Were Leicester fans this unhappy under MON?

[evil jack]

Ah the moan in. What ever happened to Andy from Long Eaton?....

[deanolegend1989]

2 hours ago, Stevosevic said:

Genuine question. 

 

In the previous two seasons we've finished 9th which was MONesque and this year we are going to finish 5th. 

 

Under MON let's be honest, we played quite turgid Burnley style football and we also went on some pretty bad runs that involved losing to the dross of the league.

 

Maybe it was the cup runs that prevented the moaning but I don't remember our fans being as unhappy as they are now.

 

Or is it the title run that means top half finishes are no longer that satisfying?

 

 

It’s as simple as these 2 things:

 

1) Money. We are spending more, have a squad that’s worth more and have owners who are ambitious and have money. Of course this means that we are going to expect more! Some people still have a ‘little Leicester’ mindset.
O Neils team were overachieving beyond the sum of their parts and that’s why it was thought of differently.

 

2) Position we were in. I actually think there’s not that many who actually would expect more than 5th at the start of the season. It’s the fact that we were absolutely locked for the position for months and have absolutely thrown it away.

We have found it hard to cope with the big clubs with squad depth and it’s been hard but from the position we were in, there’s no doubt in most people’s mind that it’ll be a huge drop off and a monumental collapse.

 

If we had a season like Wolves or Spurs even I can guarantee there would be next to NO negativity. It’s not so much the position of 5th but unfortunately they have been guilty of their own success so fans(rightly so in my eyes) are going to expect more and not expect a drop off so big. No one can deny that we should if got 4th, we probably needed to perform at 9/10th place formwise.
It’s not ‘entitled’ it’s called wanting to achieve what we are capable of, and I believe we have underachieved massively in so many games recently and even more so between January - March when stupid decisions from Rodgers, poor concentrating in a lot of situations and lots of other factors have contributed to throwing it away.

Leaving Tielemens out in key games Southampton home, Burnley away and Norwich away cost us big time. We had Ndidi and Vardy out to cope with too. Silly errors against Man City late on and Watford late on.

Ricardo can’t be helped but that’s been a big miss.

Stupid defensive approach to a home game vs Brighton by BR as well as a ridiculously poor change away at Bournemouth as well as we literally tipped CL football away.

Even today, we might of had a weaker defence but there’s no excuse to how easy all of those goals were.
As soon as we started ‘Just don’t concede early vs this Spurs team who will sit deep and make it impossible’ we go and concede a ridiculous goal straight after and it’s game over after 5 mins.

I could go on all day but this is why this season is going to have negativity, we have underachieved through a mixture of all these things.

 

I think ultimately, from my point of view anyway,  as much as I’m extremely disappointed this season, If next season we build and keep the squad together then it’ll probably be seen as a good season and a learning curve.

However it’s more the ‘worry’ that this is the start of the end.

I don’t care about CL for what it is, but more for keeping this talented squad together and I’m extremely scared we’ve missed a trick here and it could break this hard work up.

I genuinely fear if we lose a few of our best players(Ndidi Tielemens Soyuncu and Ricardo for me are the key ones) we could be in trouble next year. We can’t keep plucking gems out, few bad windows and we could end up in relegation.

Vardy will soon be 34, Evans and Kasper are old. These around potentially new signings to replace our class could be a recipe for disaster and I’m a bit nervous about next season currently.

Thats maybe why Martin o neils team were loved because it felt they were more comfortable and teams were not always in for our players. As soon as they did with Heskey and Lennon, we dropped like a brick as well but because we had no money and less expectations, it wasn’t as big of an issue to be relegated. We’d won 2 cups and had 4 top 10 finishes the team got ripped apart and we dropped, I fear that will happen again.

[l444ry]

Martin's teams played to the players strengths. Never in a million years would he have left our weakened back three as exposed as at Tottenham, and neither would he have fallen into Mourinho's game plan which was so obvious that it could have been printed in the pre match programme. We might have lost games under O'Neill but those players came off the pitch sweating blood.  

