Brendan Rodgers

[Mendi]

How is he still in a job 

[Fox92]

2 minutes ago, Dames said:

Errors true but the shift in mindset was clear, the players retreated against a team that had already finished the season and let them back into it. A mentality that is set from the top. 

For me if Kasper didn’t make the error then we don’t go on to lose the game. 
 

I can’t disagree with mentality, I do think that’s always been an issue. 

[st albans fox]

Whilst we look at the no shots on target and the lack of intensity added to the high line defending, the board are likely way less reactive and see a squad in transition which has approx a point a game which should be enough to keep them up.  They see Saturday evening as an anomoly because the stats say we should have won the game……….

 

I’m  afraid they have way less passion than us and hence make decisions based on different metrics and within different context. 
 

until we are cut adrift from safety I just don’t see them acting.  
 

madders tweet yesterday shows for sure that he hasn’t lost the dressing room. 

[The Doctor]

38 minutes ago, norwichfox said:

Have we ever sacked a manager on a Tuesday?

shakespeare was actually, but we were the Monday night game. 

[smudgerfox]

6 hours ago, Feed The Yak!! said:

 

Bit over 18 months for me. Only Deeney Day rivals the final game of the 20/21 season as the most depressing match I've seen as a Leicester fan.
 

After capitulating at the end of 19/20, throwing away a 14 point cushion, we'd done the exact same thing again, playing like relegation candidates for the latter half of the season (The FA Cup win was a miracle that I'll forever be grateful for because 99 times out of a hundred we lose that game and had Chilwell started his run half a second later, we would have)

Somehow, we still had a chance of a CL spot if we beat Spurs at home and Chelsea slipped up at Villa. Something that struck me within the first 5 minutes was how unmotivated Tottenham looked. Their fans had already joked before the game that they wouldn't want to do Chelsea any favours and that 7th place was a less than attractive prospect due to the new conference league. When the game started, though, it didn't seem like a joke anymore. They really did look like they were already on the beach.
 

We were 2-1 up in the 75th minute and Villa were beating Chelsea. All we had to do was see out the game. We had everything to play for. Spurs looked like they couldn't care less. And there's really no explanation for what happened next. We conceded 3 goals in 20 minutes. The last of which involved Bale waltzing through our entire defence in a manner not too dissimilar to Blackburn's second goal just last week.
 

After Deeney Day, I was devastated but something about that collective pain seemed to galvanise the players and they stormed the league the next year, determined not to leave anything to chance. Under Brendan Rodgers, nobody is galvanised by anything. The same mistakes are repeated over and over. I’ve lost track of the number of humiliations and abject collapses we’ve been subjected to. If anything, the grooves seem to be carved more deeply each time, expediting the patterns of failure leaving us more and more fragile with every passing game.
 

The response to Southampton's penalty miss was particularly alarming, as in some kind of paradoxical way the players seemed to be aware there was a pressure to respond and managed to retreat even further, conceding shortly afterwards.
 

The mentality that’s been instilled into this team means we’re only ever going to move in one direction. The best time to remove it was a little over 18 months ago. The next best time is now.

I agree with this except for the Deeney Day bit. I think if that team had gone up we’d have had a demoralising relegation the following season. We were much better prepared the following season - obviously I was gutted at the time though!

 

If you look at some of the results in our fifth place finish seasons - there were absolutely farcical games in which the team just seemed to collapse. Leads sacrificed in injury time, and the set piece problem.  We shouldn’t have needed to beat Spurs that day - we should have been over the line. We would have been under a more ruthless manager imposing a more ruthless ethic in his team.

 

Getting Champions League two seasons on the trot - and I said this at the time - would have transformed our clubs finances and our playing squad. The door was briefly open but we didn’t walk through it. The FA Cup win let him off the hook (and a curious willingness of many in the fanbase to accept fifth when we so obviously should have finished top 4). In the summer that followed,  the non-sale of any prized asset and recruitment of five players gave the illusion of a club still moving forwards. That would have been the case but the Congerton-led recruitment turned out to be a joke. The failure to identify our vulnerability at centre back after the Fofana injury and to make a signing which addressed this absence, was the final nail in the coffin.

 

Since that time, we have been going backwards as a club. We now have a situation in which not one part of the club is functioning well. Not the academy and development teams, not the women’s team,  not the injury and medicine management, not the young players out on loan. Not the game management. We’ve fixed (ish) the set piece defensive problem - by bringing in another coach. That’s all that needs to be said. 

