Kiernan Dewsbury-Hall

[lcfc_forever]

Think some of the comments on Soumare are harsh. Thought he complimented Ndidi well vs Legia Warsaw, and wasn’t helped by Lookman not tracking back enough. 
 

Soumare’s biggest issue is fitness - he still hasn’t quite got to grips yet with the demands of our pressing game and the intensity of high level PL and EL football. But that will come with time. So wasn’t a surprise he came off. 
 

Thought KDH did well, and showed he could do the pressing side too. Just a handful of misplaced passes but good to see his ambition with some of his through balls, and gave more creativity than Soumare. 

[FoxinNotts]

47 minutes ago, TheFiveTime said:

Ok here is why soumare Ndidi doesnt work. Ndidi is an aggressive player at his best. He goes in, nicks the ball, tackles the player and shoves him over. However, his weakness is that if he is beaten then because he has pressured, he leaves space in behind. This is fine with youri in the middle and madders as an 8 because they can read the game and fill in behind him (esp youri - this is also why ndidi needs three in midfield) However, soumare being unable to run beyond 60% capacity means that he doesn't fill the spaces back in so the midfield is just one huge gap if Ndidi is beaten. Hamza runs about but can't read the game so he is also useless partner for Ndidi. Lets see how KDH does. Clearly he is willing to run about and he can do some risky passing which is good. Why not give him a go. i think its worth a try.

Good analysis this 👍🏼

[TJB-fox]

2 minutes ago, lcfc_forever said:

Think some of the comments on Soumare are harsh. Thought he complimented Ndidi well vs Legia Warsaw, and wasn’t helped by Lookman not tracking back enough. 
 

Soumare’s biggest issue is fitness - he still hasn’t quite got to grips yet with the demands of our pressing game and the intensity of high level PL and EL football. But that will come with time. So wasn’t a surprise he came off. 
 

Thought KDH did well, and showed he could do the pressing side too. Just a handful of misplaced passes but good to see his ambition with some of his through balls, and gave more creativity than Soumare. 

The prem is very unforgiving especially when players are new to the league, can take a while for some to get up to the speed of it. 
 

Confident that Soumare will come on leaps and bounds this year. 

[Dusty]

44 minutes ago, lcfc_forever said:

Think some of the comments on Soumare are harsh. Thought he complimented Ndidi well vs Legia Warsaw, and wasn’t helped by Lookman not tracking back enough. 
 

Soumare’s biggest issue is fitness - he still hasn’t quite got to grips yet with the demands of our pressing game and the intensity of high level PL and EL football. But that will come with time. So wasn’t a surprise he came off. 
 

Thought KDH did well, and showed he could do the pressing side too. Just a handful of misplaced passes but good to see his ambition with some of his through balls, and gave more creativity than Soumare. 

I thought he tracked back very well, personally. Always seemed to be pressing players at a pace and trying to win the ball back. It’s one of the reasons why I thought he was one of our best players. He certainly does a lot more defensive work than Barnes who needs to work a bit harder for me.

[lcfc_forever]

21 minutes ago, Dusty said:

I thought he tracked back very well, personally. Always seemed to be pressing players at a pace and trying to win the ball back. It’s one of the reasons why I thought he was one of our best players. He certainly does a lot more defensive work than Barnes who needs to work a bit harder for me.

Lookman was better in the 2nd half but gave away a few fouls. He got caught too high up the pitch, and Legia’s best attacks came more on that side in the 1st half. 
 

Agree Barnes could do more defensively too. It’s why Rodgers makes a point of all our players making sure they’re pressing consistently. 

[Ric Flair]

17 hours ago, sacreblueits442 said:

...can't say I agree with that, it is a if you are berating Soyuncu for lack of goals and assists!!!

Goals and assists is not what he does, you have seen the performances for Lille, taking the ball off the backline and transitioning to the last third is what he does. He has not hit the ground running and he is trying to adjust to a new team.

  You may be right and he fails to make the grade here, but the  stats are a red herring in this instance.

 

Eh? I was talking about this notion he's got all the ingredients of becoming an attacking midfielder, not that I don't think he has potential. His goals and assists record is disgusting and its little to do with him playing as a holding midfielder because a) he doesn't play as a sitting DCM and b) even if he did there are plenty that score and assist more even Ndidi does. I doubt there is an outfield player with worse stats on our books than that, even defenders and Schmiechel might even push him close. So what in his current skill set makes him a shoe in to become an attacking creative player? 

