Brendan Rodgers

[Ric Flair]

Needs to work on setting his team up to create and score goals as much as the defensive side of the game, in fact I'd argue that rectify our set piece issue and our overall defending is less under scrutiny than our goal scoring. Huge summer ahead.

[FLINTHAMFC]

13 hours ago, filbertway said:

I love that the argument "for" is still generally " eeeee I dont know much about football, why would you want sam allardyce instead of Rodgers"

I never seen anyone post that or anything like it. Are you saying any opinion not aligned with your own is not a valid one?

[Foxdiamond]

I know we are fed up but just who is an obvious candidate to come in and improve the situation. 

[Dan LCFC]

What's a bit mad about it is we've actually got our better defenders back now. There's less risk by being attacking. Would seem mental to play more attacking with the likes of Amartey there than with Fofana.

 

We have gotten slightly better at the back but our attacking has been absolutely abysmal recently. Like Wolves bad.

[Ric Flair]

14 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

What's a bit mad about it is we've actually got our better defenders back now. There's less risk by being attacking. Would seem mental to play more attacking with the likes of Amartey there than with Fofana.

 

We have gotten slightly better at the back but our attacking has been absolutely abysmal recently. Like Wolves bad.

Attacking wise we've really not been that spectacular all season, we were a bit more expansive when shipping a load of goals up to Xmas but a lot of that was in a 4-2-3-1 with Vardy fit and firing. Since we've moved to 4-3-3 we've struggled going forward and neither Daka or Iheanacho has had the necessary service to be much of a threat, in this system the chances tend to fall to the wingers and midfielders where we are erratic to say the least.

[Dan LCFC]

1 minute ago, Ric Flair said:

Attacking wise we've really not been that spectacular all season, we were a bit more expansive when shipping a load of goals up to Xmas but a lot of that was in a 4-2-3-1 with Vardy fit and firing. Since we've moved to 4-3-3 we've struggled going forward and neither Daka or Iheanacho has had the necessary service to be much of a threat, in this system the chances tend to fall to the wingers and midfielders where we are erratic to say the least.

I think we've got good attackers rather than being good going forward, if that makes sense. Obviously the two should really work in tandem but I often have felt we've scored more than our play deserved.

[Ric Flair]

Just now, Dan LCFC said:

I think we've got good attackers rather than being good going forward, if that makes sense. Obviously the two should really work in tandem but I often have felt we've scored more than our play deserved.

I think it's been really noticeable how poor the collective movement has been both on and off the ball going forward and at the back this season, it's just all hit the buffers. We are more than capable though and that's why I'm still harbouring hope it can be retrieved and the momentum is quickly built again in the near future.

 

Whilst we wait for that we have to play to our strengths and not make things difficult for ourselves which firstly means Maddison HAS to be the 1st name on the team sheet in an ACM role. Then we have to decide if we will get more joy collectively with 1 striker and 2 wingers baring in mind that right wing has yet again been a huge weakness of ours. Lookman has been very reliable for us this season but not so when he's picked wide right, so if we once again find it a chore in this system then how can we get 2 strikers on the pitch with Maddison creating behind them and enough width to provide some form of a threat. I believe that to be as a diamond, as opposed to 3 at the back but whilst we haven't a reliable DCM in Europe it might mean a dreaded 3 at the back or we risk the workmanlike attack whilst remaining in our perceived strongest set up as a back 4 in this 4-3-3.

 

The defence really picks itself currently.

[Mark]

33 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

I think we've got good attackers rather than being good going forward, if that makes sense. Obviously the two should really work in tandem but I often have felt we've scored more than our play deserved.

Maybe in a certain setup, but they are mostly technically poor. Vardy, Daka and Iheanacho are limited in that they can only play one role, so in a 4-3-3 we have no wide forwards apart from - Barnes who again is limited to one position on the left and is another with poor control. Albrighton, in 2022 he simply shouldn't be an option but he is due to exceptionally poor recruitment on the right side. He is not creating anything other than hopeful punts. Lookman is an exception as he seems to be able to play more than one position, is decent on the ball and has more to his game. My point is Rodgers is obsessed with keeping the ball but the forwards are not suited to that type of football so we can barely make any progress up the pitch to create genuine chances. He can bemoan Iheanacho miscontrolling and the forwards not offering what he wants but he's choose to play this way, we can score goals if the setup is suited to the players we have. Our setup now is to suit the manager. We've played one up front for years and yet chose to have three strikers in the squad who can't play wide so two of them are always a sub. If you play 4-3-3 you need wide forwards like Mane/Salah/Diaz/Jota, and are technically able to play either role and don't fall to pieces when moved from a certain position.

