Coronavirus Thread

[KrefelderFox666]

17 minutes ago, ARM1968 said:

So people who don’t want the vaccines also don’t think Covid is real?  Mate, seriously?

 

I think you will find that most of us know just how real Covid is, but we are not willing, even with that knowledge, to allow ourselves to be injected with experimental drugs. 
 

let’s be honest, if the vaccines are doing their job then the vaccinated have zero to fear from the unvaccinated. In fact it’s the exact opposite, as the vaccinated can spread the virus just as easily and in some cases, even more so. 
 

I don’t really understand why people are so angry with people making a personal choice. 
 

Are you in favour of vaccinating children as young as 5?

As above I think my point was missed. I probably tried to generalise the groups of people too much. Appreciate there are more "types" that sit somewhere in between.

 

As per your last point. No, in particular without clear proof there is any benefit to society, or rather a compelling benefit. Even 5 to 11 year olds (which have started being vaccinated in Europe) is OTT in my eyes. Didn't the medical experts pretty much say there is little benefit of having the vaccine in the 12 to 17 age group. However, they thought it would benefit society.

 

Thinking purely about myself and protecting me, I probably wouldn't have the vaccine (31 year old for reference). However, I felt it made sense with the wider society view. A fair few people probably with similar views to mine and some of those might be questioning that rationale in light of more lockdown/restrictions.

[KrefelderFox666]

18 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

If the overwhelming majority of people being vaccinated doesn't prevent lockdowns or restrictions each year then we have to look at why and see what can be done. Can the vaccine stop the spread better? Can we do something collectively about the disparity of vaccination across the world that allows for mutations that then undoes pretty much all of the drive to be vaccinated in this country to " regain our freedom "

 

Ultimately as the goal posts keep being moved on the ticket out of this, what is glaringly obvious is just how delicate our way of life is without huge ramifications if our health service is at risk of being overwhelmed. It's now a vicious circle and it's only going to get worse as there's yet more delays on treatments and procedures and more staff leave and then never ending obsession with reporting case numbers and hospitalisations and deaths and who's not had a vaccine and how its all the unvaccinated's fault now for this continuation.

 

People are now mentally ill, mentally ill through their lives being severely altered through the pandemic who have had enough and mentally ill people obsessed and driven by fear of this hideous behemoth. I am concerned we aren't thinking straight, we as the public aren't and for sure those prats in charge of our country.

 

If we have to live the rest of our lives where we are at risk of overwhelming our health service then something  drastic has to change, either the health service has to be monumentally improved but there's something in our population size, the infrastructure, our way of life and there's some very difficult questions about when it starts to come down to the survival of the fittest if it really gets bad. One things for sure we cannot live like this long term.

If anything, this has proven how at limits the NHS is. Until now, all the cracks have been papered over as nothing has made the NHS hit complete breaking point. Unfortunately, Covid has done just that and there is a lot of work to do by the higher powers to sort this mess out, no hiding from it.

 

I feel for those who work under extreme pressure in the NHS with little support from above (and I don't mean God).

[Foxdiamond]

3 hours ago, Parafox said:

Good, even though actually, you don't. Will you equally accept the facts and the incontrovertible evidence that lockdowns are and have been a necessary intervention, however difficult they are. People have made huge sacrifices to actually comply because they think it's the right thing to do for wider society. What did you do?

I get that no one likes lockdowns, many people, don't like speed limits or societal rules that keep the majority of the populace safe but most people accept and abide by them because it makes us all safer. Your PoV doesn't make sense. 

"It's as simple as that"... for you, maybe.

 

I share your worry as someone is living a restricted life. I think we will have wait for the new year to see what the latest data shows. If the stats show that the varient is not as serious as feared then brilliant. 

[SpacedX]

28 minutes ago, ARM1968 said:

 

I think you will find that most of us know just how real Covid is, but we are not willing, even with that knowledge, to allow ourselves to be injected with experimental drugs. 

What "experimental drugs"? 

[Farrington fox]

1 hour ago, Otis said:

I'm now convinced he's an actual robot after watching said address. 

Some say he’s an alien 

[Dunge]

1 minute ago, Line-X said:

What "experimental drugs"? 

I sometimes wonder whether some people argue with you in the hope of being proven wrong.

[danny.]

10 minutes ago, Line-X said:

 A likely origin for covid-19 is already known: it’s very close to known bat viruses. Even before the outbreak started, details of a species of horseshoe bat whose genetic code is 96% identical to SARS-CoV-2 had been published. That’s as good a match as the “missing link” that you refer to found for the original SARS.

The genetic code of a bat is 96% identical to a virus? Do you mean that?

[SpacedX]

3 minutes ago, danny. said:

The genetic code of a bat is 96% identical to a virus? Do you mean that?

For clarification - its genome. Well picked up on though. A significant as it may sound, in the interest of contextualisation, we share 96% of our genome with chimpanzees but of course we are not the same species. Despite its probable progenitor in the bat species, it is humans that transmit COVID-19 to other humans, not bats.

