup ties or prem games. Perhaps they just didn't settle in England or it was something else - who knows?

 

As for Ghezzal, we could have gotten a better player who was more prepared for the prem for around the same price I reckon. He gets a lot of flack because we all knew he wasn't going to cut the mustard when he joined. We baulked at the figure and it's annoying that we basically picked up another club's deadwood. I'd much rather have a homegrown U23 player in the squad coming in and making mistakes but at least developing and increasing their market worth. With Ghezzal we know that he probably won't develop and at 26, should be in his prime. Bar a miraculous turn in form, do you really think we will recoup any of the money we spent on him? Do you think he will make any major contributions by the time he leaves?

[Wdywd]

Just now, hackneyfox said:

Most of them quite clearly can't slot in as cover, they are so far off the quality of the first eleven (even an unbalanced first eleven).

Who do you think out of those 15 or so actually deserves to be kept?

But when they have slotted in they've mostly been fine, especially the back 4. Morgan has been playing well, Evans has been fine when he's played and did really well against Everton. As did Simpson who folk were calling to get a new contract about three days ago. I don't really have a problem with Fuchs being Chilwell's back up.

 

Kelechi's confidence is in bits but as back up strikers in the PL go it's tough to get good ones and I wouldn't be that surprised if he turned out good in the end (possibly not here at this point admittedly).

 

From the list in the OP Iborra and Silva both wouldn't be disasters if they played but are clearly already leaving. In fact everyone on here has been calling for at least one of them to play loads. Amartey is perfectly fine. As is Gray who is still young and fine to have as an option even if you don't want him to start, he offers something different.

 

The others I broadly agree with, but they aren't all huge disasters. Mostly they just don't fit or are declining, but it doesn't mean they would blow up the team if they had to start a league game

[hackneyfox]

Morgan has done well but does get caught out occasionally and for me is standing in the way of younger payers.

I don't believe anyone thinks Evans should leave.

Simpson is incapable of getting forward so isn't cover for Ricardo.

Fuchs can cross a ball but is now even slower getting back than he was.

Gray has now been given so many chances I believe it's time for him to be replaced and sold if we could get a decent price.

Iheanacho has gone backwards and it's probably best for all if he was replaced.

[The Doctor]

2 hours ago, coolhandfox said:

To be fair he tried to play a few forward balls that the fans have be calling out for.

 

I think Puel felt he had to rest Ndidi and Mendy as they have had a heavy workload during December.

 

With Iborra in Spain,  Silva looking to get a move home to Portugal, that only left Hamza, James and King.

Let's be clear then, if your options beyond Mendy and Ndidi are a 21 year old only just into double figures for competitive appearances for us, a bloke who's been fit for 4 months in the last 4 years and a player who last had anything to offer the first team when Mitt Romney was a serious presidential candidate, you probably shouldn't be selling a 3 time Europa League winner and a European championship winner

[foxes21]

It will probably take three transfer windows to complete the necessary clearout. 

 

January 18/19: Iborra, Silva, King,

Diabate (albeit only on loan according to the reports)

 

Summer: Simpson, Morgan, Benalouane, Fuchs & Okazaki are all out of contract. Hopefully we can ship out James, Ghezzal, Kapustka & Slimani. 

 

January 19/20: Gray, Iheanacho.

 

Yes it was harsh including Amartey as he is versatile and pretty consistent.

 

Edited 7 January 2019 by foxes21

[Twitcher]

50 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

 

Oh Puel,like any manager has is failings....But he can't  as any manager,turn the experienced players into PL players...that comes from within the player.

To be fair,I thought Iborra especially,should of got more gametime!!!  ..Silva honestly I have no idea,how we could of tried to integrate him any better.

I actually thought our 1st game against Manutd,he played well...then he stuttered in every other showing!!

Plus many players don't or find it difficult to  adapt to the PL,some decent players with top CVs,just don't cut it...

The club and Puel had to give them this first part of the season....and obviously it's hurt us and left massive empty spaces,in the front 6..

When players miss the cut,you can't put it on the manager,especially when he gave them chances and tried slightly different tactics,to get them going!!I

Puel got full responses across the defence.He's persevering rightly with Ndidi,and rekindled Mendys career at Leicester.So he's had 6 players performing..

Include Amartey before injury...Not bad in a rebuilding phase,when expected experienced top buys mis-fired!!

It's a shame that those mis-firing were going to be the new engine-room!!

Silva ran the show against Fleetwood in the replay at our place. Looked a class above everyone else; notwithstanding it was against weaker opposition. I think it might have worked with him if he'd been given a run of games. 

[LittlethorpeFox]

we do need a clear out of sorts but its a bit odd the hysteria people get in about some urgently required clearout after one game.

