Brendan Rodgers

[Eskay]

5 minutes ago, Cadno'r Cymoedd said:

Agree with most but... Do you think Chelsea were cacking themselves when they saw Brentford's line up? No. But Brentford battered them in the last 20 minutes and only Mendy's brilliance and some luck saved them from the draw or defeat. 

Good point - but I think individual qualities of some Brentfords players would have given them cause for concern. Everyone knows they run, press, pass quickly.

 

What is our identity currently? All I know is people think we are a tidy going forward sometimes....and can't defend set pieces. 

 

It's shocking that 1) We still rely on Marc Albrighton and Dan Amartey and 2) One player not being available (Youri) meant we had to make so many changes and totally removed any sort of playing style.

 

We have won 2 games in 9. Getting Little Wes AND JJ back (lets assume they are in form right away!) is NOT going to change that drastically.

Edited 23 November 2021 by Eskay
point added

[coolhandfox]

6 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

I agree with your central point that almost every manager makes some good and some bad signings. Of course, making the right signings is also only one aspect of successful management.

 

Shinji was signed under Pearson (4 days before he was sacked according to Wikipedia). Also, although Kante was signed under Ranieri, it seems well-established that he was essentially a Steve Walsh signing - although Claudio had the wisdom and humility to trust Walsh's judgment. My recollection is that we'd been lining him up for some time under the Pearson/Walsh regime, even if the signing was finally made by Claudio. I'm guessing that the £24m buy-out clause was the key element in him finally coming here, rather than the change of manager.

 

After those amendments, Puel's transfer record arguably looks the best, closely followed by Pearson's - and Ranieri's is possibly the worst......further confirmation that there's a lot more to successful management than buying the right players. I'm a massive Pearson fan and my best guess (we'll never know) is that we'd have made Europe under him in 15-16, but it was Claudio's adjustments to formation and tactics, on top of NP's foundations of squad and morale, that brought the title

 

I often wondered if Puel would make a better director of football then a manager.

[turlo]

43 minutes ago, jim5000 said:

Its not tosh, there are at least 6 clubs with more resources than us, and then at least another 5 with similar to us. That puts us in the top 12 and a reasonable expectation to finish between 6th and 10th. However it’s the most competitive league in the world and few clubs will over perform (West Ham this season) and a few will under perform. We are currently under performing having over performed for 2 seasons, but we are still roughly where we could expect, not necessarily want, to be given the quality of the league. We don’t have the squad depth to break and remain in the top 6 indefinitely.

 

Look at clubs like Spurs and Arsenal, even Man Utd. They have been shambolic over the past few years and we have finished above them, but they have far more money to throw at the problem than we do. We can’t go out and appoint someone alike Conte or drop 40m on a backup for Tielemans.

Over the past 2 seasons we had a squad that was widely considered as between the 5th & 8th best in the league with our best starting 11 closer to 5th. With the squad we had 5th was a good above par finish but not a massive over achievement. If we hadn't blown the run in on the last 2 seasons and finished 3rd like we should have, then we could call that an overachievement. 

[volpeazzurro]

2 hours ago, coolhandfox said:

Maybe.

 

But I'd be very surprised if a title winning manager has that little power.  Pretty sure I read that Mendy and Inler were definitely his signings. 

Mendy certainly sounds credible doesn't it but he denied having anything to do with the Inler signing. 

[Dahnsouff]

5 minutes ago, turlo said:

Over the past 2 seasons we had a squad that was widely considered as between the 5th & 8th best in the league with our best starting 11 closer to 5th. With the squad we had 5th was a good above par finish but not a massive over achievement. If we hadn't blown the run in on the last 2 seasons and finished 3rd like we should have, then we could call that an overachievement. 

Our projection by most was at best 6th, with an outlier of 5th by Phil McNulty, but you are right, between 5th - 8th seems reasonable and turned out to be accurate.

[Cadno'r Cymoedd]

34 minutes ago, Eskay said:

Good point - but I think individual qualities of some Brentfords players would have given them cause for concern. Everyone knows they run, press, pass quickly.

 

What is our identity currently? All I know is people think we are a tidy going forward sometimes....and can't defend set pieces. 

 

It's shocking that 1) We still rely on Marc Albrighton and Dan Amartey and 2) One player not being available (Youri) meant we had to make so many changes and totally removed any sort of playing style.

 

We have won 2 games in 9. Getting Little Wes AND JJ back (lets assume they are in form right away!) is NOT going to change that drastically.

To be fair to Amartey, for all his limitations, he has been our most consistent player in defence this seadon. 

[brookfox]

34 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

I often wondered if Puel would make a better director of football then a manager.

He’d certainly fit in well in the Bored Room!

