Brendan Rodgers

[steflcfc]

1 hour ago, Col city fan said:

And this is exactly why the club needs a ‘better’ squad. 
If we are to go anywhere else under Rodgers (which gets more difficult as the ‘top sides’ keep improving) we have to somehow recruit ‘squad players’ of a better calibre. 
This would have seen us into the top four in the two aforementioned seasons. There are some players who fans call ‘squad players’ who won’t be able to deputise effectively. They’ll be ‘ok’ but they won’t be good enough if we have to rely on them for too long. 
It all depends on what people want and what the club can afford. If it’s mid table mediocrity with pushing at the top 6/7 each season then that’s what we have. If it’s competing at the top table, Rodgers has to pull something out of the bag to create a squad of better players. Soumare, Amartey, Perez, Vestergaard, Bertrand, even Mendy.. are all bog standard players who will significantly reduce the overall ability of the first team if heavily relied on. 
Can we replace them with better, just in case they have to play? Probably not tbf, but that’s what is needed if we are to really kick on 

I would also add that a better quality squad would also mean we are less reliant on our best 11 at all times, allowing some players a games rest/substitution around the hour mark without the ability of the team being hit or having to change shape to allow for changes to happen.

 

And hopefully this improves our relatively poor injury issues and our core players are able to produce what we know they are capable of, as they are not completely burnt out with 3/4 of the season gone 

[Guest Col city fan]

7 minutes ago, steflcfc said:

I would also add that a better quality squad would also mean we are less reliant on our best 11 at all times, allowing some players a games rest/substitution around the hour mark without the ability of the team being hit or having to change shape to allow for changes to happen.

 

And hopefully this improves our relatively poor injury issues and our core players are able to produce what we know they are capable of, as they are not completely burnt out with 3/4 of the season gone 

Aye good point.

However, we are what we are and we only have so much money. We can’t do a Liverpool or a Chelsea or a Man City. Unless we stay relatively injury free I can see us entering a time of mid table to possibly 6/7 finishes.

[MarriedaLeicesterGirl]

8 minutes ago, steflcfc said:

I would also add that a better quality squad would also mean we are less reliant on our best 11 at all times, allowing some players a games rest/substitution around the hour mark without the ability of the team being hit or having to change shape to allow for changes to happen.

 

And hopefully this improves our relatively poor injury issues and our core players are able to produce what we know they are capable of, as they are not completely burnt out with 3/4 of the season gone 

This is especially true with five subs next season. I do wonder with a slimmer squad, if this changes some of the math for our young players. Will more be allowed to stay, train with the first team, and -- while still playing the majority of games with the youth setup -- get some minutes with the first team? Right now, we might have a golden generation in our youth setup, and if we play our cards right, that can lead to a very strong squad without the transfer fees usually required.

[smudgerfox]

4 hours ago, Col city fan said:

Aye good point.

However, we are what we are and we only have so much money. We can’t do a Liverpool or a Chelsea or a Man City. Unless we stay relatively injury free I can see us entering a time of mid table to possibly 6/7 finishes.

I think I’m right in saying that financial fair play rules mean we’re near the max of what we can spend - unlike say Villa and Newcastle 

[Ric Flair]

14 hours ago, coolhandfox said:

Didn't he try to do that away at Bournemouth away and got hammered for it. 

 

Also how do you shut up shop away at Spurs with a back 5 of Morgan (Past it), Bennett , Evans, Justin ( Who had only played 12 PL games) Thomas (Who had played 1 PL game at that point) and Man U (H) Justin, Morgan, Evans, Thomas in 2019/20

 

Did he makes mistake yes, but for me both seasons the squad just ran out of legs, no surprise our form turned after Easter both times as fatigue and injuries sent in.

 

This season we got stronger as players returned, which again was no surprise.

Both seasons though it wasn't the results vs the big teams in the final few games when top 4 was precariously in the balance/already out of our hands, it was the astonishing capitulation away at Bournemouth when in total control and at home to Newcastle + failing to beat a Southampton side down to 10 men for 80 minutes.

