Farrington fox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 If he doesn't sort this shit defending out. He'll have to be moved on. It's becoming embarrassing, knowing that every time you concede a corner there's a fair chance they'll concede a goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickyblueeyes Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 2 minutes ago, Fox92 said: Doesn't make him a good coach. It certainly doesn’t make him a donkey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox92 Posted 31 October 2021 Author Share Posted 31 October 2021 11 minutes ago, Mickyblueeyes said: It certainly doesn’t make him a donkey. That's true though I wasn't responding to that point as it's a bit harsh. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 1 hour ago, Fox92 said: He's the manager. Him (and his team) set the routines up. Players must be following that. Are you now suggesting the players do not listen? It's not even an isolated incident. We keep conceding from corners so how we defend them must be wrong and that's down to the manager. Players make mistakes, whether we man mark or zonally mark or do a mixture of both, players still need to mark and win the first contact. Could he do better, yes. Do the players need to do better, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 1 hour ago, Lako42 said: I never said they are always the reason. Things aren't always black and white, there are crossovers in cause of many things. The way we lined up yesterday was not effective against the way Arsenal approached thre game. It lead to us struggling to have any foothold in the game and essentially made the right hand side completely useless. This adds pressure, it makes every aspect of the game harder and in turn leads to the things you mentioned go missing. We were completely overrun out wide in the 1st half, this means the wide players can't offer anything in terms of support to the central players and any link up becomes impossible. It was crying out for 442 of 4411 at half time and that's what the manager did, so he clearly thought the shape was having a negative effect on our play. So did you comment in the match thread that the line up was wrong before KO. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Whether every system you play, the player have to execute it. Bad defending let us down yesterday not the system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox92 Posted 31 October 2021 Author Share Posted 31 October 2021 3 minutes ago, coolhandfox said: Players make mistakes, whether we man mark or zonally mark or do a mixture of both, players still need to mark and win the first contact. Could he do better, yes. Do the players need to do better, yes. Well yes players need to do more but on the initial setup we need players in better positions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboFox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 The set piece issue at both ends of the pitch continues to be a massive albatross after nearly 3 years. It’s quite clear Rodgers doesn’t know how to resolve it, and that is worrying. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 11 minutes ago, Fox92 said: Well yes players need to do more but on the initial setup we need players in better positions. So you commented in the match thread before KO, initial setup was wrong before KO? Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox92 Posted 31 October 2021 Author Share Posted 31 October 2021 1 minute ago, coolhandfox said: So you commented in the match thread before KO, initial setup was wrong before KO? Hindsight is a wonderful thing. No but me and the bloke next to me in the ground both said the same thing. I'm right behind the goal at home games, you can see players line up doing nothing and yesterday three around the front post area with no Arsenal player near. A couple of times Aubameyang peeled off to the back post and was free. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pliskin Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 2 hours ago, Ric Flair said: I think part of this is Rodgers and the coaches instructions. I too often get frustrated with the positions he takes up but Rodgers has said on a number of occasions that they want Barnes to sit high up and peg the opposition back but I do wonder if they could still do this much better. I watched him like a hawk when he came on yesterday as I was sat near his side and on the ball, teams absolutely shit it but he could and should get on the ball more, and when he's on form he does. He was staying wide left high up until we got the ball in Tielemans/Maddison central areas and then he seemed to tuck in close to the defence where the ball in to him then became less of an option, it was odd. Was still a huge difference in the way we took it to them 2nd half. We need to get him back cobfident/determined/angry and we're a much better team for it. Absolutely agree, he could be even better though, with allowing him a bit more freedom to run between the lines. He gets into great starting positions, and you think he is about to explode into a space, because if he did, no one is catching him, and because of his running power and directions he would end up being clattered or he could score/assist. Like you say potentially he has been a victim of the coaching style, we need to allow him to make those runs into the space, I’m almost certain it would cause even more issues. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanSP Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 15 minutes ago, Fox92 said: Well yes players need to do more but on the initial setup we need players in better positions. Considering it was the same set up that saw us get back in to good form, against sides that press us high and where we had scored a hatful, it was sensible to continue with it and not change it (even slightly). I think the problem was perhaps the mentality. Maybe we didn't expect Arsenal to come at us all guns blazing and so quick out of the blocks. Our whole mindset (which I think players believe in as well) is to grasp control of the game in tempo and not let sides overrun us. For whatever reason yesterday, that didn't happen. It's up to the players to take responsibility on the pitch and not enough players did that yesterday. Rodgers chose the right lineup yesterday, but perhaps the tactical side he was bettered on at the start. On another day, we recover from that scoring a goal in the 2nd part of the first half, or at least in the 2nd half to put the opposition under more pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inckley fox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 Didn't he say that the set-piece problem was 'on-going' in his post-match? I don't think he's tried to brush it under the carpet, and if he does that publicly in order to divert attention, then it'll be very different on the training ground. It doesn't change the fact that we're still crap at set pieces, and have been for ages, but there you go! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest StevieLynex Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 Lots of talk about Nuno being under pressure, and yet he's above Brendan in the table? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 9 minutes ago, StevieLynex said: Lots of talk about Nuno being under pressure, and yet he's above Brendan in the table? His not finish 5th twice and won a FA cup. BR has money in the bank Nuno doesn't, simple Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lako42 Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 1 hour ago, coolhandfox said: So did you comment in the match thread that the line up was wrong before KO. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. Whether every system you play, the player have to execute it. Bad defending let us down yesterday not the system. No, I was actually at the pub before going to the game, talking about it in person. I get some statements from people if necessary. Let's not talk about the game then because it's hindsight.... Ridiculous 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 37 minutes ago, Lako42 said: No, I was actually at the pub before going to the game, talking about it in person. I get some statements from people if necessary. Let's not talk about the game then because it's hindsight.... Ridiculous Not what I said, don't get rattled. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 3 hours ago, coolhandfox said: Systems don't cause you to miss place passes or lose 50/50s, follow your runners or win the first contact at corners. Same system saw us win 3 games in a row. True but football is littered with fine margins and in all the games we've played with 3 at the back since the return from the international break has seen us either concede early or come close to. The only difference yesterday was we couldn't score once, let alone 2 or more so overall it looked a horrible performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 1 hour ago, Pliskin said: Absolutely agree, he could be even better though, with allowing him a bit more freedom to run between the lines. He gets into great starting positions, and you think he is about to explode into a space, because if he did, no one is catching him, and because of his running power and directions he would end up being clattered or he could score/assist. Like you say potentially he has been a victim of the coaching style, we need to allow him to make those runs into the space, I’m almost certain it would cause even more issues. Rodgers is all about structure, as opposed to creative licence and you can tell at times. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ARM1968 Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 2 minutes ago, Ric Flair said: Rodgers is all about structure, as opposed to creative licence and you can tell at times. Well he should bloody structure the defence of set pieces then really. Everyone says what an awesome coach he is, but the dire set pieces defensively and attacking continue. THAT is NOT the sign of a good coach. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 3 hours ago, Gazza M said: He is a stubborn mule. The reason the set piece problem hasn't been resolved is because he believes his way is right and it will click. 3 years later and we are still waiting when clear as day we need to go to man marking and get our keeper off his line when needed to come and deal with it. This is a 2nd hand quote i've read of here so i'm not entirely sure it's true but I think it well could be but I read something about him 'not believing in a plan B, you just have to do plan A better'. The problem is plan A blatently isn't working, not matter how well you do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 Just now, Matt said: This is a 2nd hand quote i've read of here so i'm not entirely sure it's true but I think it well could be but I read something about him 'not believing in a plan B, you just have to do plan A better'. The problem is plan A blatently isn't working, not matter how well you do it. I don't think he's that stubborn, there's been many things he's switched up that go against his preferred style and principle, look at going to 2 up top and 3 at the back or dropping off and going direct vs the big 6 last season where we were phenomenal. What he does seem to have though is a couple of glaring weaknesses/blind spots/achilles heels that cloud him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
volpeazzurro Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 3 hours ago, coolhandfox said: Do you think he told them to do nothing? Whatever he's telling them it's been going on for a long time now, not just this season yet, one good result against a poor Manchester United side and some thought the problem was cured. The performance against Brentford was also piss poor but, not unlike many games last season where we scraped a win or draw, it was achieved through a moment of individual talent from one of our better players and not through a convincing team performance. If it hadn't been for Iheanacho who, lest we forget, Rodgers was reluctant to pick and only did so because he had to through injury, I believe we'd have finished just below halfway which would have been fitting in terms of our overall performances in my opinion. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Always Next Year Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 30 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said: Whatever he's telling them it's been going on for a long time now, not just this season yet, one good result against a poor Manchester United side and some thought the problem was cured. The performance against Brentford was also piss poor but, not unlike many games last season where we scraped a win or draw, it was achieved through a moment of individual talent from one of our better players and not through a convincing team performance. If it hadn't been for Iheanacho who, lest we forget, Rodgers was reluctant to pick and only did so because he had to through injury, I believe we'd have finished just below halfway which would have been fitting in terms of our overall performances in my opinion. With so many top jobs around his he pushing to get sacked rather than be seen to walk, his he also trying to keep everyone happy as he continues to swap players around. How can a team that was basically the same team that beat Man U be a complete shambles for the majority of the first half, it wasn’t until Barnes came on that we started to attack them, but as usual the game was already lost. 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
honeybradger Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 It is his job to mentally prepare the players before a game, if all the players come out half asleep then it's not an individual issue It is his job to maintain and improve the technical ability of the players in training, if all the players are missing passes then it's not an individual issue It's his job to organise a pressing system, to advise the players when to tactically foul and to get the players working, if the opposition are running right through us then it's not an individual issue It's his job to organise us on set pieces, if the players dont look like they know what theyre doing and the opposition are getting a run up on our players/have a free man in the box then it's not an individual issue. Stop blaming the players when our problems are across the board, and stop blaming our problems on players missing, our defensive problems still persist even with Evans back, the issue lies with Rodgers at the moment, it's his job to get the players playing consistently well, we have the squad for it. A general lack of form is almost always down to the manager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanSP Posted 31 October 2021 Share Posted 31 October 2021 6 minutes ago, honeybradger said: It is his job to mentally prepare the players before a game, if all the players come out half asleep then it's not an individual issue It is his job to maintain and improve the technical ability of the players in training, if all the players are missing passes then it's not an individual issue It's his job to organise a pressing system, to advise the players when to tactically foul and to get the players working, if the opposition are running right through us then it's not an individual issue It's his job to organise us on set pieces, if the players dont look like they know what theyre doing and the opposition are getting a run up on our players/have a free man in the box then it's not an individual issue. Stop blaming the players when our problems are across the board, and stop blaming our problems on players missing, our defensive problems still persist even with Evans back, the issue lies with Rodgers at the moment, it's his job to get the players playing consistently well, we have the squad for it. A general lack of form is almost always down to the manager It's naive to solely blame Rodgers. It's naive to solely blame players. It's a mixture of both. It's also quite lazy just to say it's always the manager. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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