 

[Dahnsouff]

32 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Whilst we look at the no shots on target and the lack of intensity added to the high line defending, the board are likely way less reactive and see a squad in transition which has approx a point a game which should be enough to keep them up.  They see Saturday evening as an anomoly because the stats say we should have won the game……….

 

I’m  afraid they have way less passion than us and hence make decisions based on different metrics and within different context. 
 

until we are cut adrift from safety I just don’t see them acting.  
 

madders tweet yesterday shows for sure that he hasn’t lost the dressing room. 

Like it or not, this seems on the money I reckon.

[Richmondfox]

33 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Whilst we look at the no shots on target and the lack of intensity added to the high line defending, the board are likely way less reactive and see a squad in transition which has approx a point a game which should be enough to keep them up.  They see Saturday evening as an anomoly because the stats say we should have won the game……….

 

I’m  afraid they have way less passion than us and hence make decisions based on different metrics and within different context. 
 

until we are cut adrift from safety I just don’t see them acting.  
 

madders tweet yesterday shows for sure that he hasn’t lost the dressing room. 

That Madders tweet to me confirmed that they are all suffering from Stockholm syndrome.

[filbertway]

5 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Like it or not, this seems on the money I reckon.

I think you're right.

 

It'll be the youngest squad in transition I've ever seen before

 

 

It's what makes me finally confident we'll actually drop, nobody is actually willing to accept the reality of the situation. Our club should not be in this position and yet Madders confirms that nobody that matters genuinely gives a damn or can see it.

 

 

[RonnieTodger]

I still can’t believe we finished 8th last season. I was miserable for about 95% of it. 

[Jaspa]

Still 2yrs left on his contract

[dmayne7]

21 minutes ago, RonnieTodger said:

I still can’t believe we finished 8th last season. I was miserable for about 95% of it. 

Purely because of the quality of individuals at our disposal bailing us out. Football was an absolute disgrace, particularly the defending which wasn't even football league standard.

 

So pleased it's completely different now...

[Fox92]

9 minutes ago, dmayne7 said:

Purely because of the quality of individuals at our disposal bailing us out. Football was an absolute disgrace, particularly the defending which wasn't even football league standard.

 

So pleased it's completely different now...

It was their fault in the first place.

[don_danbury]

8 minutes ago, dmayne7 said:

Purely because of the quality of individuals at our disposal bailing us out. Football was an absolute disgrace, particularly the defending which wasn't even football league standard.

 

So pleased it's completely different now...

13th through most of the season. Our last few games were what got 8th. Facing sides that were either already down or safe.

[Fox92]

5 minutes ago, don_danbury said:

13th through most of the season. Our last few games were what got 8th. Facing sides that were either already down or safe.

13th, mid table, because we were / are mid table at best. Too many people have to much faith in this group of players, to me it lacks quality. Plus the fact we have lost quality players over the last two or three years without replacing them, including Vardy who heads towards retirement.

 

I think a new manager is the first starting place, but we need better players as well.

Edited 7 March 2023 by Fox92

[dmayne7]

2 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

13th, mid table, because we were / are mid table at best. Too many people have to much faith in this group of players, to me it lacks quality. Plus the fact we have lost quality players over the last two or three years without replacing them, including Vardy who heads towards retirement.

 

I think a new manager is the first starting place, but we need better players as well.

So what you're saying is that Brendan did an absolutely amazing job in his first 2 years, probably some of the best management the premier league has ever had? Some are past it such as Vardy, Evans or suffered awful injuries and aren't there same (Ricardo). Current form and confidence is crap so they're not at the same level but the amount of players who were up there with the very best in their respective positions elevates this squad far above what you're describing. I don't think 15+ players in the squad are actually over the hill when they're only in their mid 20's.

 

This summer gone was the only one where we lost key players and didn't replace them with players of adequate quality.

 

Goes without saying the squad needs freshening up but do you actually think the likes of Fulham, Brentford, Brighton even Newcastle have better squads than us, let alone 15ish points better off than us at this stage of the season?

[pmcla26]

1 minute ago, dmayne7 said:

So what you're saying is that Brendan did an absolutely amazing job in his first 2 years, probably some of the best management the premier league has ever had? Some are past it such as Vardy, Evans or suffered awful injuries and aren't there same (Ricardo). Current form and confidence is crap so they're not at the same level but the amount of players who were up there with the very best in their respective positions elevates this squad far above what you're describing. I don't think 15+ players in the squad are actually over the hill when they're only in their mid 20's.

