Not The Politics Thread.

[Strokes]

1 hour ago, Phil Bowman said:

Well I was against Brexit but I have to say it’s all turning out so splendidly I reckon I was wrong.

I’ve not seen anything to convince me otherwise.

[bovril]

5 minutes ago, Strokes said:

I’ve not seen anything to convince me otherwise.

But as ever this assumes Brexit is a single thing.

 

I understand still being sceptical towards the EU. Thinking that hard Brexit was wise and that the UK Gov has made a good job of it is odd, in my opinion. 

[Strokes]

15 minutes ago, bovril said:

But as ever this assumes Brexit is a single thing.

How does it? I’ve always accepted that there would be consequences that I was prepared for.

I’m well aware it’s multi layered, hence why some minor readjustments are not a reason to alter a viewpoint.

 

15 minutes ago, bovril said:

 

I understand still being sceptical towards the EU. Thinking that hard Brexit was wise and that the UK Gov has made a good job of it is odd, in my opinion. 

Maybe I am odd but although I don’t think they’ve made a good job of it, I believe they’ve made a good stab at it. It was never going to be easy, the transition period wasn’t used for transitioning more so delaying the cliff edge. 
Considering all noise a hard brexit would cause, it’s not negatively impacted my life so far. 

[FoxyPV]

6 hours ago, Greg2607 said:

If Brexit is the reason for people shortages and salary growth is that really a bad thing?  Average house prices are now around 8 or 10 times average earnings. There has been zero salary growth since 2008. 

 

Something has to change.  

 

If Brexit causes us to grow and make more of our own, is that a bad thing?

 

There are absolute downsides to Brexit for sure, and change take time as well.  But I'm sure that eventually, all of this chaos and shortages etc will settle down. They won't become "the norm". 

 

I'm also not sure all of it is entirely down to Brexit.  Covid has absolutely made people take stock of what is important to them.  There is a shift happening in society around working conditions and we are seeing this play out currently.  

The Tories are pushing a deregulation agenda so no, it will not be better for us.

 

A housing crash (as much as I would love one) would only increase the likelihood of corporate housing purchases and then used as rentals like has already been seen in the US with Zillow.

 

Britain can't make its own things because the Tories ****ed the manufacturing industry.

 

Brexit is the only time a country has introduced economic sanctions on itself and this is only the start of of it.

[Sampson]

2 hours ago, FoxyPV said:

Brexit is the only time a country has introduced economic sanctions on itself and this is only the start of of it.

Im wondering whether this is the only time a country has willingly stuck a permanent border inside its own country.

 

Even the Berlin Wall was largely enforced on the Germans by the Soviets unlike The Irish Sea Wall which we've decided to create ourselves.

[Guest Kopfkino]

They really are taking the piss now. Completely failing to do anything about housing, bung a tax rise on us to subsidise the asset rich with large unearned wealth and now bung another effective tax rise on a significant chunk of 21-35s. Pray for the opposition to sort itself out before an election

 

The government is planning to cut the earnings threshold at which graduates begin repaying student loans in a bid to save the Treasury money and push more young people towards cheaper vocational education.

Edited 26 September 2021 by Kopfkino

[FoxyPV]

1 hour ago, Sampson said:

Im wondering whether this is the only time a country has willingly stuck a permanent border inside its own country.

 

Even the Berlin Wall was largely enforced on the Germans by the Soviets unlike The Irish Sea Wall which we've decided to create ourselves.

*Screams from Belfast*

[bovril]

3 hours ago, FoxyPV said:

 

Brexit is the only time a country has introduced economic sanctions on itself and this is only the start of of it.

 

1 hour ago, Sampson said:

Im wondering whether this is the only time a country has willingly stuck a permanent border inside its own country.

 

In the middle of a pandemic which had already put serious strain on supply chains.

[Dunge]

I’m not sure how much others care about this stuff, but to me this is a significant boost to the chances of me voting Labour at the next election:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58699946

 

…although this would decrease it again; which is frustrating because I usually like Hilary Benn:

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-58698403

[Wymsey]

Are they being overly silly or do they have a valid point?..

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-58676610

[Dunge]

Just now, Wymsey said:

Are they being overly silly or do they have a valid point?..

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-58676610

A question was asked about them on Question Time on Thursday. The big majority view in the room is that their cause is reasonable but their actions are not - particularly since insulation is already on the agenda.

[fuchsntf]

On 07/09/2021 at 23:11, Claridge said:

Starmer credible😂

This post credible....😂😂  😢

[fuchsntf]

On 25/09/2021 at 12:06, Adrian said:

Pray tell us what is the alternative?

Thats easy..Merkel is now free...Germans are our Brother & sisters, through the monarchy & birth right.

the Language is just Another Kind of Geordie...

Geherin..!!!

[Carl the Llama]

11 hours ago, Strokes said:

Rhetoric or not, I’m not going to vote for something that implies I’m pro something that I’m fundamentally against. 

Voting tory implies you're pro a lot of rather unsavoury things:  Starving school kids, NI tax hikes in lieu of increasing the tax rates for our highest earners, deregulation, letting the bodies pile high, and so on... 