[Sharpe's Fox]

We should have got top 4 while Chelsea and Manchester United were slumming it with PE teacher managers for the majority of two seasons for sure. Not sure why Brendan would not back himself to finish above them pair in that situation never mind how much money they were spending which doesn't take into account the context Chelsea had a transfer ban as well. With all that you have to say the 'overacheivement' comment was wrong.

 

Having said that the situation has clearly changed with the managers other clubs have now and you would have a point that a top eight finish should be expected at most.

[Dahnsouff]

37 minutes ago, Eskay said:

Good point - but I think individual qualities of some Brentfords players would have given them cause for concern. Everyone knows they run, press, pass quickly.

 

What is our identity currently? All I know is people think we are a tidy going forward sometimes....and can't defend set pieces. 

 

It's shocking that 1) We still rely on Marc Albrighton and Dan Amartey and 2) One player not being available (Youri) meant we had to make so many changes and totally removed any sort of playing style.

 

We have won 2 games in 9. Getting Little Wes AND JJ back (lets assume they are in form right away!) is NOT going to change that drastically.

(I don`t agree with much of the bit about Marc or Dan  but this bit I like as I cannot figure it out)

This is a good question I think. What type of team are we? Currently too technically poor to be a possession team, to slow and lacking in intensity to be counter attacking team, just a bit bland really 
Maybe we have just lost our way due to many potential factors, but whatever it is, Brendan needs the opportunity to fix it, and if he cannot then Top decides when enough is enough

[Stadt]

1 hour ago, ealingfox said:

This is exactly it. 
 

Only thing to add is we finished 9th under Puel which shows what the floor for this, now considerably better squad, actually is.

[Scotch]

I think we can all agree, we are NOT going to sack Rodgers. 

 

He would only have left had Utd came in and bought him out of his contract and that doesn't look to be happening as developments with Poch seem to be moving at a decent rate. 

 

I'm not exactly thrilled with him here purely for the fact that I don't enjoy watching Leicester under his guidance but if he's going to be here then we need to back him and the team and hope that he sets his ego aside and gets us winning again. 

 

I 100% believe that we won't be relegated under him so we just need to maybe suck it up for a season and see where it goes from here. Generally, once Rodgers starts biting back at the fans, it's the beginning of the end for him at a club so let's bide our time and hopefully it's his mouth that finally sees him undone and not his coaching ability. 

[mozartfox]

With Poch now apparently willing to come immediately,  I assume BR must place himself in the same position?  This could all end in tears he if misses out and Poch is installed.

[Finnegan]

1 minute ago, Scotch said:

I think we can all agree, we are NOT going to sack Rodgers. 

 

Mmh, I don't know. 

 

The management here sacked the manager that won Leicester City the Premier League because they had the understanding to know that the squad they had was too good to be relegation threatened, that going from 1st to bottom half wasn't acceptable and the bollocks to make that call in the face of massive public scrutiny. 

 

I don't think they'll be overly sentimental about it if we're still bottom half in a few months time and Rodgers is showing no evidence of stopping the slide. 

[An Sionnach]

2 minutes ago, Stadt said:

This is exactly it. 
 

Only thing to add is we finished 9th under Puel which shows what the floor for this, now considerably better squad, actually is.

Are we that much better? Vardy or the fear of Vardy has been a fundamental reason we have performed well. Maybe the fear has  gone in the opposition's mind and they look upon us now as nothing special. Jamie is still doing his job well but his form is more spasmodic these days.

[JonnyBoy]

Geoff Peters was on talk sport this morning saying only a handful of fans would be OK with Brendan leaving. i think he has underestimated that by quite somewhat reading this thread. 

 

Laura Woods couldn't believe any fans would be OK with him leaving. I like Laura but her knowledge on goings on outside the top 6 is poor.

[coolhandfox]

24 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Mendy certainly sounds credible doesn't it but he denied having anything to do with the Inler signing. 

I think most people though Inler was a great signing and who this Kante kid from the French 2 div. 

 

Funny how things turn out. 

[Dahnsouff]

Just now, JonnyBoy said:

Geoff Peters was on talk sport this morning saying only a handful of fans would be OK with Brendan leaving. i think he has underestimated that by quite somewhat reading this thread. 

 

Laura Woods couldn't believe any fans would be OK with him leaving. I like Laura but her knowledge on goings on outside the top 6 is poor.

We can be like a min Man Utd, chucking the boss out and then stand around looking at each other  

[Koke]

Analyse this 

 

 

[StanSP]

Just now, Koke said:

Analyse this 

 

 

Shows we were dominated by a strong Chelsea side and that our tactics and set up was wrong from the start. 