[Aus Fox]

Interesting question to follow on who would you rather have:

 

O’Neill or Rodgers

 

 Keller or Schmeichel 

Kaamark or Ricardo

Elliott or Evans

Walsh or Soyuncu

Guppy or Chilwell

Lennon or Ndidi

Izzet or Madison 
Savage or Tielemans 

Heskey or Vardy

Cottee or Perez

Impey or Barnes

 

How do the teams compare and how does that affect our perspective? Our expectations.

Note: I realise that not all of these players are like for like, but comparing two different teams and formations. Both the regular best XI

 

l

[Trav Le Bleu]

10 hours ago, Miquel The Work Geordie said:

I'd have thought the general consensus is that the current lot are a "better" squad that are being mismanaged, subsequently missing out on a huge opportunity, and that leads to greater frustration over a group of blokes leaving everything on the pitch. I was only a kid (1990 born) when the O'Neill side were at their peak but he squeezed everything he could out of those players and surely that resonates with fans regardless of results? I can't remember a time under Rodgers (there might well be one) where we've lost but absolutely thrown the ****ing kitchen sink at someone. 

Yesterday.

 

Ok, maybe not thrown the kitchen sink, but Lloris made at least 4 good saves, two of which were candidates for save of the season. We were the better team yesterday and the 3-0 scoreline really doesn't represent how the two teams competed. Given that we were playing without 4 of our regular starters and a couple of our first choice replacements, we played well and were still a threat.

[Foxin_Mad]

Very different times, we were true underdogs then. Our facilities were poor, our budget was small.  We still had some fantastic players like Izzet.

 

One thing you could never accuse that team of is rolling over. They might have got beaten by technically superior teams, but on their day they would give the best a game and they would know about it.

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

3 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

Yesterday.

 

Ok, maybe not thrown the kitchen sink, but Lloris made at least 4 good saves, two of which were candidates for save of the season. We were the better team yesterday and the 3-0 scoreline really doesn't represent how the two teams competed. Given that we were playing without 4 of our regular starters and a couple of our first choice replacements, we played well and were still a threat.

 

I'd argue we have different definitions of throwing the kitchen sink at a side if you're pointing out yesterday as an example of it.

 

(I'd like to add that I don't think we were particularly bad yesterday, but we were our usual passive selves in chasing the game after the third had gone in)

[Ric Flair]

11 hours ago, Stevosevic said:

Genuine question. 

 

In the previous two seasons we've finished 9th which was MONesque and this year we are going to finish 5th. 

 

Under MON let's be honest, we played quite turgid Burnley style football and we also went on some pretty bad runs that involved losing to the dross of the league.

 

Maybe it was the cup runs that prevented the moaning but I don't remember our fans being as unhappy as they are now.

 

Or is it the title run that means top half finishes are no longer that satisfying?

 

 

There were some real moments of frustration under O'Neill, none more so than the league form during 1998/99 in the 2nd half of the season. The final masked a horrific stretch of results, albeit with many injuries to our squad.

[Ric Flair]

1 hour ago, l444ry said:

Martin's teams played to the players strengths. Never in a million years would he have left our weakened back three as exposed as at Tottenham, and neither would he have fallen into Mourinho's game plan which was so obvious that it could have been printed in the pre match programme. We might have lost games under O'Neill but those players came off the pitch sweating blood.  

There were many abject displays under O'Neill, but he also masterminded some unbelievable results against the top sides and that's something Rodgers is yet to do here. Our record against those around us is absolutely disgraceful, if he gets us across the line on Sunday then i'll doft my cap but so far his tactics vs the better sides makes me feel ill.

[Arriba Los Zorros]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

There were many abject displays under O'Neill, but he also masterminded some unbelievable results against the top sides and that's something Rodgers is yet to do here. Our record against those around us is absolutely disgraceful, if he gets us across the line on Sunday then i'll doft my cap but so far his tactics vs the better sides makes me feel ill.