 

This summer gone was the only one where we lost key players and didn't replace them with players of adequate quality.

 

Goes without saying the squad needs freshening up but do you actually think the likes of Fulham, Brentford, Brighton even Newcastle have better squads than us, let alone 15ish points better off than us at this stage of the season?

The squad is about 10th-15th best in the league. 

Edited 7 March 2023 by Pete52

[dmayne7]

15 minutes ago, Pete52 said:

The squad is about 10th-15th best in the league. 

Not on ability it isn't. 15th best 

[foxfanazer]

20 minutes ago, Pete52 said:

The squad is about 10th-15th best in the league. 

I'm sure you thought that at the start of the season. Any more excuses?

[pmcla26]

50 minutes ago, dmayne7 said:

Not on ability it isn't. 15th best 

10th-15th because you can argue a lot of sides are better/worse than eachother week on week. This is my opinion on who is stronger: 

All the big 6 + Newcastle, Brighton. 

Fulham and Brentford's starting 11's are better cohesively (so squad was probably the wrong word for me to use, apologies). That's 10.  

Then you can argue the rest of the squads about who's better/worse. 

45 minutes ago, foxfanazer said:

I'm sure you thought that at the start of the season. Any more excuses?

I didn't tbh, I thought we were around 8th/9th strongest. This season has proved quite a few of those players aren't at that level. 

 

@dmayne7 - I've ran out of posts so I'll reply here: 

I agree with the confidence points and that they are well coached. I'd say I agree we lack the former but the latter is debatable. 

 

This isn't the same side that achieved those 5th, 5th and 8th place finishes and won an FA Cup. We basically have no Vardy now, no Evans, Ricardo and Ndidi are both broken after injuries, Fofana and Chilwell both gone, Soyuncu we basically don't have. Schmeichel and Albrighton aren't here. Perez is gone. That's nearly the whole side changed, and particularly that spine of Schmeichel, Evans, Ndidi and Vardy. 

 

There is quality within the group - Maddison, Iheanacho & Barnes being the 3 standouts. Defensively, Castagne is OK, Amartey and Thomas aren't good enough for this level, Vestergaard is crap, and the two centre-backs playing at the moment both appear to be just average. JJ and Ricardo injury prone. Kristiansen looks promising.

 

Midfield wise, the only centre-midfielder who is really good enough to start for a top half team is Tielemans. KDH is ok. The rest are average/crap, or in Ndidi's case, broken following injuries. 

 

Maddison is obviously the player of real quality. Barnes is too, but inconsistent. Jury still out on Tete. 

 

Strikers-wise, Vardy is done, Daka is ineffective currently and Iheanacho is decent. 

 

So overall, we've gone from having 14-ish top half quality players 2 years ago to having about 7/8 now. The manager should be doing better with what he has, but getting a bit tired of the narrative that it's completely on him and I still don't think he should be sacked, when there are multiple factors at play. We're just not very good. 

Edited 7 March 2023 by Pete52

[Fox92]

6 minutes ago, dmayne7 said:

So what you're saying is that Brendan did an absolutely amazing job in his first 2 years, probably some of the best management the premier league has ever had? Some are past it such as Vardy, Evans or suffered awful injuries and aren't there same (Ricardo). Current form and confidence is crap so they're not at the same level but the amount of players who were up there with the very best in their respective positions elevates this squad far above what you're describing. I don't think 15+ players in the squad are actually over the hill when they're only in their mid 20's.

 

This summer gone was the only one where we lost key players and didn't replace them with players of adequate quality.

 

Goes without saying the squad needs freshening up but do you actually think the likes of Fulham, Brentford, Brighton even Newcastle have better squads than us, let alone 15ish points better off than us at this stage of the season?

Dunno about some of the best management the PL has ever had, but definitely some of the best this club has ever had. The first part of 19/20 especially was among the best I've ever seen us play.

 

But that was three years ago. Vardy and Evans were brilliant then but are now much older and Evans especially has consistent injury problems. So that's two key players from that season now not at the same level. Ricardo has had consistent injuries since too. From that season, Soyuncu hasn't been at the same level and N'didi has dropped off in such a key area of the pitch. We also lost a good left back in Chilwell and both Schmeichel and Perez has moved on too.

