Players not good enough to take us forward under any manager.

[Lesta Legend]

It's like the stupidity of continuing with Brexit (as it stands), the fact people don't see something that is being poorly implemented while dividing half the fan base isn't for the greater good. It wont end well.

[volpeazzurro]

1 hour ago, cityfanlee23 said:

Can't help but think we have a massive amount of players on the books who regardless of manager simply are not good enough. 

Morgan - So inconsistent and any other manager would be trying to retire or sell him, he's lucky Puel is so loyal to him, disgraceful to hear he ran past puel to celebrate with others for his goal, Puel is the only manager that would still be playing him week in week out. 
Simpson - Really one dimensional and his defensive solidness really is not what it used to be. 
Mendy - Great first few games and has had his moments but generally he's just average at best, him and Ndidi together just do not compliment eachother. 
Iheanacho - Too many chances now, 10 mins left, you're a CF and you're losing the game, you should be up and down the touchline making sure the manager sees you, instead he's sat on the bench in his coat without his boots tied up or pads on. Just get rid. 

Okazaki - Past it

Silva - Probably needs more chances as he's proven quality, but everytime he has played he's generally been off the pace, so unless we have a new manager with a master plan, can't see him doing much at this level. 

Fuchs - Past it, been below average when he's had a chance this season, either his passing or his defending lets him down every game he's played. 

King - Time has come. 

James - Time has come. 

Jakupovic - Waste of a wage 

 

Inconsistent players

Gray - Did well today for his goal, but can't help but wish he did it more often, shows flashes of brilliance but often just gets marked out of the game.

Chilwell - He's decent enough but massively overrated IMO, i'd take 50m for him if city offered it, his defending is OK and his attacking is OK. Very rarely does a cross connect and more often than not he turns and passes backwards. 

 

The last 2 and possibly Silva could be good under a new manager, but generally speaking I really think the problem goes deeper than this. Our bench is piss poor and many of our first team players just cannot adapt any other style of play than hoofball. 

Absolutely well done, your title ironically  brings some truth and realism to the situation as does you're content.

 

Perhaps a certain Mr Klopp could have also  claimed this when he first arrived in Liverpool in 2015 and he would have been right too. It took time for him to evaluate his squad too yet, like Guadiola, we knew what his preferred style was going to be but, why would he want to throw the baby out with the bath water before bringing in new players including bringing youth through. There were some dissenting impatient doubting voices weren't there if I remember,  where are they now? Though there are still the know it all superior armchair stalwarts who come out of the woodwork after one loss against Man City.

 

Klopp has, admittedly, since then spent big and we're certainly not going to match that budget, but there is more than one way,  we should know,  we've done it once! I don't think that way can quite happen again but, after jettisoning some of the players you've rightly highlighted to recoup some money, a steady , more targeted and more youthful recruitment campaign, not unsimilar to very recent recruiting efforts can bring better long term results. 

 

I think your evaluation is facing up to facts and departs from the well trodden paths of modern football fans of wanting success and wanting it now. Is that me saying that our incumbent manager is the Messiah? No, far from it, but neither does the answer lay in the hiring and firing model of the numerous other clubs around us who, for all the money spent, has either left them stagnating or fighting relegation with growing mountains of debt. Every player like Maguire, Ndidi, Pereira, Chilwell, Maddison, Benkovic, Soyuncu, Barnes can if needed, though reluctantly, be sold to buy two or more further players for the cause eventually if deemed necessary. The Silva, Slimani and Iborra's of this world can't and never will do, though I do recognise the need for older heads at times in a team, but boy, do you have to be even more careful which ones to choose.

 

The problem is, that you have to have some patience whilst dealing with the inconsistency whilst youth and inexperienced players learn and progress. Rodgers, Silva, Wagner, Howe et al, at this moment in time are a risk at best, for all the reasons stated above, to be able to get a better tune out of this group, it's just expensive, inpatient wishful thinking to my mind. For all Puels faults, because all the names above have known faults as well, unless something drastically changes,  I see no need to depart from what seems like a viable progressive plan for the moment.

 

For all the mistakes and some good things I saw today, what I didn't see were players that weren't playing for their manager. That must really upset some people in the media and some of our own on here. Keep the Faith mi ducks!

[Cheshfox]

The squad is not good enough some of youngsters have promise but it will take time which we wont have certainly in the premiership unless we sign some decent senior players soon.

 

[Sol thewall Bamba]

Our players in the main are slightly above average.

[bfox]

One theory could be that, Imagine winning the league, rubbing shoulders with some massive clubs and players in the CL, being part of the biggest sporting story in the world and admired by everyone. Then a season or so later you are being managed and told what to do by Puel 

[Dan LCFC]

Got to agree with the OP. Don't think Puel is the answer but we seriously need to phase some of these players out.