 

 

[st albans fox]

8 hours ago, smudgerfox said:

I think I’m right in saying that financial fair play rules mean we’re near the max of what we can spend - unlike say Villa and Newcastle 

Villa are way more maxed out than us 

newcastle could buy a medium sized African country 

[coolhandfox]

13 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Both seasons though it wasn't the results vs the big teams in the final few games when top 4 was precariously in the balance/already out of our hands, it was the astonishing capitulation away at Bournemouth when in total control and at home to Newcastle + failing to beat a Southampton side down to 10 men for 80 minutes.

 

 

Never said it was, I was responding to the to the statement about shutting up shop, which is why I referenced those games.

 

Where you finish in the table in never about 1 game, points against Newcastle are worth no more the points against Man U.

 

As we have seen this season players in the team/squad are capable of terrible individual errors and have a soft underbelly. 

 

I know people criticise Rodgers for lowering expections, but this squad does seem to struggle when the pressure is on.

 

 

 

 

[SafewayFox]

16 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Never said it was, I was responding to the to the statement about shutting up shop, which is why I referenced those games.

 

Where you finish in the table in never about 1 game, points against Newcastle are worth no more the points against Man U.

 

As we have seen this season players in the team/squad are capable of terrible individual errors and have a soft underbelly. 

 

I know people criticise Rodgers for lowering expections, but this squad does seem to struggle when the pressure is on.

 

 

 

 

I totally agree but could it not be argued - the team mentality comes from Rodgers?

 

I’m already awaiting certain posters to say that’s made up/imaginary nonsense but surely needs consideration? 

[HighPeakFox]

6 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

I totally agree but could it not be argued - the team mentality comes from Rodgers?

 

I’m already awaiting certain posters to say that’s made up/imaginary nonsense but surely needs consideration? 

It's not nonsense to either suggest or consider - it's just difficult to prove and group mentality is a fragile, complex issue.

[SafewayFox]

Just now, HighPeakFox said:

It's not nonsense to either suggest or consider - it's just difficult to prove and group mentality is a fragile, complex issue.

Totally agree - it’s probably multiple factors such as individual ability, potential, hunger but how all of that is nurtured/maintained is down to leadership.

 

Rodgers is staying so as someone said previously it’s a lot of re-hashed conversations - I just hope this Summer transfer window is more fruitful than last.

 

[Mike Oxlong]

9 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

I totally agree but could it not be argued - the team mentality comes from Rodgers?

 

I’m already awaiting certain posters to say that’s made up/imaginary nonsense but surely needs consideration? 

I remember reading something a while  ago suggesting that teams often reflect the character of their managers.  Nigel - gritty, Claude, Craig, Gary - dour are perhaps good examples of this ? 

[SafewayFox]

2 minutes ago, Mike Oxlong said:

I remember reading something a while  ago suggesting that teams often reflect the character of their managers.  Nigel - gritty, Claude, Craig, Gary - dour are perhaps good examples of this ? 

Gary as Ginger “Mourinho” Megson though 😜

Edited 7 June 2022 by SafewayFox

[MarriedaLeicesterGirl]

6 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

It's not nonsense to either suggest or consider - it's just difficult to prove and group mentality is a fragile, complex issue.

 

2 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

Totally agree - it’s probably multiple factors such as individual ability, potential, hunger but how all of that is nurtured/maintained is down to leadership.

 

Rodgers is staying so as someone said previously it’s a lot of re-hashed conversations - I just hope this Summer transfer window is more fruitful than last.

 

The "winning mentality" thing is something Rodgers has brought up himself, in response to the 2019-2020 drop off. Funnily enough, it is one of the reasons we recruited Soumare: He had won the Ligue 1 in a team that shouldn't have - the "Leicester model". It was a factor in recruiting Bertrand, who won trophies at Chelsea.