 

I do not think Fulham have a better squad than us, no. But they're having a good season. And that's what it is, it's one season. Your average player will have one good season but then drop off back to his level (I always argue Soyuncu with this one, because he had one good season). We've all seen teams like Fulham before, they come up and have a good season but then struggle the following season because they haven't got the quality to sustain it. See Ipswich, Reading, Wigan, Sheffield United who all did the same. I will be amazed if Fulham are pushing Europe again next season. Same with Newcastle, average players have a good half season but now can't seem to keep that level up. Howe was getting the absoloute best out of them earlier this season but I don't think they are better players than what we have (aside from Bruno).

 

Good players get away with having one poor season. Form is temporary and the key question for me is are the majority of our players in poor form or is it just at their level? For example, If I saw someone like KDH at another club I don't think oh wow we should buy him. Same with Ward, he isn't good enough and is another example of us not replacing key players with adequate quality, a point that you make too. I do think we have good players (Tielelems, Maddison and Ricardo are excellent footballers) but I don't think we have enough. I'm not denying we need to change manager, I do want Rodgers out, but we do need a squad refresh and even no we're still not bringing in players to replace those leaving (I know Fofona is an excellent defender but I'm still skeptical about both centre backs).

[Nobbyburton]

3 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

Dunno about some of the best management the PL has ever had, but definitely some of the best this club has ever had. The first part of 19/20 especially was among the best I've ever seen us play.

 

But that was three years ago. Vardy and Evans were brilliant then but are now much older and Evans especially has consistent injury problems. So that's two key players from that season now not at the same level. Ricardo has had consistent injuries since too. From that season, Soyuncu hasn't been at the same level and N'didi has dropped off in such a key area of the pitch. We also lost a good left back in Chilwell and both Schmeichel and Perez has moved on too.

 

I do not think Fulham have a better squad than us, no. But they're having a good season. And that's what it is, it's one season. Your average player will have one good season but then drop off back to his level (I always argue Soyuncu with this one, because he had one good season). We've all seen teams like Fulham before, they come up and have a good season but then struggle the following season because they haven't got the quality to sustain it. See Ipswich, Reading, Wigan, Sheffield United who all did the same. I will be amazed if Fulham are pushing Europe again next season. Same with Newcastle, average players have a good half season but now can't seem to keep that level up. Howe was getting the absoloute best out of them earlier this season but I don't think they are better players than what we have (aside from Bruno).

 

Good players get away with having one poor season. Form is temporary and the key question for me is are the majority of our players in poor form or is it just at their level? For example, If I saw someone like KDH at another club I don't think oh wow we should buy him. Same with Ward, he isn't good enough and is another example of us not replacing key players with adequate quality, a point that you make too. I do think we have good players (Tielelems, Maddison and Ricardo are excellent footballers) but I don't think we have enough. I'm not denying we need to change manager, I do want Rodgers out, but we do need a squad refresh and even no we're still not bringing in players to replace those leaving (I know Fofona is an excellent defender but I'm still skeptical about both centre backs).

 

I'd say it was the best, there was so much talk about how our side was better than the title winning side at that point and we were well involved at the top with 2 of the best teams the Prem has seen.

[fairbanksh]

Rodgers saga will continue. While I'm desperate for him to go more scrutiny must be directed to the board. 

 Contract situation ludicrous

Planning and recruitment very poor

We've gone from being model run to utter farce. 

[dmayne7]

28 minutes ago, Pete52 said:

10th-15th because you can argue a lot of sides are better/worse than eachother week on week. This is my opinion on who is stronger: 

All the big 6 + Newcastle, Brighton. 

Fulham and Brentford's starting 11's are better cohesively (so squad was probably the wrong word for me to use, apologies). That's 10.  

Then you can argue the rest of the squads about who's better/worse. 

I didn't tbh, I thought we were around 8th/9th strongest. This season has proved quite a few of those players aren't at that level. 

Better teams, yes because they have confidence and those 4 teams are well coached. We have neither of these things.

 

Even if people don't think our squad is good, you can't finish 5th, 5th then 8th (playing poorly) without a very good group of players no matter how great you think the manager might be.

 

And people seem so willing to say that our group of players are of poor quality because of where we currently, ignoring the ability they have shown consistently over the past few years, yet the teams listed above, suddenly have better players based on 2/3 of a season despite having being far behind where we have been for the past few years.

 

You look at it in this context and it makes it even more stark that the manager is at fault.

[dmayne7]

36 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

Dunno about some of the best management the PL has ever had, but definitely some of the best this club has ever had. The first part of 19/20 especially was among the best I've ever seen us play.