[lcfc sheff]

So fickle and immature, react on a game by game basis rather than seeing the bigger picture.

[Nicolo Barella]

We don't need 25 players of starting quality, that would be silly. But, what we do need are decent squad players with a good attitude and low wage.

Amartey is a prime example - I would not want him starting often, but he has always put in a shift and looked good at times, especially when given a few games in a row, so I am very happy with him as a backup 5thCM/5thCB/2ndRB.

Ghezzal is another - mediocre at best on the wings, better as a backup No 10. In case Maddison is injured, we'd have a good option in the hole who works hard when given oppurtunities.

Diabate may yet improve given time, happy to loan him out to Caen for the season and see what he makes of himself.

But the likes of Benalouane (attitude - whiny, wage - high, quality - none) need to go.

In addition, there are many relics from our old squad that need shifting too, some at greater pace than others (Simpson, Morgan, Fuchs, King, James [if we can get rid of him at all that would be an impressive feat ], Okazaki).

Lastly, there are the players we signed (mostly for the first team, some as prospects) that haven't worked out. Here lie Cabbage, Iheanacho, Gray, Silva, Iborra, and Slimani too if reports from Turkey are anything to go by. 

 

Revamping the squad will be a massive undertaking, and I am happy the board has picked Puel as the man for the job. I hope we try to promote some squad positions from the academy if we can, and manage to sprinkle some experience in there as well after eventually (not necessarily this summer) losing most of the title winning squad, but I'm sure it will work out decently. 

[peach0000]

It’s bizzare how quick people’s opinion on players change, after Everton Simpson was the best thing since sliced bread, one loss later he’s a lost cause and should be sold. I actually want to give up with this forum sometimes.

[Babylon]

22 minutes ago, lcfc sheff said:

So fickle and immature, react on a game by game basis rather than seeing the bigger picture.

It's not wrong though, quite honestly this has been talked about for some time and clearly what we're trying to do. Hence running down all the contracts, telling King he's surpless. Trying to move on Silva and Iborra, the club know it's needs to happen.

[UniFox21]

Iborra has gone

 

9million, at a 3mill loss from when we signed him. Isn't bad considering his age.

Edited 7 January 2019 by UniFox21

[lcfc sheff]

13 minutes ago, Babylon said:

It's not wrong though, quite honestly this has been talked about for some time and clearly what we're trying to do. Hence running down all the contracts, telling King he's surpless. Trying to move on Silva and Iborra, the club know it's needs to happen.

I don’t disagree with the most of it, but don’t like how Morgan and Simpson get suddenly binned off after the game before we were only speaking highly of them! 

 

The clear out is obviously already beginning and has been for sometime, not sure we need to keep bringing it up. Puel has made it very clear his intentions.

[Babylon]

7 minutes ago, lcfc sheff said:

I don’t disagree with the most of it, but don’t like how Morgan and Simpson get suddenly binned off after the game before we were only speaking highly of them! 

 

The clear out is obviously already beginning and has been for sometime, not sure we need to keep bringing it up. Puel has made it very clear his intentions.

Morgan is still a starter, I'd keep him. But I've not changed my mind on Simpson, we already have right back back up and Simpson isn't getting any younger.

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

Matty James contracted to us until August 21.

[lcfc sheff]

25 minutes ago, Babylon said:

Morgan is still a starter, I'd keep him. But I've not changed my mind on Simpson, we already have right back back up and Simpson isn't getting any younger.

When against the big teams there’s few better than Simpson when trying to be defensive. But I can understand age being a factor although I don’t particularly like the notion of moving a player on simply because of age rather than ability.

[Babylon]

1 minute ago, lcfc sheff said:

When against the big teams there’s few better than Simpson when trying to be defensive. But I can understand age being a factor although I don’t particularly like the notion of moving a player on simply because of age rather than ability.

He's third choice, even against the big boys he won't play because it'll be Ricardo. He's basically an emergency option and we're looking after the younger asset who will have value in him going forward in Amarety.

[coolhandfox]

2 hours ago, The Doctor said:

Let's be clear then, if your options beyond Mendy and Ndidi are a 21 year old only just into double figures for competitive appearances for us, a bloke who's been fit for 4 months in the last 4 years and a player who last had anything to offer the first team when Mitt Romney was a serious presidential candidate, you probably shouldn't be selling a 3 time Europa League winner and a European championship winner

While we have managed it for half a season.

 

Yep let keep paying Silva for another 6 months for nothing, the exact some thing you were moaning about James for.

 

He wants gone, the club want him gone.

[Wdywd]

40 minutes ago, Mark 'expert' Lawrenson said:

Matty James contracted to us until August 21.

That one was by far the weirdest of all the thank you contracts we handed out