Not The Politics Thread.

[oxford blue]

2 hours ago, Chocolate Teapot said:

Boris now claiming he was behind hancocks sacking despite saying he supported him yesterday.

I wonder if his u-turn may have something to do with the criticism his response was generating - and probably that Carrie had something to say on the matter...not wishing to be cynical of course

[DJ Barry Hammond]

2 hours ago, leicsmac said:

I'm sorry, but for me it is the results, the hats on the ground that are the metric of "success" or "failure" here, and I don't really see how that can be defended or mitigated even with the success of the vaccine rollout - not when comparative data proves it probably could have been avoided and it wasn't a matter of dreadful algebra of necessity.

 

It's entirely possible to suggest that the vaccination program has gone well and no doubt saved many lives, but it is the only thing that has gone right.

Fair points @leicsmac but something I sense is true about the vaccine rollout ‘success’ is that it’s seriously saved the government’s bacon.

 

The public were spitting feathers at Boris come the debacle around the Christmas / New Year lockdowns - from all sides, not just from the left leaning public.

 

The vaccine rollout and indeed the cautious, seemingly more in control approach to re-opening post lockdown has restored some political capital - to the point where despite all that’s passed, the Conservatives still enjoy a healthy poll lead.

I should add, for me the marked change in approach can be traced back to Allegra Strachan’s appointment. I think her and Carrie have Boris’ ear more and that is sure to be to his benefit in the long run.

 

 

[Legend_in_blue]

4 hours ago, Kingleicester said:

You just cannot praise the government can you 

No.  

[Facecloth]

5 hours ago, Kingleicester said:

You just cannot praise the government can you 

You just cannot praise Starmer and Labour can you 

[Kingleicester]

9 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

You just cannot praise Starmer and Labour can you 

How dare you bring starmer into this conversation, lock yourself up and throw away the key 

[Mike Oxlong]

2 hours ago, Chocolate Teapot said:

Boris now claiming he was behind hancocks sacking despite saying he supported him yesterday. I thought Hancock resigned?

 

It's hard to work out if anything he says is true.

There’s the truth and then there’s Boris’ truth

[ealingfox]

39 minutes ago, doverfox said:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-leeds-57636903

This is not acceptable you may not like their message and you nay not want to hear it but a free and fair election must be allowed to take place. Intimidating people out electioneering by any party needs police action. 

 

Shockingly becoming a recurring thing for Labour supporters now, really sad and very worrying. 

[bovril]

3 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

Shockingly becoming a recurring thing for Labour supporters now, really sad and very worrying. 

This byelection is a distillation of everything that's gone wrong with British politics in the last few years. 

[Facecloth]

23 minutes ago, Kingleicester said:

How dare you bring starmer into this conversation, lock yourself up and throw away the key 

You're not funny. 

[Kingleicester]

42 minutes ago, Facecloth said:

You're not funny. 

I’m gutted

[doverfox]

1 hour ago, bovril said:

This byelection is a distillation of everything that's gone wrong with British politics in the last few years. 

Is this worse than cancel culture a society were people are afraid to speak in fear of mob justice regardless of what form that action takes is no longer free.

[Guest Kopfkino]

2 hours ago, bovril said:

This byelection is a distillation of everything that's gone wrong with British politics in the last few years. 

Define last few years. It’s not much different to what happened in Bethnal Green in 2005 election, common denominator being George Galloway.

[foxile5]

4 minutes ago, Kopfkino said:

Define last few years. It’s not much different to what happened in Bethnal Green in 2005 election, common denominator being George Galloway.

Meow

[StanSP]

7 hours ago, Kingleicester said:

You just cannot praise the government can you 

What is there to praise? The vaccine rollout has been credited to the government as well as NHS. 

 

But when you were asked the other day, all you could bring up was Johnson's 'passion for the nation'... 

[CosbehFox]

 

[Dunge]

1 hour ago, Kopfkino said:

Define last few years. It’s not much different to what happened in Bethnal Green in 2005 election, common denominator being George Galloway.

Jayda Fransen lingering around too to provide both parts of a bitter cocktail. The collection of candidates is large and horrible.

[UpTheLeagueFox]

Conservative lead cut from 11 to 7 in R&W latest poll.

#HancockBounceInnit

 

 

[leicsmac]

5 hours ago, doverfox said:

Is this worse than cancel culture a society were people are afraid to speak in fear of mob justice regardless of what form that action takes is no longer free.

The freedom to take the consequences is the one upon all the others are based.

 

That's hardly a new thing, cancel culture or no.