[Merchant_Banker]

17 hours ago, Clever Fox said:

I know despite knowing his name is Kieran Dewsbury Hall.

 

That's what getting old does to you.

 

Kiernan?

[Ric Flair]

2 minutes ago, Merchant_Banker said:

Kiernan?

All the Kier, no idea

[sacreblueits442]

2 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Eh? I was talking about this notion he's got all the ingredients of becoming an attacking midfielder, not that I don't think he has potential. His goals and assists record is disgusting and its little to do with him playing as a holding midfielder because a) he doesn't play as a sitting DCM and b) even if he did there are plenty that score and assist more even Ndidi does. I doubt there is an outfield player with worse stats on our books than that, even defenders and Schmiechel might even push him close. So what in his current skill set makes him a shoe in to become an attacking creative player? 

...I think he really is a hybrid of Ndidi and Tielemans!!!

  At present our forum is in two minds regarding what he does or should be doing. He is not a holding midfielder nor is he the creator in the Youri mold, but he can do both but not to the extent of the aforementioned two.

  I am looking forward to see him get up to speed and be the driver of this team.

[Clever Fox]

44 minutes ago, sacreblueits442 said:

...I think he really is a hybrid of Ndidi and Tielemans!!!

  At present our forum is in two minds regarding what he does or should be doing. He is not a holding midfielder nor is he the creator in the Youri mold, but he can do both but not to the extent of the aforementioned two.

  I am looking forward to see him get up to speed and be the driver of this team.

That's his dilemma, He isn't as good as those holding those positions.

Which is why I think both KDH and the Club would have been better served by another Loan.

 

Otherwise he's going to have excel when he get's a chance and that's a lot of pressure to put on the young man.

[sacreblueits442]

16 minutes ago, Clever Fox said:

That's his dilemma, He isn't as good as those holding those positions.

Which is why I think both KDH and the Club would have been better served by another Loan.

 

Otherwise he's going to have excel when he get's a chance and that's a lot of pressure to put on the young man.

....I  really believe that we should be moving from the double pivot with Ndidi and Tielemans and add another player in the midfield in order to be competitive!!!

  At the moment we are pretty weak In the middle and being over ran. If Soumare fails to meet the standard required then KDH deserve to throw his hat in the ring. Soumare for me is a gamechanger, he just needs to replicate his game from Lille for us.

  I still believe KDH would serve us better if we pushed him higher up the pitch, he can be a big threat around or inside the box.

 

 

 

[Ric Flair]

1 hour ago, sacreblueits442 said:

...I think he really is a hybrid of Ndidi and Tielemans!!!

  At present our forum is in two minds regarding what he does or should be doing. He is not a holding midfielder nor is he the creator in the Youri mold, but he can do both but not to the extent of the aforementioned two.

  I am looking forward to see him get up to speed and be the driver of this team.

He's looked better playing with Tielemans without Ndidi as the more defensive of the two than he has with Ndidi where they are both unnatural at who's looking to break up play and who's pushing on. I think he'll be all over the place this season and then hopefully get better but he's very much a work in progress, he simply has to add goals and assists to his game as he's not got the positional sense or discipline to be a destroyer like Ndidi.

[Clever Fox]

10 minutes ago, sacreblueits442 said:

....I  really believe that we should be moving from the double pivot with Ndidi and Tielemans and add another player in the midfield in order to be competitive!!!

  At the moment we are pretty weak In the middle and being over ran. If Soumare fails to meet the standard required then KDH deserve to throw his hat in the ring. Soumare for me is a gamechanger, he just needs to replicate his game from Lille for us.

  I still believe KDH would serve us better if we pushed him higher up the pitch, he can be a big threat around or inside the box.

 

 

 

That's exactly as I see it.

We definitely need three in the middle to stop teams earlier. I don't agree with Brendan's idea of stopping them on the edge of our Box.

I can see Wilf, Youri and Soumare being that midfield three. 

Soumare is very green in his understanding of the game unlike KDH who does know the game.

In Soumare's case it's going to take him time to improve and perfect that side if his game.

Given our current situation with Youri out I'd also give KDH a chance tomorrow in the advanced role between Wilf and Soumare. To find out if he can deliver once and for all. As I don't see KDH getting  a chance if Youri is available.

