EURO 2020 FINAL. England v Italy. At Wembley. Thread.

[RowlattsFox]

If Saka is one of the better ones then fair enough, but to give him the 5th pen when the pressure will be massive is harsh on him. 

[Babylon]

Just now, RowlattsFox said:

If Saka is one of the better ones then fair enough, but to give him the 5th pen when the pressure will be massive is harsh on him. 

Comes down to his game management again, if the lad had come on and looked amazing I'd probably be fine with it. But he looked well off it, caught in the headlights and shouldn't have been anywhere near a penalty based on that alone. 

[whoareyaaa]

he got it right all tournament and then had a brain fart from half time onwards.. Grelish should have come on for mount and foden should have come on for Phillips we sat back and gave them too much off the ball for after we scored they was there for the taking..

 

and then we get to penos and he picks fukin rashford and sancho who havent kicked a ball all tournament to see the job through astonishing descion he should have picked Walker grelish sterling kane maguire who had been playing all gsme and would be ready for it worst descion ive ever seen from a manger proper shite

[Unabomber]

Blows my mind that we were playing for pens. Not once did we actually try and attack Italy. Surely that would’ve been our best chance of success. Also the fact that Gareth got what he seemingly wanted in pens and then managed it like he did is incredulous. 

[GlennyFox55]

I think yesterday guarantees we won’t be hosting a tournament anytime soon. 

[Foxxed]

Grealish, confident and one of the best midfielders in Europe, wanted to a take a penalty?

 

So Southgate chose a frightened 19 year old who'd never taken a penalty before?

 

Get in the bin, Southgate.

[Ricey]

Southgate has been almost flawless in this tournament. He's made brave, against the grain decisions that have almost entirely paid off handsomely.

 

It felt like the same was happening again last night at HT. The back 3 and wing backs was working really well at stopping Italy and we were still looking threatening going forward.

 

Then in the second half it changed and this is my only real criticism from last night, we just didn't react. Totally understandable at 1-0, as for all the ball Italy were having they weren't creating a great deal, but the second it turns to 1-1 we HAD to try and change the tide of the game. Do something. Roll the dice and see what happens. Instead all the changes were too late and felt pretty much like for like. It was Croatia in 2018 all over again.

 

I'd have loved to have seen Grealish come on at 70 minutes and adopt a back 4. It would have at least created an atmosphere around the stadium, which at that point was silent.

 

I'm gutted at the way we lost last night. It feels so cruel on those players, but Italy were the best team in the tournament and they were the best team on the night.

 

Overall it's been a brilliant tournament though. I didn't need to see us lift a trophy at the end of it to verify that. We've all got memories that will last a life time and that, for me, is what following England is all about. It's not about the silverware...thank god.

[Koke]

Another damning stat from the final 

 

 

[Ricey]

1 minute ago, Foxxed said:

Grealish, confident and one of the best midfielders in Europe, wanted to a take a penalty?

 

So Southgate chose a frightened 19 year old who'd never taken a penalty before?

 

Get in the bin, Southgate.

They've been practising penalties all month so they'll know who the best takers are. Clearly Saka looked better than Grealish in training.

 

As for frightened, Saka has been one of the most fearless players we've had all tournament. He's looked free of pressure and confident. It's confirmation bias to suggest he was simply frightened.

[Ricey]

9 minutes ago, Unabomber said:

Blows my mind that we were playing for pens. Not once did we actually try and attack Italy. Surely that would’ve been our best chance of success. Also the fact that Gareth got what he seemingly wanted in pens and then managed it like he did is incredulous. 

70 - 90 mins I agree, but in extra time I thought we did try and attack them.

[foxes_rule1978]

Just now, Ricey said:

70 - 90 mins I agree, but in extra time I thought we did try and attack them.

We actually had some half chances… got some good balls in the box, had we had that little more luck you never know. Second half was very poor but we improved in extra time and were better with grealish on. Maybe he should have come on earlier 

[David Hankey]

So, after all the campaigns, advertising and the divisive "taking the knee" stance players have made it hasn't made a damned bit of difference.

Edited 12 July 2021 by David Hankey

[jmono84]

Just now, Ricey said:

70 - 90 mins I agree, but in extra time I thought we did try and attack them.

In very brief spells and didn’t create anything of note at all.

[Blue ROI]

4 minutes ago, Koke said:

Another damning stat from the final 

 

 

It wasn't Sterling's finest hour but it wasn't for the want of trying. He had a fine tournament overall.

 

The other 2 were a big disappointment on the night.

[Guest Col city fan]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

I don't care how good someone is in training, I just can't fathom how you could watch Saka after he came on and think it was right for him to take a pen. 

It wasn’t!!! Just look at the lad when he missed. This could have really affected his confidence going forward

It beggars belief it really does

[Koke]

Just now, Blue ROI said:

It wasn't Sterling's finest hour but it wasn't for the want of trying. He had a fine tournament overall.

 

The other 2 were a big disappointment on the night.

 

Mount absolutely ghosted his way through the tournament. Unless he massively buckle up his ideas then I'd like to think he's pretty down low in the pecking order for the WC qualifiers and the actual WC as well 

[The Guvnor]

17 minutes ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

Or Southgate has seen them all take penalties in training and they were his strongest five? Henderson didn't take one yet he did versus Colombia at WC18

Maybe, but you need strong characters to take pens. Kane you never doubted him, Maguires was as good a penalty as you will see then a trio of young lads, two of which had hardly kicked a ball before being expected to pop it in the onion bag under unimaginable pressure.