[FoxyLeon]

51 minutes ago, Dan LCFC said:

What's a bit mad about it is we've actually got our better defenders back now. There's less risk by being attacking. Would seem mental to play more attacking with the likes of Amartey there than with Fofana.

 

We have gotten slightly better at the back but our attacking has been absolutely abysmal recently. Like Wolves bad.

 

The problem has always been the Midfield/Attackers...I've said all this season and last, I had no idea why people were giving Soyuncu and Amartey so much stick.

 

We can't progress the ball or create chances, and that isn't the main job of the central defenders I'm afraid, even in the Modern game. 

 

The only time this season we've looked even slightly improved, is when KDH came into the side, his impact has been far far bigger than Fofana and Evans return. Why? Because he can progress the ball. Unlike Tielemans/Ndidi/Mendy, he's willing to come deep, take the ball on the half turn, take risks in trying to progress it, and as an added bonus is mobile enough to get around the pitch defensively too.

 

The issue has never been our defenders, and why I continuously tried to dispel the myth that "Wait until Fofana and Justin are back", would solve our problems.

 

We don't know how to press as a team....

We don't know how to progress the ball into the final third....

Simple basic coaching that Rodgers hasn't been able to improve, he's had long enough now and needs to be shown the door.

[CosbehFox]

1 hour ago, FoxyLeon said:

 

The problem has always been the Midfield/Attackers...I've said all this season and last, I had no idea why people were giving Soyuncu and Amartey so much stick.

 

We can't progress the ball or create chances, and that isn't the main job of the central defenders I'm afraid, even in the Modern game. 

 

The only time this season we've looked even slightly improved, is when KDH came into the side, his impact has been far far bigger than Fofana and Evans return. Why? Because he can progress the ball. Unlike Tielemans/Ndidi/Mendy, he's willing to come deep, take the ball on the half turn, take risks in trying to progress it, and as an added bonus is mobile enough to get around the pitch defensively too.

 

The issue has never been our defenders, and why I continuously tried to dispel the myth that "Wait until Fofana and Justin are back", would solve our problems.

 

We don't know how to press as a team....

We don't know how to progress the ball into the final third....

Simple basic coaching that Rodgers hasn't been able to improve, he's had long enough now and needs to be shown the door.

Recency bias - we were scoring goals aplenty around October to December. 

 

We had a run of 2, 4, 4, 2, 2, 0, 1, 1, 0, 3, 4, 2, 1, 2, 4, 3, 3, 1 

[coolhandfox]

1 hour ago, FoxyLeon said:

 

The problem has always been the Midfield/Attackers...I've said all this season and last, I had no idea why people were giving Soyuncu and Amartey so much stick.

 

We can't progress the ball or create chances, and that isn't the main job of the central defenders I'm afraid, even in the Modern game. 

 

The only time this season we've looked even slightly improved, is when KDH came into the side, his impact has been far far bigger than Fofana and Evans return. Why? Because he can progress the ball. Unlike Tielemans/Ndidi/Mendy, he's willing to come deep, take the ball on the half turn, take risks in trying to progress it, and as an added bonus is mobile enough to get around the pitch defensively too.

 

The issue has never been our defenders, and why I continuously tried to dispel the myth that "Wait until Fofana and Justin are back", would solve our problems.

 

We don't know how to press as a team....

We don't know how to progress the ball into the final third....

Simple basic coaching that Rodgers hasn't been able to improve, he's had long enough now and needs to be shown the door.

We are ranked 8th in the league for goals for, and 13th for goals against. 

 

With 5 games to go we have already conceded 4 more goals than the 2020/21 season and 13 more then the 2019/20 season.