 

Of course, those transfers show a "winning mentality" is complex, and useless if the player doesn't have a "winning ability."

 

I am cautiously optimistic about the summer: Last summer wasn't about improving the starting 11, but about improving the squad. No one was signed with the expectation of starting 30 games, and that limits your pull.

 

This summer we will be looking for starting 11 players, in a team where finishing 8 is considered a bad year.

[Ric Flair]

34 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

Never said it was, I was responding to the to the statement about shutting up shop, which is why I referenced those games.

 

Where you finish in the table in never about 1 game, points against Newcastle are worth no more the points against Man U.

 

As we have seen this season players in the team/squad are capable of terrible individual errors and have a soft underbelly. 

 

I know people criticise Rodgers for lowering expections, but this squad does seem to struggle when the pressure is on.

 

 

 

 

It's a curious one, I know he's damned if he does, damned if he doesn't but there seems to be an obvious attempt at containment during spells under Rodgers that might just be dressed up in poor performance followed by a relinquishing of the shackles and we play with freedom (maybe dressed up as finding some confidence/momentum).

 

Down the stretch of both seasons we missed out on top 4, we suddenly seemed to attempt to shut up shop after the panic of Dawson scoring in the dying seconds at Vicarage Road, he puts out a side at home to Brighton that was just horrifyingly negative and it showed. We were lucky to come away with a 0-0 and it was a disaster in the opening chunk of the following game away at Everton before he threw the kitchen sink at it.

 

The same was very noticeable in 2020/21, we absolutely obliterate Wedt Brom and are 3-0 up at half time and he bollocks them which is one of the most staggering things I've ever heard about Rodgers and we seemed very timid and risk averse from there on in. It was galling to see.

 

You could argue we saw it down the stretch of this season too as we gotten ourselves in to a semi final of a European competition and in touching distance of the top 7/8, we then perceived to play some of the most negative and turgid football in quite some time, even with our best players back and rotating and it was only when we were out of Europe and the top 7 was gone that the handbrake was removed and we played with aggression and belief.

 

It's not all being orchestrated by Rodgers, the players may well struggle with pressure at times but the manager does as well I'm convinced of it as can be seen in the actions he takes.

[filbertway]

3 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

It's a curious one, I know he's damned if he does, damned if he doesn't but there seems to be an obvious attempt at containment during spells under Rodgers that might just be dressed up in poor performance followed by a relinquishing of the shackles and we play with freedom (maybe dressed up as finding some confidence/momentum).

 

Down the stretch of both seasons we missed out on top 4, we suddenly seemed to attempt to shut up shop after the panic of Dawson scoring in the dying seconds at Vicarage Road, he puts out a side at home to Brighton that was just horrifyingly negative and it showed. We were lucky to come away with a 0-0 and it was a disaster in the opening chunk of the following game away at Everton before he threw the kitchen sink at it.

 

The same was very noticeable in 2020/21, we absolutely obliterate Wedt Brom and are 3-0 up at half time and he bollocks them which is one of the most staggering things I've ever heard about Rodgers and we seemed very timid and risk averse from there on in. It was galling to see.

 

You could argue we saw it down the stretch of this season too as we gotten ourselves in to a semi final of a European competition and in touching distance of the top 7/8, we then perceived to play some of the most negative and turgid football in quite some time, even with our best players back and rotating and it was only when we were out of Europe and the top 7 was gone that the handbrake was removed and we played with aggression and belief.

 

It's not all being orchestrated by Rodgers, the players may well struggle with pressure at times but the manager does as well I'm convinced of it as can be seen in the actions he takes.

I love a walk down memory lane

 

The main thing to take from the post match comments is that the tactical changes did not affect the game and it's because the players didn't worry enough to play well.

 

 

 

[coolhandfox]

6 hours ago, SafewayFox said:

Totally agree - it’s probably multiple factors such as individual ability, potential, hunger but how all of that is nurtured/maintained is down to leadership.