[urban.spaceman]

On 27/06/2021 at 16:55, StanSP said:

Things you love to see

 

 

 

Devil's advocate... Terrestrial viewing figures will be completely irrelevant to them. YouTube is where they'll profit. Twitter/Facebook too with people sharing their content. 30k live viewers is embarrassing but all they have to do is wait for an incendiary video to come along to get them shared around for millions of views. Even just talking about them is doing them a huge favour.

[StanSP]

12 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

Devil's advocate... Terrestrial viewing figures will be completely irrelevant to them. YouTube is where they'll profit. Twitter/Facebook too with people sharing their content. 30k live viewers is embarrassing but all they have to do is wait for an incendiary video to come along to get them shared around for millions of views. Even just talking about them is doing them a huge favour.

Can you stop talking about them please then ? 

[Jon the Hat]

On 27/06/2021 at 23:23, Dunge said:

No doubt in my mind that Starmer would have handled the pandemic better in many ways. Although I do think he would have made the mistake of signing up to the EU vaccines scheme and then seen us be royally shafted and held to ransom by them once the going got tough. I’m not sure whether he would have ploughed money into private vaccine research like the Tories did either, but on that it’s hard to tell.

 

That said, it’s all something of a moot point. He wasn’t leader at the last election when we didn’t know there was a pandemic on the horizon, and by the next election there may not be any new policy to declare for Covid anyway.

I'm not sure about that to be honest. While there have been some very visible mistakes, I think on balance the successes outweigh the **** ups. 

Big tick on overall economic support which means we have an economy to come back to.

Big tick on early funding for vaccine development and the roll out which will ultimately take us out of the crises, while also helping the rest of the world.

Big cross against the panicked emptying of the hospitals, which undoubtedly resulted in many deaths in Care homes and beyond, and had a knock on effect on treatment of other illnesses.  However you have to balance against this the horror shows we have seen in countries where the healthcare system has been overwhelmed, from Italy to India.

Big cross against decisions in retrospect made too late - the track and trace system, and not limiting incoming people especially from high risk locations.

Smaller cross against the reticence to lockdown early, and then laggy coming out of it due to a desire not to have to lock down again.

 

[UpTheLeagueFox]

 

[What the Fuchs?]

35 minutes ago, UpTheLeagueFox said:

 

I will never understand the fetish some people seem to have for Johnson, the man is as corrupt, entitled, self serving, dishonest, manipulative and incompetent as it gets in this country - all qualities these same people will tell you they abhor. In fact the way he’s lowered standards in public life with brazen corruption lying and ignoring of rules and standards is downright dangerous. There’s something strange and unhealthy about the people who fawn over the government on the internet as well, you only need to look at Twitter, they’ve all littered their usernames with Union flags etc to show they’re against virtue signalling as well 🤦‍♂️😂

[Facecloth]

1 hour ago, Jon the Hat said:

I'm not sure about that to be honest. While there have been some very visible mistakes, I think on balance the successes outweigh the **** ups. 

Big tick on overall economic support which means we have an economy to come back to.

Big tick on early funding for vaccine development and the roll out which will ultimately take us out of the crises, while also helping the rest of the world.

Big cross against the panicked emptying of the hospitals, which undoubtedly resulted in many deaths in Care homes and beyond, and had a knock on effect on treatment of other illnesses.  However you have to balance against this the horror shows we have seen in countries where the healthcare system has been overwhelmed, from Italy to India.

Big cross against decisions in retrospect made too late - the track and trace system, and not limiting incoming people especially from high risk locations.

Smaller cross against the reticence to lockdown early, and then laggy coming out of it due to a desire not to have to lock down again.

 

Quick bit of advice. If you're claiming the good outweighs the bad, best not in the same post detail how the bad outweigh the good. I think two big ticks are outweighed by two big crosses and some smaller crosses.

Edited 29 June 2021 by Facecloth

[leicsmac]

31 minutes ago, What the Fuchs? said:

I will never understand the fetish some people seem to have for Johnson, the man is as corrupt, entitled, self serving, dishonest, manipulative and incompetent as it gets in this country - all qualities these same people will tell you they abhor. In fact the way he’s lowered standards in public life with brazen corruption lying and ignoring of rules and standards is downright dangerous. There’s something strange and unhealthy about the people who fawn over the government on the internet as well, you only need to look at Twitter, they’ve all littered their usernames with Union flags etc to show they’re against virtue signalling as well 🤦‍♂️😂

Read an article yesterday that might offer some insight into this:

 

https://www.vox.com/recode/2021/6/26/22550981/carl-bergstrom-joe-bak-coleman-biologists-ecologists-social-media-risk-humanity-research-academics