[MPH]

3 hours ago, cityfanlee23 said:

Can't help but think we have a massive amount of players on the books who regardless of manager simply are not good enough. 

Morgan - So inconsistent and any other manager would be trying to retire or sell him, he's lucky Puel is so loyal to him, disgraceful to hear he ran past puel to celebrate with others for his goal, Puel is the only manager that would still be playing him week in week out. 
Simpson - Really one dimensional and his defensive solidness really is not what it used to be. 
Mendy - Great first few games and has had his moments but generally he's just average at best, him and Ndidi together just do not compliment eachother. 
Iheanacho - Too many chances now, 10 mins left, you're a CF and you're losing the game, you should be up and down the touchline making sure the manager sees you, instead he's sat on the bench in his coat without his boots tied up or pads on. Just get rid. 

Okazaki - Past it

Silva - Probably needs more chances as he's proven quality, but everytime he has played he's generally been off the pace, so unless we have a new manager with a master plan, can't see him doing much at this level. 

Fuchs - Past it, been below average when he's had a chance this season, either his passing or his defending lets him down every game he's played. 

King - Time has come. 

James - Time has come. 

Jakupovic - Waste of a wage 

 

Inconsistent players

Gray - Did well today for his goal, but can't help but wish he did it more often, shows flashes of brilliance but often just gets marked out of the game.

Chilwell - He's decent enough but massively overrated IMO, i'd take 50m for him if city offered it, his defending is OK and his attacking is OK. Very rarely does a cross connect and more often than not he turns and passes backwards. 

 

The last 2 and possibly Silva could be good under a new manager, but generally speaking I really think the problem goes deeper than this. Our bench is piss poor and many of our first team players just cannot adapt any other style of play than hoofball. 

 

I do see what you are saying, but everyone was saying that about the Manchester United players when Mourinho was manager. They are not saying that now.

[Toddybad]

I have finally come to the conclusion that we do need a new midfield. 

 

Think it's harsh to call chilwell anything other than brilliant though tbh. 

[RumbleFox]

It's almost like we have some ageing players that need moving on and the manager is slowly trying to do this and introduce some young players.  Let's imagine, for a second, that was thew case, inconsistent performances would seem quite natural and managing to do it all whilst remaining 7th-10th would be a decent achievement.  X

Edited 19 January 2019 by RumbleFox

[Fox92]

Puel has inherited an ageing squad. However I just don't get why he insists on players that seem undroppable... Morgan, Ndidi, Mendy, Kasper can all be shit but guarantee a starting place next week.

 

Our squad is completely average, I've said it all along. Trouble is you've got people that seem to overrate our players after a couple of games. 

[5waller5]

3 hours ago, Paddy. said:

I'll be honest, I think it's more of an effort issue than a talent issue. We've got a good squad, capable of a lot more.

I think it's an effort / tactical issue. but agree we have a talented squad capable of way more

[fuchsntf]

1 minute ago, Fox92 said:

Puel has inherited an ageing squad. However I just don't get why he insists on players that seem undroppable... Morgan, Ndidi, Mendy, Kasper can all be shit but guarantee a starting place next week.

 

Our squad is completely average, I've said it all along. Trouble is you've got people that seem to overrate our players after a couple of games. 

Kasper....

[Fox92]

4 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

Kasper....

His distribution puts us into trouble nearly every game. See last week as an example with the pen.

I will also say about today not hanging onto the ball instead just kicking out and losing it (but I haven't seen the goals back yet so can only go on one look at the game).

 

But my point is even if he's shit for three months he isn't getting dropped. 

Edited 19 January 2019 by Fox92

[lgfualol]

Kasper still makes top saves but I think his overall game has really dropped. His kicking is a bigger asset to the other team than us.

[cityfanlee23]

3 hours ago, Hanan96 said:

Do not kick chilwell away. We can't just replace too many player in the same time without team balance disruption. 

 

With 3-5 additional first teamers still needed, adding more is too risky 

I made a list interestingly enough of 21 players that Puel inherited that were one dimensional, past it or not good enough. The list is massively reduced under Puel and we have players like Ricardo replacing them. 

 

We definitely need 3-5 first teamers but the bench is really poor and need to add to that aswell, that's why i've consistently been puel in, however i have to admit even i've struggled to defend him recently.

[cityfanlee23]

 

2 hours ago, Nuge said:

quite simply, we don't have a midfield. can't complete a pass forwards between them. zero creativity. how can he not see it. 

I don't think it's a case of not seeing it, it's a case of getting the right player in that can. Iborra and Silva can pass a decent ball but they created other problems, they were both off the pace and players were gliding past them in midfield, atleast with Ndidi and Mendy you get some aggression and get hassled on the ball, so you fix one leak and cause another.
 

