EURO 2020 FINAL. England v Italy. At Wembley. Thread.

[Unabomber]

If Grealish wanted one then why didn’t he take the one Saka took? I really can’t imagine Saka asking to take one. It makes no sense. 

[foxes_rule1978]

Just now, Unabomber said:

If Grealish wanted one then why didn’t he take the one Saka took? I really can’t imagine Saka asking to take one. It makes no sense. 

Southgate wanted saka to take it, he had been working on penalties for a month or so with the team. So he had a plan, but didn’t work out this time. 

[Unabomber]

Just now, foxes_rule1978 said:

Southgate wanted saka to take it, he had been working on penalties for a month or so with the team. So he had a plan, but didn’t work out this time. 

Bad plan that was

[Sol thewall Bamba]

15 minutes ago, Feed The Yak!! said:

England fans in this thread are claiming that Italy 'are the worst cheats in the world' without a shred of self awareness though so clearly nothing has been learnt whatsoever 

I literally said England weren't saints either, just that Italy were the worst at it. 

[GingerrrFox]

1 minute ago, Unabomber said:

If Grealish wanted one then why didn’t he take the one Saka took? I really can’t imagine Saka asking to take one. It makes no sense. 

Southgate said he chose the penalty takers based on who had been taking penalties well in training. Seems a bit flawed to me as it’s all fun and games taking a pen in training but it’s a completely different thing to send a 19 year old out in front of the world with all that pressure on him. 

[Finnegan]

I know I don't fully get the whole Fan Culture enthusiasm, fawning over tifos and ultras and acting like away days are the best experience in human history. It's just not really my thing but, fair play, each to their own. 

 

But you've got to be an absolute tool of the highest order to be defending anyone that tried to force their way in to the stadium or even bemoaning heavy handed treatment of them. 

 

 

[foxes_rule1978]

Just now, Unabomber said:

Bad plan that was

Yeah he went with what he saw in training, for me the pressure and cool head you need to take such a penalty can’t be replicated. Grealish would have been my pick, just because he is the type of player that would relish such a penalty rather than dread taking it 

[SouthStandUpperTier]

Just had a look and Sterling is 1 for 4 in his career on penalties, and Grealish is 0 for 1. Southgate was probably right to have them well down the list.

[foxile5]

2 minutes ago, foxes_rule1978 said:

Yeah he went with what he saw in training, for me the pressure and cool head you need to take such a penalty can’t be replicated. Grealish would have been my pick, just because he is the type of player that would relish such a penalty rather than dread taking it 

Saka has spent the largest portion of his career playing in empty stadiums for a real with no real pressure on him. That's a huge step up, taking a sudden death penalty in a major international final. 

[ealingfox]

I think we can all be clear that with Big Harv and Jimmy Justin fit we win that tournament.

[STUHILL]

I know he shouldn't be sacked and of course he won't be, but I do think the warning signs are there with Southgate. 

 

He got us to the final which is a great achievement but there are also some concerning elements to his management style, and just by his post match comments, I don't see his approach changing any time soon. 

 

He is very much a Manager who tries not to lose, as oppose to pushing for the win and to dominate games with goals. I think he has been fortunate with having a number of top players available to him, which in my opinion has masked some of the real weaknesses in his tactics and motivations. 

 

He is obviously an intelligent man though and although post match, I did not really like what I was hearing from him, he should still absolutely be given the chance to change his approach and start utilising this talented, attacking squad of players, much better. 

 

Lets hope we go into the world cup with the hand-brake off and the ambition to bully teams off the pitch with fast, attacking football and most of all, our most exciting players on the pitch! 

 

 

Edited 12 July 2021 by STUHILL

[Royston.]

13 minutes ago, Duquesne Whistle said:

This isn't far off for me. Unimpressive football only really works out alright if you win the tournament. Barring the Ukraine match, who looked shellshocked from the minute they conceded the first, England looked pedestrian for large swathes of the competition. In a way, you can't really blame them for that. It was working, they were getting through the draw, so stuck with what they were doing well. 