[Farrington fox]

Just now, HighPeakFox said:

Afraid not, just amused at you being so very offended by everything - nice attempt at deflection though, as you tend to do.

I’m off to bed now, there’s another one. I need some kip so I’m reinvigorated to spend tomorrow searching the dark web for more covid conspiracies. Night night hope Chris Whitty doesn’t bite. 

[Wolfox]

What’s the obsession with referencing ‘experimental drugs’ ???

It sounds a little like Hendrix experimenting with placing acid strips in his bandanna and choking on vomit

It feels to me that some may feel like it’s a slightly smug / smart/ supercilious way of explaining why they’re  sceptical 

 

There are very few vaccines on the planet that we know less  about FFS.

[ARM1968]

29 minutes ago, Spudulike said:

On a windup? 

 

Nope. Those are facts. 
 

Recent studies show that the vaccinated carry pretty much the same viral load in their respiratory system and just as easily spread the virus.  Now, if you consider that more vaccinated people are asymptomatic and continue their lives normally, then they are more likely to spread the virus. On top of that, the vaccinated with their compliance passports can enter places without a test, whereas unvaccinated have to show a negative test. So vaccinated people can go about their business quite legitimately spreading the virus ‘invisibly’. 
 

I am yet to really see how the vaccinated are in any danger from the unvaccinated. 

[danny.]

23 minutes ago, Line-X said:

For clarification - its genome. Well picked up on though. A significant as it may sound, in the interest of contextualisation, we share 96% of our genome with chimpanzees but of course we are not the same species. Despite its probable progenitor in the bat species, it is humans that transmit COVID-19 to other humans, not bats.

You are saying SARS shares 96% of its genome to a bat? I’m fairly sure that isn’t true. Humans share 90% of their DNA with cats and a virus is far more different to a bat than two mammals. 
 

Maybe you mean a bat virus shares 96% off it’s genome with SARS?

 

Edit: I don’t think your human/chimp figure is correct either. 

Edited 19 December 2021 by danny.

[Robo61]

3 minutes ago, ARM1968 said:

Nope. Those are facts. 
 

Recent studies show that the vaccinated carry pretty much the same viral load in their respiratory system and just as easily spread the virus.  Now, if you consider that more vaccinated people are asymptomatic and continue their lives normally, then they are more likely to spread the virus. On top of that, the vaccinated with their compliance passports can enter places without a test, whereas unvaccinated have to show a negative test. So vaccinated people can go about their business quite legitimately spreading the virus ‘invisibly’. 
 

I am yet to really see how the vaccinated are in any danger from the unvaccinated. 

Source please or I shall treat it and you with the contempt I believe it/you deserve.

 

I have a degree of sympathy with your second point though if it was me the unvaccinated would not be allowed at events full stop and the vaccinated would be required to show a recent test result rergardless.

[foxile5]

11 minutes ago, danny. said:

You are saying SARS shares 96% of its genome to a bat? I’m fairly sure that isn’t true. Humans share 90% of their DNA with cats and a virus is far more different to a bat than two mammals. 
 

Maybe you mean a bat virus shares 96% off it’s genome with SARS?

 

Edit: I don’t think your human/chimp figure is correct either. 

Don't we share huge portions of our genome with a banana? 

 

This isn't conclusive of anything, surely? 

[Buce]

8 minutes ago, danny. said:

 

 

Edit: I don’t think your human/chimp figure is correct either. 

 

If anything he is erring on the low side. Studies give slightly different conclusions but I've seen 98% quoted.

 

Astonishingly, we share 60% with a strawberry.

[GingerrrFox]

12 minutes ago, Robo61 said:

Source please or I shall treat it and you with the contempt I believe it/you deserve.

 

I have a degree of sympathy with your second point though if it was me the unvaccinated would not be allowed at events full stop and the vaccinated would be required to show a recent test result rergardless.

https://www.bmj.com/content/374/bmj.n2074

 

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/laninf/article/PIIS1473-3099(21)00648-4/fulltext

 

Interpretation

Vaccination reduces the risk of delta variant infection and accelerates viral clearance. Nonetheless, fully vaccinated individuals with breakthrough infections have peak viral load similar to unvaccinated cases and can efficiently transmit infection in household settings, including to fully vaccinated contacts. Host–virus interactions early in infection may shape the entire viral trajectory.

Edited 19 December 2021 by GingerrrFox

[ARM1968]

20 minutes ago, Robo61 said:

Source please or I shall treat it and you with the contempt I believe it/you deserve.

 

I have a degree of sympathy with your second point though if it was me the unvaccinated would not be allowed at events full stop and the vaccinated would be required to show a recent test result rergardless.

So what threat do we pose to the vaccinated again?

 

It would appear someone else posted some links for you to look at. I hope they help. See above. 