 

Saying we we haven't had a issue with the defence is laughable. 

 

 

 

 

Edited 3 May 2022 by coolhandfox

[JimJams]

Gonna be interesting when we get Bielsa in…

[Ric Flair]

7 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

We are ranked 8th in the league for goals for, and 13th for goals against. 

 

With 5 games to go we have already conceded 4 more goals than the 2020/21 season and 13 more then the 2019/20 season.

 

Saying we we haven't had a issue with the defence is laughable. 

 

 

 

 

We've had a huge issue with defending set pieces first and foremost.

[An Sionnach]

18 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

We've had a huge issue with defending set pieces first and foremost.

Kasper, very unlike his father, is not a proactive goalkeeper. He reacts to situations relying on his stupendous reflexes. I suppose this is bound to create indecision in the defence. What do we want? A goalkeeper who commands his goal area or one who pulls off near impossible saves. 

[Dahnsouff]

23 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

We've had a huge issue with defending set pieces first and foremost.

Wonder what the difference in set piece goals conceded are when we play Fofana/Evans  compared to a different pairing?

[cruzFOX]

We really do need a Brendan masterclass in this game that’s all I’m gonna say.

[Stadt]

3 hours ago, coolhandfox said:

 

16 hours ago, Stadt said:

I think Rodgers’ risk tolerance has fallen off a cliff. We rarely commit enough players forward, our movement is poor and our build up is just so safe.

Symptom of being dreadful defensively for the most of the season, your confidence ebbs away and you start looking at being hard to beat rather then playing attacking football.

 

At the start of the season we tried to deal with it by being very attacking, that didn't work and now we have gone too defensive, need to find a balance.

 

We conceded lots of goals at the start of the season because of set pieces & individual performances rather than being too gung-ho imo.

 

It'd be nice if the summer was some sort of hard reset, we sign 4 or 5 players quality players & we look a really dynamic side again. I'm just struggling to see it. I thought we'd rebound really strongly after last season's capitulation and it hasn't happened.  

[coolhandfox]

1 hour ago, Stadt said:

We conceded lots of goals at the start of the season because of set pieces & individual performances rather than being too gung-ho imo.

 

I didn't mean we conceded by being gung-ho, more we tried to deal with it by out scoring the other teams, and now we have go to far the other way. 

 

Individual errors have been a massive issue.

 

1 hour ago, Stadt said:

It'd be nice if the summer was some sort of hard reset, we sign 4 or 5 players quality players & we look a really dynamic side again. I'm just struggling to see it. I thought we'd rebound really strongly after last season's capitulation and it hasn't happened.  

I think this season has been a step to far, I think missing out of 4th for the second time was a massive blow combine with loosing some real leaders in the dressing room in dressing room in Morgan and Fuchs. 

 

100% we need 4 or 5 quality players, who also have good character and a winning mentally. 

 

Also think sometimes winning something like the FA Cup can make a few rest on their laurels 

 

 

[SecretPro]

1 hour ago, Dahnsouff said:

Wonder what the difference in set piece goals conceded are when we play Fofana/Evans  compared to a different pairing?

I suspect a HUGE difference. Evans knows how not to lose his man and lil Wes gets his head on everything. 

[Ric Flair]

3 hours ago, Dahnsouff said:

Wonder what the difference in set piece goals conceded are when we play Fofana/Evans  compared to a different pairing?

This season massive, last season I'd need to check but whilst we defended better against set pieces compared to the debacle this season, last season saw the danger signs as we were starting to concede a fair few vs the year before when we had been one of the best.

 

Fofana is excellent in the air, not only in heading it but just his desire and aggression to be willing to do so which we don't see enough of when he doesn't play. We are stronger with him in but it's not a valid excuse to tolerate what's happened this season without him. Its a basic aspect of the game and we need to e collectively better at both ends at set pieces because we are doing ourselves a disservice. No surprise how much better Liverpool and Man City are than everyone else and how much Arsenal have improved this year at coupling strong set piece play with an overall good standard.

[Ric Flair]

2 hours ago, SecretPro said:

I suspect a HUGE difference. Evans knows how not to lose his man and lil Wes gets his head on everything. 