I suspect though that Brendan doesn't quite trust him yet. So I'll just mention this as a wild card.

What if we tried Perez in the advanced midfield role. He's comfortable with the Ball, can go left or right, Can tackle and can see a pass. He'd also have more room to operate as opposed to an attacking role.

[deep blue]

6 hours ago, sacreblueits442 said:

....I  really believe that we should be moving from the double pivot with Ndidi and Tielemans and add another player in the midfield in order to be competitive!!!

  At the moment we are pretty weak In the middle and being over ran. If Soumare fails to meet the standard required then KDH deserve to throw his hat in the ring. Soumare for me is a gamechanger, he just needs to replicate his game from Lille for us.

  I still believe KDH would serve us better if we pushed him higher up the pitch, he can be a big threat around or inside the box.

 

 

 

I think this gets it dead right.  In the absense of Tielemans, I would like to see Ndidi protecting the defence, KDH and Soumare in front of him.  They would both be box-to-box but with KDH the more likely to support the attack and Soumare the link from Ndidi.  Not sure whether the 3 places to fill in front of them would leave us with enough goalscoring ability (or who those 3 would be), but at least it would hopefully stop our midfield being overrun. 4 at the back - goes without saying.

[Incognito]

On 26/11/2021 at 22:36, Clever Fox said:

I wasn't thinking of him in terms of a goal scoring midfielder. I was merely stating that I think he has more upside to his career. The reason I say that is he's 22 and had very little Coaching, at least of a high standard. Compare that to KDH who's here since he was 8 years of age.

I would have expected him to make a breakthrough before now. Unless of course he's a late developer.

As I said he done ok last night against moderate opposition without excelling.

He needs to get out and get more experience at a club preferably challenging at the top end of the Championship.

Otherwise he'll end up like Choudary. playing a bit part here or there. Which is no good for wither of their careers.

A bit harsh on the talent factories that are PSG (albeit they all seem to have to move on as their pathway is blocked by the mega stars) and Lille. Lille improve players that they take in, so the coaches must be doing something right.

[NaijaFox]

On 26/11/2021 at 11:40, Arriba Los Zorros said:

Yes exactly. Let's not overrate him. He came on, looked average, and did a job, nothing more, when the game was already won. He will naturally be over rated because he came through the academy. I've not seen any evidence he's good enough to be starting games for us, or ever will be at this level. Don't see why it's so heinous to say that and it doesn't mean he won't go on to improve of course.

Agree. At this point, KDH is no more than just a solid squad player. He obviously has some upside (albeit he’s already 23), but he’s not there yet. 

[foxinsocks]

3 hours ago, NaijaFox said:

Agree. At this point, KDH is no more than just a solid squad player. He obviously has some upside (albeit he’s already 23), but he’s not there yet. 

he is an upgrade on maddison.

[Farrington fox]

What about starting KDH in place of Soumare, who was pretty poor the other night. Doesn't seem to have any pace.

[notnow john]

This would be a good game to start him,we could do with his energy levels and progressive passing.

Its time for him to shine.

[SpacedX]

2 minutes ago, notnow john said:

This would be a good game to start him,we could do with his energy levels and progressive passing.

Its time for him to shine.

'**** all that, we've got to get on with these'

[Dandy king]

The return of Claudio, daka pushing for a start,  this has got Jamie vardy goals written all over it. 

[Clever Fox]

7 hours ago, Incognito said:

A bit harsh on the talent factories that are PSG (albeit they all seem to have to move on as their pathway is blocked by the mega stars) and Lille. Lille improve players that they take in, so the coaches must be doing something right.

Yes that's a fair comment. Though in Soumare's case it's evident he hasn't been taught the fundamentals of attacking and defending as a unit, When to stay and hold your position and when to go and join in an attack or simply take up a better position to receive the Ball.

I'm sure Brendan will put him straight fairly quickly and we'll reap a big benefit because he has all the other attributes.  

[BenTheFox]

Impressed me tonight. Full of running, always offering himself, driving us forward. He showed what we have been missing. 

[KrefelderFox666]

Superb when he came on, changed the game. Much more positive.

[shilton_fox]

Must start on Sunday. Offers so much more than soumare currently. Set the tempo with his aggression and pressing and seemed to get better on the ball as the half went on