Yeah that's true. MON teams tended to struggle against teams that matched us for effort and had just as good players. We lost a lot of games at home to teams below us in the league which was frustrating.

 

However, as you rightly say we used our physicality and grit to upset the top sides under MON. We went in accepting we were the underdogs and played a cagey style to win.

 

Rodgers plays the same way regardless of opposition. He is good at putting away inferior lower table sides, which is a skill in itself, but we are a soft touch for teams that can match our quality. The home record is good under BR at least - we'd be 3rd based on home results only.

[Bert]

No but we didn’t have the stadium we currently do, the training ground we have and what’s being built, least of all the money we have. 

[Ric Flair]

4 minutes ago, Bert said:

No but we didn’t have the stadium we currently do, the training ground we have and what’s being built, least of all the money we have. 

We also hadn't won the fcukin Prem either.

[Mickyblueeyes]

2 hours ago, Aus Fox said:

Interesting question to follow on who would you rather have:

 

O’Neill or Rodgers

 

 Keller or Schmeichel - Kasper

Kaamark or Ricardo - Ricardo

Elliott or Evans - Elliot for his leadership.

Walsh or Soyuncu - Soyuncu (which kills me as Walshie was my hero growing up).

Guppy or Chilwell - Guppy

Lennon or Ndidi - ah man, both please.

Izzet or Madison - Izzet
Savage or Tielemans - Easiest answer, Youri.

Heskey or Vardy - Vardy

Cottee or Perez - il Take Heskey here.

Impey or Barnes - for now, Impey.

 

How do the teams compare and how does that affect our perspective? Our expectations.

Note: I realise that not all of these players are like for like, but comparing two different teams and formations. Both the regular best XI

 

l

Tough question. Some of these answers could easily change.

[Ric Flair]

2 hours ago, Aus Fox said:

Interesting question to follow on who would you rather have:

 

O’Neill or Rodgers

 

 Keller or Schmeichel 

Kaamark or Ricardo

Elliott or Evans

Walsh or Soyuncu

Guppy or Chilwell

Lennon or Ndidi

Izzet or Madison 
Savage or Tielemans 

Heskey or Vardy

Cottee or Perez

Impey or Barnes

 

How do the teams compare and how does that affect our perspective? Our expectations.

Note: I realise that not all of these players are like for like, but comparing two different teams and formations. Both the regular best XI

 

l

Wahahahahahahaaaa Impey? Are you insane? Barnes for all his wild finishing and inconsistency has 14 goal contributions in the PL this season, Impey's goals and assists record for a winger was an absolute disgrace.

[foxfanazer]

2 hours ago, Aus Fox said:

Interesting question to follow on who would you rather have:

 

O’Neill or Rodgers

 

 Keller or Schmeichel 

Kaamark or Ricardo

Elliott or Evans

Walsh or Soyuncu

Guppy or Chilwell

Lennon or Ndidi

Izzet or Madison 
Savage or Tielemans 

Heskey or Vardy

Cottee or Perez

Impey or Barnes

 

How do the teams compare and how does that affect our perspective? Our expectations.

Note: I realise that not all of these players are like for like, but comparing two different teams and formations. Both the regular best XI

 

l

O'Neill 

 

Schmeichel 

Ricardo

Elliott

Soyuncu (although Walsh is one of my favourite ever players) 

Guppy 

Ndidi

Izzet

Tielemans

Vardy

Cottee

Barnes

[PhillippaT]

11 minutes ago, foxfanazer said:

O'Neill 

 

Schmeichel 

Ricardo

Elliott

Soyuncu (although Walsh is one of my favourite ever players) 

Guppy 

Ndidi

Izzet

Tielemans

Vardy

Cottee

Barnes

I'd pretty much agree, but feel that Elliott vs Evans is a tough one and I can't decide for myself...

[Arriba Los Zorros]

Rodgers (O'Neill is a dinosaur now, if we played his style today we'd have lower mid table as our ceiling)

 

Kasper

Ricardo

Evans

Soyuncu

Chilwell

Ndidi

Izzet

Tielemans

Vardy

neither - Iheanacho or Heskey

Barnes

 

Basically keep it as it is now but we need to change our mindset and develop some grit and will to win at any cost.