Fofana is the single biggest improvement in that regard, Evans has been involved a fair amount in the 1st half of the season where we were shipping sickening amounts.

[smudgerfox]

10 hours ago, coolhandfox said:

Nice side step of the questions, Amartey has had some decent games but also made some horrendous mistakes that have lead to goal. and is nothing more then a squad player. Nacho is a great finisher but his all round game is far to inconsistent in a game let alone a season. Not sure what a “Rodgers-type “ player  is suppose to be, he just a good player, with a great work rate which some of his colleagues should take note of. 

 

We one the league using a nucleus of players, however this season BR has used the squad more then ever and how has that workout. It's simply not good enough 

If you can't except Soyunuc and Amartey have been crap at deal with corners not matter what system we have used zonal or man marking, case in point against Spurs, Kane was being mark by Amartey that up to you. 

 

Iheanacho has had a brilliant end to last season, but has been average this season. Yes he scored a great goal on Sunday once were 3-0 but was non existent in the other 90 minutes 

 

 

The question is for you not for me. Like BR you disparage our squad players but offer no explanation as to how you replace them. You sell Ihenacho to Brighton and replace him with who? You sell Amartey and replace him with who? Praet?Mendy? Hamza? Perez even? It’s easy to say some squad players are not as good as the first choices but the whole point is you need a squad who the manager trusts. Would BR have rated Nicky Butt ? 

[Guest Col city fan]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

Fofana is the single biggest improvement in that regard, Evans has been involved a fair amount in the 1st half of the season where we were shipping sickening amounts.

Fofana is the single biggest improvement period… his confidence at the back gives confidence to those in front of him. Passes start getting to our own players, our strikers stop snatching at chances because they know if they don’t take THAT chance, it won’t matter as much because we probably won’t concede many at the other end. 
This all matters and it has this huge knock-on effect.

For want of repeating myself (yes, yet again) our diabolical defending for large parts of this season have pretty much ruined what we’ve wanted to do and how we’ve wanted to play. Strikers who know they must score because if they don’t, we‘ll concede goals and go on to lose games are strikers under constant pressure. When we play Fofana, some of that pressure dissipates. If we go through v Roma it will be because we a. Defend well and b. Take the few chances that come our way. But we probably won’t get b, without a.

Edited 3 May 2022 by Col city fan

[Ric Flair]

17 minutes ago, Col city fan said:

Fofana is the single biggest improvement period… his confidence at the back gives confidence to those in front of him. Passes start getting to our own players, our strikers stop snatching at chances because they know if they don’t take THAT chance, it won’t matter as much because we probably won’t concede many at the other end. 
This all matters and it has this huge knock-on effect.

For want of repeating myself (yes, yet again) our diabolical defending for large parts of this season have pretty much ruined what we’ve wanted to do and how we’ve wanted to play. Strikers who know they must score because if they don’t, we‘ll concede goals and go on to lose games are strikers under constant pressure. When we play Fofana, some of that pressure dissipates. If we go through v Roma it will be because we a. Defend well and b. Take the few chances that come our way. But we probably won’t get b, without a.

Shame we haven't won a league game yet since Fofana has returned and played, hopefully he helps steer and away win on Thursday though.

[coolhandfox]

37 minutes ago, smudgerfox said:

The question is for you not for me. Like BR you disparage our squad players but offer no explanation as to how you replace them.

No sure what that got to do with saying a player isn't good enough!

37 minutes ago, smudgerfox said:

You sell Ihenacho to Brighton and replace him with who? You sell Amartey and replace him with who? Praet?Mendy? Hamza? Perez even?

So you are say there is no chance we could improve on those players?

 

37 minutes ago, smudgerfox said:

 

It’s easy to say some squad players are not as good as the first choices but the whole point is you need a squad who the manager trusts.

So you have discussed it with BR then, how do you know who he doesn't or does trust?  

37 minutes ago, smudgerfox said:

Would BR have rated Nicky Butt ? 

Same Nicky Butt who won 40 England cap  I'm pretty sure he would have. 

Edited 3 May 2022 by coolhandfox