 

Nothing new that hasn't already been discussed in the last few days? 

 

It's very bad, granted. 

[JonnyBoy]

14 minutes ago, mozartfox said:

With Poch now apparently willing to come immediately,  I assume BR must place himself in the same position?  This could all end in tears he if misses out and Poch is installed.

 

it's like the managerial version of what happened with Kane in the summer, slightly lesser extent but interesting how it is going to play out

[Scotch]

4 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

Mmh, I don't know. 

 

The management here sacked the manager that won Leicester City the Premier League because they had the understanding to know that the squad they had was too good to be relegation threatened, that going from 1st to bottom half wasn't acceptable and the bollocks to make that call in the face of massive public scrutiny. 

 

I don't think they'll be overly sentimental about it if we're still bottom half in a few months time and Rodgers is showing no evidence of stopping the slide. 

I don't think it's a sentimentality issue rather a financial one. 

 

I have no idea of the figures involved but sacking him will cost a LOT of money, as would finding a suitable replacement. Money that will effect our ability to sign the quality needed to challenge for Europe. 

 

Not to mention that regardless of what you think of his ability, his reputation as being a top coach is undeniable (that's why we pay him so much) so there would be a fear of spending so much and ending up with a coach of a lesser calibre and the message that would send to potential signings. 

 

Sacking Claudio was simpler in that even though we won the league, the expectations of his replacement were simpler and it cost a whole lot less. 

[Finnegan]

Just now, Scotch said:

I don't think it's a sentimentality issue rather a financial one. 

 

I have no idea of the figures involved but sacking him will cost a LOT of money, as would finding a suitable replacement. Money that will effect our ability to sign the quality needed to challenge for Europe. 

 

Not to mention that regardless of what you think of his ability, his reputation as being a top coach is undeniable (that's why we pay him so much) so there would be a fear of spending so much and ending up with a coach of a lesser calibre and the message that would send to potential signings. 

 

Sacking Claudio was simpler in that even though we won the league, the expectations of his replacement were simpler and it cost a whole lot less. 

 

All fair points. 

[volpeazzurro]

1 minute ago, coolhandfox said:

I think most people though Inler was a great signing and who this Kante kid from the French 2 div. 

 

Funny how things turn out. 

Yes, must admit, on paper Inler did look a good signing at the time didn't he. That little lad Ngolo turned out pretty decent didn't he, saw him running around still somewhere recently, still looked quite useful to me! I think Ranieri inherited him though somewhat as although he was the first player I think to arrive when he got here, he'd been previously scouted by Walsh.

[tickler28]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

The beauty about why we've been able to do what we've done is because we have created a model that has built us a very very good squad that can compete with the top 6 and especially when one or two of them turn shit. We've worked bloody hard at doing so and have maintained the momentum to keep pushing and try to and shift the mindset from one us being the underdog to an elite club mentality.

 

Rodgers has talked at length about his desire for us to do that and he even encourages it throughout the club from the tea lady to the communications manager, everyone needs to be on board that this club isn't here to make up the numbers or that's its just happy to be here. It's It's insult to down play what we have been better than almost every club in this country at.

 

Now you are absolutely right that on a level playing field if we didn't have the position or the squad, manager, facilities, ideas and working practices that we have that we wouldn't be automatically better than those clubs that appear similar size to us but this isn't a level playing field and what's happened for us to regress is serious under performance for quite a long time now. Does that mean we shouldn't be somewhat upset by this capitulation when we know we are capable of so much better? A defeatist mindset like that is absolutely a 1 way ticket for us back to mediocrity and to get back in our lane. Well hopefully our owners won't sit back and stand for that, if they thought like that we'd never have done what we've done in the last 5-6 years.

 

We should demand better as fans and mirror the ask of our owners and manager who talks ambition and elite mentality until he's under pressure and then looks to squirm his way out of it ASAP, the little herbert.

A very very good squad? Disagree with that statement im afraid . Even if all our best players are firing on all cylinders which they're not you can't say that our squad is very very good with the following backup players:

 

Ward

Jakupovic

Amartey

Vestergaard

Benkovic

Bertrand

Thomas

Mendy

Choudhury 

Dewsbury-Hall 

Perez

Lookman

Daka

 

You can't seriously look at that list and say in addition to our strongest 11-14 players we have a very very good squad.....I'm not having that im afraid.....feel free to argue your case.

 

 

 

[Stadt]

13 minutes ago, An Sionnach said:

Are we that much better? Vardy or the fear of Vardy has been a fundamental reason we have performed well. Maybe the fear has  gone in the opposition's mind and they look upon us now as nothing special. Jamie is still doing his job well but his form is more spasmodic these days.

The team when we lost to Palace 4-1