Bizarre choice from Southgate, and really hope those talented young lads aren't too badly affected.

The knuckle draggers making obscene racist tweets are just the lowest pond life imaginable.

[whoareyaaa]

Shaw and Walker should have been shoes ins for the penos what was the bloke thinking !

[foxes_rule1978]

1 minute ago, whoareyaaa said:

Shaw and Walker should have been shoes ins for the penos what was the bloke thinking !

I found it strange that we would stick three young players in for the first 5 penos, usually you have your best taker at number 5… that would be Kane… Henderson and Sterling should have also have taking kicks. It hurts, because as much as Italy were the better team we were so close 

[Koke]

4 minutes ago, whoareyaaa said:

Shaw and Walker should have been shoes ins for the penos what was the bloke thinking !

 

Rashford is a reliable pen taker tbh. 

 

My 5 would be 

 

Kane

Rashford

Shaw

Grealish/Sterling

Sancho

 

I don't understand how attacking players aren't solid pen takers. Mount,  Grealish, Sterling should be counted on. 

[SemperEadem]

42 minutes ago, Babylon said:

So what, they should just stand back and let them all in? Some of them went OTT, but they also helped get it back under control when the stewards had lost it. People were getting crushed, it was dangerous. 

 

You're not the first person I've seen seemingly stand up for people who've broken down numerous barriers, pushed down fences, rushed entrances, attacked police, stewards and fans with tickets and put lives in danger. But apparently it's those standing up to them who are the problem, **** that. 

 

"Jibbers" presumably another word for criminal yeah?

Whether you agree with Jibbing or not why would you start bashing your own fans up. Odd behaviour that

[DJ Barry Hammond]

4 hours ago, Bert said:

Absolutely. I’ve always thought when it comes to pens it should be “who wants one” And then go from there. 

Personally, I think that’s too arbitrary for the modern day game where everything else is looked at to the nth degree.

 

In my mind, the top 7/8 of the order should be reasonably known as you go into the tournament and they should be picked on a mental aptitude basis - at this level, technique shouldn’t be in question.

 

And here’s the thing - if you know at the start your top 7 or 8 takers, your psychology coach can work on those in little sessions throughout the tournament so they are ready if and when the time comes to step forward.

 

Then you don’t have players stepping forward out of random choice - you have players ready and in the right mind frame to execute.

 

 

 

 

[yorkie1999]

47 minutes ago, oadby.fox said:

 Tremendously disappointing.

 

I have kept fairly quiet on many things this tournament as I was happy that we were just about managing to scrape through every game. In the end though, the lack of attacking intent and managerial direction has ultimately cost us in addition to some bizarre substitutions in the final. I thought it was strange bringing Henderson on at a time when the game was crying out for some to run at them, I was thinking Grealish, but to bring Hendo on only to take him off for penalties was even more bizarre. 
 

I also did not understand the introduction of Rashford and Sancho. The latter should’ve perhaps been brought on earlier when there was time to make something happen but instead it seems both were brought in from the cold to try and deliver in an incredibly high pressure situation - not very sensible when you’re in horrid form and low in confidence. Like others have said, for all of Italy’s street wise mentality, the two CB’s are old and are there to be got at if you make them commit. We had the youth, energy and pace in the squad to make it happen but didn’t even really give it a go. That’s the most frustrating thing in the end as well, for all their endeavour we will always wonder why Southgate couldn’t take the brakes off for 40 minutes or so. 
 

Finally, Kane, England’s poster boy was anonymous yet again. I know he popped up with important goals on the way to the final but let’s be honest - his overall performances in the big moments for both club and country have been appalling and it’s not impossible to imagine someone else being able to grab similar goals. His overall influence on the game for England is so minimal especially considering that he’s a captain and someone who is supposed to be talismanic. For me, he’s just never had that quality - he’s been fantastically consistent for Tottenham but he seems to be found out when it matters and that’s ultimately what you’ll be remembered for irrespective of how many tap-ins or penalties you score against lower ranked sides. 
 

This squad was crying out for a Barnes type player and with Sancho we did have something quite close but he was never really utilised during the tournament and I suppose his England form somewhat merits that exclusion. Having said that, I doubt Barnes would get a start even if fit. On the bright side, players of the tournament for me are Luke Shaw and Phillips. I’ve honestly never seen Shaw play so well, he was thoroughly impressive throughout the whole thing.

Kane is obviously a very good goal scorer for club and country but the blind faith put on him by managers is ridiculous. I mean, he's a bit of a jonah ain't he, scores tons of goals, gets golden goals, awards and everything, but teams he plays for never win anything.  It's almost at the point that managers believe he is guranteed to score in every match so he has to stay on and the system has to be built around him. Hopefully Sancho can put a bit of pressure on him, or take pressure off him if that makes sense, in the future.

[SouthStandUpperTier]

3 minutes ago, foxes_rule1978 said:

I found it strange that we would stick three young players in for the first 5 penos, usually you have your best taker at number 5… that would be Kane… Henderson and Sterling should have also have taking kicks. It hurts, because as much as Italy were the better team we were so close 

Your best penalty takers should go 1st, 2nd and 4th imho. You need to get off to a good start, and the 4th is often the winning penalty. Sometimes it doesn't even go to the 5th so I wouldn't put my best taker there.

[StanSP]