[Heathrow fox]

2 hours ago, Dunge said:

A question was asked about them on Question Time on Thursday. The big majority view in the room is that their cause is reasonable but their actions are not - particularly since insulation is already on the agenda.

Ironically domestic dwelling insulation has been done to death already.It seems that they want to go down the old Green Deal route which fell on it’s arse,but this time at no cost to each household.So free boilers,windows and I’m presuming solar (Minefield) panels.+Solid wall insulation for the older properties.That is a gigantic outlay even if it might recoup it’s own costs in the long run.Plus it would take years,with no chance of them meeting their targets.Maybe Insulate Britain’s top bod has shares in Worcester Bosch or something??

[Dunge]

1 hour ago, Carl the Llama said:

Voting tory implies you're pro a lot of rather unsavoury things:  Starving school kids, NI tax hikes in lieu of increasing the tax rates for our highest earners, deregulation, letting the bodies pile high, and so on... 

Someone posted a while back “how can anyone still consider voting Tory?” Fair question to ask, although not one I wanted to have a crack at answering straight after a shit result in the football. 

 

The simple answer is that I don’t think they’re as bad as others clearly do. In the above list, the first (while the overall issue is something where they were embarrassed by Marcus Rashford) is clearly as exaggeration, the second is a major discussion over the future funding of social care, which I suspect doesn’t have an answer that’s either practical or popular, the third I think is potentially wide-ranging and contains a significant discussion on the kind of increased flexibility I think should be embraced as part of Brexit, and the fourth is a throwaway comment not borne out by the government’s ultimate actions (a lockdown came regardless).

That’s not to say that I’m happy with the government; I find Boris’s lack of integrity particularly off-putting, I think they should have implemented a one-off wealth tax to help pay for the pandemic response, they should have delayed the implementation of Brexit given the ongoing pandemic, they should be treating our democratic systems with a lot more respect, and the top table is full of people who have been overpromoted. There’s probably more. But I think a lot of other criticism has been overblown, in that it either demands perfection where it can’t exist or doesn’t ring to me as fair.

 

I’m probably around 50/50 between Conservative and Labour right now, and will very likely vote for one of them at the next election. But I find howls from some places of “evil Tories” and “Tory scum” quite nauseating, and it does have an effect of pushing me back toward the blue.

Edited 27 September 2021 by Dunge

[UpTheLeagueFox]

2 hours ago, Dunge said:

I find howls from some places of “evil Tories” and “Tory scum” quite nauseating, and it does have an effect of pushing me back toward the blue.

Ahhhh yes the "kinder, gentler" politics the left claimed to want a while back.

[Strokes]

7 hours ago, Carl the Llama said:

Voting tory implies you're pro a lot of rather unsavoury things:  Starving school kids, NI tax hikes in lieu of increasing the tax rates for our highest earners, deregulation, letting the bodies pile high, and so on... 

😂 

Yeah nice try.

[Innovindil]

7 hours ago, Carl the Llama said:

Voting tory implies you're pro a lot of rather unsavoury things:  Starving school kids, NI tax hikes in lieu of increasing the tax rates for our highest earners, deregulation, letting the bodies pile high, and so on... 

Hopefully this isn't the new "brexit voters are racists". Bit long winded imo. 

[Voll Blau]

5 hours ago, UpTheLeagueFox said:

Ahhhh yes the "kinder, gentler" politics the left claimed to want a while back.

 

Arf.

[Footballwipe]

Yes, more narrative baiting for whichever side you support.

 

The less moderate right and less moderate left are just the same. Nasty, vicious, tribal, ugly. Plague on both the houses. Politics won't get kinder and gentler because of the whataboutery from both sides, and the fact that the nastiest ones float to the top and become deities to those who follow each side.

 

It's filthy, and I suspect many of us who sit and float in the centre as equally as incredulous as me. Labour got hijacked and an element of the Tory party has been hijacked.

 

Are there good tories and good Labour? Absolutely. Are many of us completely sick about the weird tribalism that's alienating any kind of rational debate and discourse. I think so.

Edited 27 September 2021 by Footballwipe

[fox_up_north]

It's tribalism all over. Giving humans social media was the worst thing. Tom from Myspace can fvck off. 

 

Seriously though, not all Tories are evil and not all Labour are loony left BUT the last few years - on both sides - they've let some real stinkers come to prominence. It makes me long for the days of boring politicians who just got on with the job - Hague, Major, Brown, etc. 

[Dunge]

1 hour ago, Voll Blau said:

 

Arf.

Today’s edition of “Possibly drunk and definitely arrogant man thinks he’s hilarious.”

 

In some ways this isn’t anything new - These kind of tasteless and ill-advised “jokes” have been around for centuries. The difference now is that everything’s recorded, either on film & sound or on a social media platform. Everyone knows about it. People like him have to adjust their behaviour to a higher standard.

 

It’s no wonder that people are sick of politicians.

[Carl the Llama]

I feel a few of you failed to understand the connection between my comment and the statement it was responding to.  Your high horse is a shetland pony

[Dunge]

5 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

I feel a few of you failed to understand the connection between my comment and the statement it was responding to.  Your high horse is a shetland pony

I was more using your comment as a reference than replying directly. It’s really more of a pommel horse.