 

But that was three years ago. Vardy and Evans were brilliant then but are now much older and Evans especially has consistent injury problems. So that's two key players from that season now not at the same level. Ricardo has had consistent injuries since too. From that season, Soyuncu hasn't been at the same level and N'didi has dropped off in such a key area of the pitch. We also lost a good left back in Chilwell and both Schmeichel and Perez has moved on too.

 

I do not think Fulham have a better squad than us, no. But they're having a good season. And that's what it is, it's one season. Your average player will have one good season but then drop off back to his level (I always argue Soyuncu with this one, because he had one good season). We've all seen teams like Fulham before, they come up and have a good season but then struggle the following season because they haven't got the quality to sustain it. See Ipswich, Reading, Wigan, Sheffield United who all did the same. I will be amazed if Fulham are pushing Europe again next season. Same with Newcastle, average players have a good half season but now can't seem to keep that level up. Howe was getting the absoloute best out of them earlier this season but I don't think they are better players than what we have (aside from Bruno).

 

Good players get away with having one poor season. Form is temporary and the key question for me is are the majority of our players in poor form or is it just at their level? For example, If I saw someone like KDH at another club I don't think oh wow we should buy him. Same with Ward, he isn't good enough and is another example of us not replacing key players with adequate quality, a point that you make too. I do think we have good players (Tielelems, Maddison and Ricardo are excellent footballers) but I don't think we have enough. I'm not denying we need to change manager, I do want Rodgers out, but we do need a squad refresh and even no we're still not bringing in players to replace those leaving (I know Fofona is an excellent defender but I'm still skeptical about both centre backs).

19/20 he did a fantastic job and whilst we blew it, I don't view it as a bottle job unlike the following season.

 

I agreed that players have dropped off but excluding the ones I listed, you can except maybe 1 or 2 to have peaked at 26/27 and will have shorter top level careers but not 15 or so guys who are now seemingly worse. That's purely coaching and confidence.

 

The team is definitely weaker this year because of Kasper and Fofana; don't think there's a debate to be had. But if you take Chilwell (who I rate very highly unlike many on here), Justin came in and played at a ridiculous level, far beyond what Chilwell ever did. You reference Soyuncu but he was also in the PFA TOTY in Germany and he was still good in 20/21. Struggled last year but it's still inexplicable that he's not been given a go in a defence that has leaked so many goals, and is now going on a free transfer. Perez is absolutely no loss.

 

KDH was fantastic last season and has been poor this year. Given it's a sample size of 2 seasons at this level, the question will be which one of those seasons represents the quality of player he is. The majority of our starting XI have proven over a number of years that they are very good players at this level.

 

But you haven't kind of touched on the form and cohesion aspect with other teams. My point is that in terms of pure ability, look at all the players in the league and pull out the ones that have had 2/3 years of very good performances (to use your point about most players having one good season) and we'd have a far higher number than any of the teams we're supposedly competing with. On current form, do we have poor quality? Absolutely and the players have to do better. But surely a change of manager with a fresh approach and building the players up (rather than constantly belittling them) COULD get them back to the levels they were at. But it's almost a guarantee that individual performances would recover. And by bringing in 2/3 starters and a new manager that could galvanise the current players but it's a pointless exercise unless it happens under a new regime which doesn't just include Brendan but some structural changes.

 

Sadly, the inactivity in the summer as losing Fofana, Kasper and Evans/Vardy to an extent have taken us from being as good as those teams competing for the 4th champions league spot (especially with Arsenal's improvement) and created a gap. We lack the mentality too but then again we did win an FA Cup with a weakened squad. But in terms of player ability, the fact we're where we are in the league, produced a pitiful showing in the cups and on such a decline, should not be happening.

[Hammo]

We all know that there is a severe 'mentality' issue with this team - the charge sheet has long been weighed down with indisputable evidence; the Southampton debacle just added more - but although Rodgers frequently calls out his players publicly (in a veiled, Machiavellian kind of way), has he ever gone on record admitting that this 'bottler syndrome' (for want of a better expression) is a fundamental problem that urgently needs to be fixed?

 

All we ever hear, like Saturday, is that 'they gave everything' or 'worked hard' or other such inane, deflective claptrap.

 

Perhaps Rodgers refuses to acknowledge that the team's mentality is weak or soft because he knows full well that the very same thing applies to him; indeed, that it stems from him.