[NeilLCFC]

20 hours ago, Stevosevic said:

Genuine question. 

 

In the previous two seasons we've finished 9th which was MONesque and this year we are going to finish 5th. 

 

Under MON let's be honest, we played quite turgid Burnley style football and we also went on some pretty bad runs that involved losing to the dross of the league.

 

Maybe it was the cup runs that prevented the moaning but I don't remember our fans being as unhappy as they are now.

 

Or is it the title run that means top half finishes are no longer that satisfying?

 

 

Under MON we didn’t have the third highest paid manager in the premier league. We didn’t have one of the most expensively assembled squads in Europe, nor were we on the verge of moving into the best training facility in European football. We hadn’t just sold a defender for a world record £80m.
 

We have moved so far away from being the yo-yo club we used to be, so of course the expectation should be higher. Clearly the people on here posting things like ‘be happy we aren’t fighting relegation’, have no understanding of progression. 
 

No one is expecting us to win the league again and finishing 5th is a great season. However the form since December is not acceptable and over the last 7/8 months, Rodgers hasn’t shown he can turn things around as we’ve progressively become worse and worse. 

[Mark 'expert' Lawrenson]

Of course not, we had spirit, desire and fight back then, never bowed down to anyone, always up for a battle.

 

Wonderful time’s .

[Livid]

Different times and maybe BR puts too much faith in the individual ability of the players but MON seemed to know his players strengths and weaknesses and adjust his tactics accordingly. He wouldn’t have tolerated some of the half hearted individual displays we’ve seen recently. 

 

It didn’t always go to plan but we understood we were working with much less than we are now. 

[cruzFOX]

Different levels of expectations back then from the club owners to the manager to the players and the fans. MON got the best out of his players and the heights we reached was the limit. Maybe could have gone a little further in the Uefa cup and barring a dodgy decision against Chelski got further in the FA cup.

did win the league cup twice!

we are in a new era now and can’t look back too much. We must strive to meet the expectations, ambitions and levels we have set for ourselves period.

[Mythyaar]

We played some great stuff first half of season, no question. Turn of the year we've struggled, even when we had a full squad including Perreira, so injuries are far too convenient an excuse for the current demise.

 

It's probably a combination of the injuries, lack of squad depth/experience, and a bit of mental fragility that's done for us. And that's players and management. This combined with undoubted improvement of Man U.

 

In terms of life under O Neill, there never were any expectations. We'd been a yo yo club for 20 years prior. So just surviving a season in the prem was great. To finish 10th and 8th awesome, and 2 cups - absolutely incredible.

 

But we had some quality in among the experience, make no bones about it. Lennon had best pass completion rate in prem one season, including Scholes Giggs etc. He was an absolute monster of a player for us. Elliott was just a winner (and a baller). Taggart and Walsh both legends. All of the above were leaders. None really in our current squad? Savage massively underrated and then real quality in Guppy, Heskey and Izzet.

 

[Dahnsouff]

22 hours ago, foxfanazer said:

Taking our finishing position out of it, hardly any fan in the league would be happy watching their team in the sort of form we've had since mid December. Delighted with European football but its hardly surprising that people aren't too optimistic for next season when we can't address our failings 

That’s patently not true! We won’t even need to spend money. Some superb players will return from injury, we won’t be dealing with a second wave hopefully. No?

 

Edited 20 July 2020 by Dahnsouff

[foxfanazer]

6 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

That’s patently not true! We won’t even need to spend money. Some superb players will return from injury, we won’t be dealing with a second wave hopefully. No?

 

Depends if that's solely what your put our form down to 

[Ric Flair]

Our injury problems have increased under Rodgers, we are sometimes referred to as a poundland Arsenal under Wenger and they were renown for never addressing their injury issues. Wonder if its the fitness regime? Balsom is still involved so hopefully he still has a say in the sports science.