 

Rodgers is staying so as someone said previously it’s a lot of re-hashed conversations - I just hope this Summer transfer window is more fruitful than last.

 

I don't think it's that simple in elite sports. 

 

You can foster and build a culture as a manager, but you have little control once they cross the white line.

Successful teams have ability and character. For every Mahrez, you need a Huth.

 

Take the great escape season, most people on here consider Pearson, a great leader, but we only improved when he gained a leader with know how on the pitch in Huth. 

 

Huth was not a formal leader as a manager or a captain, but he showed lots of informal leadership qualities.

 

Unfortunately, modern football is not awash with players with these qualities.  

[coolhandfox]

2 hours ago, filbertway said:

I love a walk down memory lane

 

The main thing to take from the post match comments is that the tactical changes did not affect the game and it's because the players didn't worry enough to play well.

 

 

 

Not sure what tactic has got to do with Kasper smashing a ball into Wilf's ass for the first goal and Soyuncu getting sent off?

Two massive mistakes by two key players!

 

Interesting when we lose; it's Rodgers fault. When we win, it's down to the players.

 

In both instances, its probably a bit of both.

 

 

[coolhandfox]

6 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

It's a curious one, I know he's damned if he does, damned if he doesn't but there seems to be an obvious attempt at containment during spells under Rodgers that might just be dressed up in poor performance followed by a relinquishing of the shackles and we play with freedom (maybe dressed up as finding some confidence/momentum).

 

Down the stretch of both seasons we missed out on top 4, we suddenly seemed to attempt to shut up shop after the panic of Dawson scoring in the dying seconds at Vicarage Road, he puts out a side at home to Brighton that was just horrifyingly negative and it showed. We were lucky to come away with a 0-0 and it was a disaster in the opening chunk of the following game away at Everton before he threw the kitchen sink at it.

We play well when the pressure is off, easy at the start of the  19/20 and 20/21 seasons as there are no expectations. 

 

Come squeak bum time at the close of both seasons, and we seem to fold under pressure, something the players and manager need to address if we want to be a top side. 

 

I think BR playing down expectations is about taking the pressure off, as Claudio Ranieri did in the title season, talking about 40 points etc. 

 

No surprise we found it easier in the FA Cup as underdogs against Chelsea

6 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

The same was very noticeable in 2020/21, we absolutely obliterate Wedt Brom and are 3-0 up at half time and he bollocks them which is one of the most staggering things I've ever heard about Rodgers and we seemed very timid and risk averse from there on in. It was galling to see.

I think this is hyperbole. He may have wanted them to shut up shop second half, but I'm not buying he bollocked them 

6 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

You could argue we saw it down the stretch of this season too as we gotten ourselves in to a semi final of a European competition and in touching distance of the top 7/8, we then perceived to play some of the most negative and turgid football in quite some time, even with our best players back and rotating and it was only when we were out of Europe and the top 7 was gone that the handbrake was removed and we played with aggression and belief.

 

It's not all being orchestrated by Rodgers, the players may well struggle with pressure at times but the manager does as well I'm convinced of it as can be seen in the actions he takes.

I think the pressure has got to both the players and the manager.

[4everfox]

I've been Rodgers out since the forest game, but what's the point in it if he isn't going anywhere? He is obviously going to be here next season, so I'm willing to wipe the slate clean for the sake of my own happiness. I want to enjoy my summer and look forward to next season, so I will offer Rodgers my full support until I realise he has made a right cock up with the summer transfer window, but I'm genuinely hoping that he gets it right. Onwards and upwards, bring on 2022/23!

[Corky]

On 05/06/2022 at 11:50, Ric Flair said:

What's his one quip that drives you up the wall?

 

Mine's got to be anything that he finishes with " in the game "

 

" we had that physicality in the game "

 

" we didn't move the ball quick enough in the game "

 

AAAARRRGGGHHHH

When he talks about "lack of aggression" having purposefully built and coached the team to have little.