Edited 19 January 2019 by cityfanlee23

[cityfanlee23]

4 minutes ago, lgfualol said:

Kasper still makes top saves but I think his overall game has really dropped. His kicking is a bigger asset to the other team than us.

 

5 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

His distribution puts us into trouble nearly every game. See last week as an example with the pen.

I will also say about today not hanging onto the ball instead just kicking out and losing it (but I haven't seen the goals back yet so can only go on one look at the game).

 

But my point is even if he's shit for three months he isn't getting dropped. 

 

6 minutes ago, fuchsntf said:

Kasper....

Considered sticking him in there but I couldn't be arsed with the backlash after such a disappointing result today lol. 

He's been bang average for a while. 

 

 

[MrSpaM]

I think our squads pretty decent tbh, it's just lacking experience, in 2-3 years most of these young players are going to be top draw

[cityfanlee23]

23 minutes ago, RumbleFox said:

It's almost like we have some ageing players that need moving on and the manager is slowly trying to do this and introduce some young players.  Let's imagine, for a second, that was thew case, inconsistent performances would seem quite natural and managing to do it all whilst remaining 7th-10th would be a decent achievement.  X

Which is why I've been Puel in from the start. 

 

I wrote a list of 21 players he inherited that were either too old, past it or 1 dimensional when Puel arrived, and he's massively reduced that list. We need to bring new players in.

[cityfanlee23]

29 minutes ago, Toddybad said:

I have finally come to the conclusion that we do need a new midfield. 

 

Think it's harsh to call chilwell anything other than brilliant though tbh. 

I think he's got massive potential but he's not as good NOW as we say he is. 
 

He runs a lot and he often beats his man when attacking, but more often than not his crossing is atrocious and he constantly has an opportunity to overlap but instead stays off and ends up passing back to kasper or the defence, I really don't rate him at 50m right now, hope he ends up being that good though but right now I think it's young english hype.

[Gazza M]

There is too much player power in this squad. Has been since 15-16. They believe they are better than they are. I am annoyed that we keep handing out long term contracts like Smarties. Got Kasper and Vardy for another 4 years. Those two are the biggest problem with the old guard in my opinion. Thank goodness that it looks like Morgan isn't getting one.

I think Puel isn't a big enough character to stand on some of these egos and thrash it out. Shakespeare wasn't as he was best mate for years and Ranieri was lost in his own bullshit in the 2nd season with the players.

We need an evil fucher to come in and get some discipline back and a back bone in this squad. We need to start becoming hard to beat and working that 5-10% harder again. 

[Bob Weasel Fox]

2 minutes ago, Gazza M said:

There is too much player power in this squad. Has been since 15-16. They believe they are better than they are. I am annoyed that we keep handing out long term contracts like Smarties. Got Kasper and Vardy for another 4 years. Those two are the biggest problem with the old guard in my opinion. Thank goodness that it looks like Morgan isn't getting one.

I think Puel isn't a big enough character to stand on some of these egos and thrash it out. Shakespeare wasn't as he was best mate for years and Ranieri was lost in his own bullshit in the 2nd season with the players.

We need an evil fucher to come in and get some discipline back and a back bone in this squad. We need to start becoming hard to beat and working that 5-10% harder again. 

Sensible post in the main. 

 

Hard work and a better game plan will solve most of this current malaise 

 

not so sure about the Vardy and Kasper comments however 

[foxinsox]

1 minute ago, Gazza M said:

There is too much player power in this squad. Has been since 15-16. They believe they are better than they are. I am annoyed that we keep handing out long term contracts like Smarties. Got Kasper and Vardy for another 4 years. Those two are the biggest problem with the old guard in my opinion. Thank goodness that it looks like Morgan isn't getting one.

I think Puel isn't a big enough character to stand on some of these egos and thrash it out. Shakespeare wasn't as he was best mate for years and Ranieri was lost in his own bullshit in the 2nd season with the players.

We need an evil fucher to come in and get some discipline back and a back bone in this squad. We need to start becoming hard to beat and working that 5-10% harder again. 

The third coming of Bige Nige, as caretaker until the summer? 

 

 

[cityfanlee23]

Edited the original post just to add some players to the list that Puel originally inherited to show what a big job this club was when he took over. 

[cityfanlee23]

3 minutes ago, Bob Weasel Fox said:

Sensible post in the main. 

 

Hard work and a better game plan will solve most of this current malaise 

 

not so sure about the Vardy and Kasper comments however 

I kind of agree and disagree with the comments personally, I kind of agree based on a hunch, it's a theory I have no evidence for but we had rumoured unrest under Nige, Ranieri and now Puel, I can't see that as a coincidence. 

Then i disagree on the other side because I'm not sure if it's power or passion for the club. I expect their voices are heard and I would not be surprised if they don't have access to top privately whenever they want it. No evidence of wrongdoing though so It's just my own little conspiracy theory.