 

Personally, I thought Kane was alright in the first half hour, he had a lot of work to do because Mount was ineffective and consequently looked shattered by 50 minutes in. I commented to my old man that Kane would be kept on for the possible eventually of penalties regardless of whether he looked knackered or not, and so it proved. His last 90 minutes on the pitch were pretty awful. No point in going over the treatment of Vardy again, but that has inevitably put a lot of Leicester fans off England and you can understand why.

 

I've already had my say on the lack of subs when we were clearly struggling, the lack of subs to try and win it in extra time and the utterly bizarre 118th minute subs and penalty taking line up, not much else to say on that.

 

On your last line, England will need to evolve, as you say. It's unlikely they'll win trophies whomever is in charge, they haven't done until this point with one exception. Southgate is at a crossroads now, his style of management/coaching/team set up, has taken England further than most before him, but it ultimately hasn't worked. He does deserve praise and seems like a thoroughly decent bloke, but elite sport is cut-throat and he's trying to learn on the job. He stayed passive when Croatia took a total grip of our World Cup semi and did the same last night. He must learn this time, change tack and become a more offensive manager. That is possible, not sure whether it is probable. Winning something though, is a tough ask for anyone, as has proven the case this time again. There's a stunningly short list of English managers to take over and we didn't do too well with Foreign trophy machines like Sven and Capello anyway.

 

Like the last World cup, it's been a unifying campaign for the England players and most of their fans, that can't be all bad. It will always seem like a missed opportunity though, probably the biggest one to date, given it wasn't a vintage Italian team in the final.

 

 

I don't see Southgate learning/changing cos the FA will be licking his balls for taking England to a final.

Who else since Alf Ramsey has zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzźzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

[Zear0]

Impossible scenario to prepare for.  Lampard made the point that those stuttering penalties are easy as pie in training but are so much harder when the pressure is on and should be avoided.  Hindsight and all, but people like Henderson who, whatever you think of him, have delivered in high pressure games consistently are probably the guys you want taking the kicks as handling the pressure must surely trump training ground penalty kick numbers.

[StanSP]

Should Kane have spoken? 

 

 

[Guest StevieLynex]

14 hours ago, Walkers said:

Well my comment is directed at the guy saying Southgate is 100% to blame for over half the takers missing their kicks. He must have forgot to tell them to score them or something.. Saka is a bit like Waghorn when we lost to Cardiff. Not sure why he's taking the decisive penalty

And Rashford did a Kermogant

[HybridFox]

8 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

I know I don't fully get the whole Fan Culture enthusiasm, fawning over tifos and ultras and acting like away days are the best experience in human history. It's just not really my thing but, fair play, each to their own. 

 

But you've got to be an absolute tool of the highest order to be defending anyone that tried to force their way in to the stadium or even bemoaning heavy handed treatment of them. 

 

 

Gives FIFA any excuse not to award us the 2030 World Cup 

[foxes_rule1978]

2 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

Impossible scenario to prepare for.  Lampard made the point that those stuttering penalties are easy as pie in training but are so much harder when the pressure is on and should be avoided.  Hindsight and all, but people like Henderson who, whatever you think of him, have delivered in high pressure games consistently are probably the guys you want taking the kicks as handling the pressure must surely trump training ground penalty kick numbers.

Rashford does everything right, but ends up slightly mishitting the ball… the stutter and having to focus when doing that with watching the goalkeeper can lead to something going wrong. I will always favour just smashing the ball in like maguire did, less things that can go wrong 

[StanSP]

 

 

 

[Scotch]

Unlucky lads. Congrats on a great tournament.

 

The scary thing about this England team is that all your best players are attacking minded yet throughout the Euro's, they showed how good a defensive side they can be. Find that balance between the two and you'll be one of the best teams on the planet, hands down. 