[Ric Flair]

1 hour ago, coolhandfox said:

We play well when the pressure is off, easy at the start of the  19/20 and 20/21 seasons as there are no expectations. 

 

Come squeak bum time at the close of both seasons, and we seem to fold under pressure, something the players and manager need to address if we want to be a top side. 

 

I think BR playing down expectations is about taking the pressure off, as Claudio Ranieri did in the title season, talking about 40 points etc. 

 

No surprise we found it easier in the FA Cup as underdogs against Chelsea

I think this is hyperbole. He may have wanted them to shut up shop second half, but I'm not buying he bollocked them 

I think the pressure has got to both the players and the manager.

Despite blitzing the Baggies with three goals in 13 first half minutes, Rodgers admits he let his players know at half-time that he expected better from them.

 

I wasn't so happy with our passing, we weren't precise enough, too many mistakes, giving the ball away so I wasn't happy at half-time even though we were 3-0 up.

 

Now we don't know whether such comments both at half time to the players or post match publicly had any impact on instruction of how the players should play but its a red flag in curbing attacking enthusiasm and momentum. I found it odd and the fact we did look more turgid instantly afterwards cannot be ignored.

[coolhandfox]

15 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Despite blitzing the Baggies with three goals in 13 first half minutes, Rodgers admits he let his players know at half-time that he expected better from them.

 

I wasn't so happy with our passing, we weren't precise enough, too many mistakes, giving the ball away so I wasn't happy at half-time even though we were 3-0 up.

 

Now we don't know whether such comments both at half time to the players or post match publicly had any impact on instruction of how the players should play but its a red flag in curbing attacking enthusiasm and momentum. I found it odd and the fact we did look more turgid instantly afterwards cannot be ignored.

Maybe an element of West Brom reacting and making the second half more difficult.

 

Not sure you can turn those comments into something curbing attacking enthusiasm and momentum.

 

I often heard Pep and Klopp say similar things, nothing wrong with having high standards. (Before anyone throws their teddies out of the pram, I'm not suggesting BR is anywhere near their level).

 

One of people's biggest criticism of Rodgers is he's overthinking. I think many of us are guilty of the same offence on here. 

[coolhandfox]

27 minutes ago, Corky said:

When he talks about "lack of aggression" having purposefully built and coached the team to have little.

How do you know? 

[sacreblueits442]

9 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Despite blitzing the Baggies with three goals in 13 first half minutes, Rodgers admits he let his players know at half-time that he expected better from them.

 

I wasn't so happy with our passing, we weren't precise enough, too many mistakes, giving the ball away so I wasn't happy at half-time even though we were 3-0 up.

 

Now we don't know whether such comments both at half time to the players or post match publicly had any impact on instruction of how the players should play but its a red flag in curbing attacking enthusiasm and momentum. I found it odd and the fact we did look more turgid instantly afterwards cannot be ignored.

....when you are on the side lines kicking water bottles, you know someone is not happy!!!

This was an extreme reaction from Rodgers, who normally scribbles in his note book, or turn his back on a mistake by one of his players. I have always said prior to his comments that the reason why he reacted in that way was due to us overplaying and not maintaining a discipline in the game. I totally agree with what he said in this respect, and was also just as furious, that we were letting a team off, due to our lack of attention in doing what was required.

[l444ry]

19 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Despite blitzing the Baggies with three goals in 13 first half minutes, Rodgers admits he let his players know at half-time that he expected better from them.

 

I wasn't so happy with our passing, we weren't precise enough, too many mistakes, giving the ball away so I wasn't happy at half-time even though we were 3-0 up.

 

Now we don't know whether such comments both at half time to the players or post match publicly had any impact on instruction of how the players should play but its a red flag in curbing attacking enthusiasm and momentum. I found it odd and the fact we did look more turgid instantly afterwards cannot be ignored.

Might have been using the well known Brian Clough method of reverse psychology.