 

 

Edited 19 December 2021 by ARM1968

[danny.]

10 minutes ago, foxile5 said:

Don't we share huge portions of our genome with a banana? 

 

This isn't conclusive of anything, surely? 

Yup, 60%, and 50% with a tree. I find it hard to believe a bat and a virus are 96% the same when that’s more than a human and an orangutan shares 

 

10 minutes ago, Buce said:

 

If anything he is erring on the low side. Studies give slightly different conclusions but I've seen 98% quoted.

 

Astonishingly, we share 60% with a strawberry.

yup, 98.8% seems to be the figure I keep finding 

Edited 19 December 2021 by danny.

[SpacedX]

21 minutes ago, danny. said:

You are saying SARS shares 96% of its genome to a bat? I’m fairly sure that isn’t true. Humans share 90% of their DNA with cats and a virus is far more different to a bat than two mammals. 

Specifically, the most closely related virus to SARS-CoV-2 was sampled from a bat in Yunnan province. This virus shared 96% nucleotide identity and 93% identity in the S gene. 

[danny.]

10 minutes ago, Line-X said:

Specifically, the most closely related virus to SARS-CoV-2 was sampled from a bat in Yunnan province. This virus shared 96% nucleotide identity and 93% identity in the S gene. 

Shared with what? You have said a couple of times SARS shares 96% of its genome with a bat.

 

Maybe just cut down on the long words and give a simple answer to a simple question? Feels like you’re obfuscating an error…

Edited 19 December 2021 by danny.

[GingerrrFox]

Dr Alina Chan, who is a specialist in gene therapy and cell engineering at MIT and Harvard in the USA, has come out and said that after 2 years of searching, no animal host has been found. She also said there was a risk that Covid-19 was an engineered virus.

 

 

Dr Chan, said: “I think the lab origin is more likely than not. Right now it’s not safe for people who know about the origin of the pandemic to come forward. But we live in an era where there is so much information being stored that it will eventually come out. 

“We have heard from many top virologists that a genetically engineered origin is reasonable and that includes virologists who made modifications to the first Sars virus. 

“We know this virus has a unique feature, called the furin cleavage site, and without this feature there is no way this would be causing this pandemic.

“A proposal was leaked showing that EcoHealth and the Wuhan Institute of Virology were developing a pipeline for inserting novel furin cleavage sites. So, you find these scientists who said in early 2018 ‘I’m going to put horns on horses’ and at the end of 2019 a unicorn turns up in Wuhan city.” 

The furin cleavage point on Covid-19 is part of the spike protein which helps it to enter cells.

 

Yet everyone here is so quick to dismiss the lab leak possibility 🤔. 

[Legend_in_blue]

I find it incredible that there are increasing numbers of people in this thread that will not question the narrative.  That's what 18+ months of manipulating behavioural science does to the human mind.  

 

https://cognitiveresearchjournal.springeropen.com/articles/10.1186/s41235-021-00301-5

 

 

[ARM1968]

10 minutes ago, GingerrrFox said:

Dr Alina Chan, who is a specialist in gene therapy and cell engineering at MIT and Harvard in the USA, has come out and said that after 2 years of searching, no animal host has been found. She also said there was a risk that Covid-19 was an engineered virus.

 

 

Dr Chan, said: “I think the lab origin is more likely than not. Right now it’s not safe for people who know about the origin of the pandemic to come forward. But we live in an era where there is so much information being stored that it will eventually come out. 

“We have heard from many top virologists that a genetically engineered origin is reasonable and that includes virologists who made modifications to the first Sars virus. 

“We know this virus has a unique feature, called the furin cleavage site, and without this feature there is no way this would be causing this pandemic.

“A proposal was leaked showing that EcoHealth and the Wuhan Institute of Virology were developing a pipeline for inserting novel furin cleavage sites. So, you find these scientists who said in early 2018 ‘I’m going to put horns on horses’ and at the end of 2019 a unicorn turns up in Wuhan city.” 

The furin cleavage point on Covid-19 is part of the spike protein which helps it to enter cells.

 

Yet everyone here is so quick to dismiss the lab leak possibility 🤔. 

Yes, this article and others show that many know the origin of the virus was the Wuhan lab. The paper trail is pretty conclusive. However it is not something that can be officially acknowledged without serious, and potentially catastrophic, consequences.

 

Thats why some keep chasing bats in the belfry. Odd when it’s so damned obvious. 

[ARM1968]

5 minutes ago, Legend_in_blue said:

I find it incredible that there are increasing numbers of people in this thread that will not question the narrative.  That's what 18+ months of manipulating behavioural science does to the human mind.  

 

https://cognitiveresearchjournal.springeropen.com/articles/10.1186/s41235-021-00301-5

 

 

You are spot on. As the past is echoing around us, perhaps this quote is most apt. 
 

“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”

[FoxesDeb]

I'm starting to feel like there's more intelligence in one of our match threads.