Touching briefly on the Italy/England are cheats topic. All teams are the same, it's niave to think otherwise. Some are just better at it than others. 

If you compare that professional foul to Maguire pretending he was kicked in the face for example...One potentially saved the game and the other didn't. I personally don't think Sterling dived in the semi but Kane is terrible for it, as soon as anyone goes near him. The Italians are no different.

 

As for the English fans behaviour? No one expected anything less. In the eyes of the world, this is what England fans are and although no one is stupid enough to believe that it is anywhere near the majority, it's clear that it is a bigger minority than most nations and it isn't down to us to change how we see you, it's down to you as a collective fanbase to change how the world sees you.

 

Again, well done on a great tournament and hopefully the hurt of losing out doesn't last too long because I feel the potential your squad has is very scary. 

[Guest StevieLynex]

11 minutes ago, foxes_rule1978 said:

Southgate wanted saka to take it, he had been working on penalties for a month or so with the team. So he had a plan, but didn’t work out this time. 

Why do footballers who are paid an extortionate amount of money have to practice taking penalties. If they cannot hit the target from 12 yards out, what chance do they have of passing to a colleague?

[Guest Chocolate Teapot]

15 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

I know I don't fully get the whole Fan Culture enthusiasm, fawning over tifos and ultras and acting like away days are the best experience in human history. It's just not really my thing but, fair play, each to their own. 

 

But you've got to be an absolute tool of the highest order to be defending anyone that tried to force their way in to the stadium or even bemoaning heavy handed treatment of them. 

 

 

There's a big difference between a class away end or bone headed violence though.

[NasPb]

20 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Should Kane have spoken? 

 

 

Kanes first language isn't English would have been difficult tbf

[fazzyfox]

2 minutes ago, NasPb said:

Kanes first language isn't English would have been difficult tbf

"Dake der denalty derling, drealish, dome on"

[Spudulike]

13 minutes ago, Foxy_Bear said:

Unlucky lads. Congrats on a great tournament.

 

The scary thing about this England team is that all your best players are attacking minded yet throughout the Euro's, they showed how good a defensive side they can be. Find that balance between the two and you'll be one of the best teams on the planet, hands down. 

Touching briefly on the Italy/England are cheats topic. All teams are the same, it's niave to think otherwise. Some are just better at it than others. 

If you compare that professional foul to Maguire pretending he was kicked in the face for example...One potentially saved the game and the other didn't. I personally don't think Sterling dived in the semi but Kane is terrible for it, as soon as anyone goes near him. The Italians are no different.

 

As for the English fans behaviour? No one expected anything less. In the eyes of the world, this is what England fans are and although no one is stupid enough to believe that it is anywhere near the majority, it's clear that it is a bigger minority than most nations and it isn't down to us to change how we see you, it's down to you as a collective fanbase to change how the world sees you.

 

Again, well done on a great tournament and hopefully the hurt of losing out doesn't last too long because I feel the potential your squad has is very scary. 

It's a society problem. Every summer we have a cause to demonstrate about (Rebellion Extinction, Brexit, BLM, Kill the Bill, and so on) and a sizable rent-a-mob turn up just to cause trouble and ultimately the thing being protested about gets lost and tarnished with the same brush. England International football team is seen as a great vehicle to hop on board and fight the establishment. There seems to be more coverage of the trouble than the football. I'm sick of it and think the overwhelming vast majority are too. 

[yorkie1999]

37 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

I know I don't fully get the whole Fan Culture enthusiasm, fawning over tifos and ultras and acting like away days are the best experience in human history. It's just not really my thing but, fair play, each to their own. 

 

But you've got to be an absolute tool of the highest order to be defending anyone that tried to force their way in to the stadium or even bemoaning heavy handed treatment of them. 

 

 

Did they actually get into the stadium or was it just running up the steps outside the ground?