Ian Wright abuse today

[KFS]

26 minutes ago, 4everfox said:

I won't pretend that I know a great deal about the BLM movement, because I don't, but disapproving of BLM because they're "socialists" is a perfectly acceptable reason for not supporting the movement. There's nothing even remotely racist about that, some people just don't like socialism, and that is okay.

I’m far from a socialist but if you look into it, the obsession with calling BLM socialist is very weak and seems to be the thing people are hanging their hat on re:booing. It’s factually incorrect and just adds to the silliness of it all.

[HighPeakFox]

1 minute ago, leicsmac said:

I don't think that anyone said that all people that hold racist beliefs were not smart. Some of them were (and are) very smart indeed, the officer class, as it were. And that makes them dangerous. (Not implying that you belong in that group by the way, it's a simple statement of fact).

 

So while I personally appreciate the eloquence of your delivery and the verbose way in which you posit your argument, my own take on it is that it is possibly the biggest red herring put forth since smoking herring for the purposes of preservation became available, and a smokescreen to attempt to cloud a matter that has been made crystal clear by the Prem, the players and practically everyone else involved, most often by parties with their own axe to grind on the issue one way or another. Especially when it is put forth that racism isn't that big of an issue on a thread where a popular black figure has suffered racist abuse.

 

Of course, the opinion is valid to be expressed. It's just logically fallacious.

 

 

Don't underestimate the above officer class.

[sheffield_fox]

1 hour ago, MarshallForEngland said:

1. Some people reject the claim that it is an anti-racism message. The ideology associated with this gesture, and more broadly the constant discussion around race and fixation on skin colour, puts race at the forefront of every conversation. Many people, me included, believe that it is racist to constantly focus on skin colour and that the end goal is for race to be a non-defining characteristic like any other aspect of someone's physical appearance. For brevity, I'll draw a straight line between those two ideas: I am against racism, and therefore I am against taking the knee. Is it ok if I call everyone who disagrees with me a racist? Scum? Neanderthal? Ignorant? Knuckle-dragger? I don't think so.

 

2. Following on from the previous point, some people might reject the claim that we have an issue with racism in this country. It doesn't reflect what most of us have observed in our lives. Saying something racist in virtually any social context will be met with derision and probably anger. The MLK "content of character" doctrine has been more or less universally adopted by society as a whole. The fact that individuals exist who don't believe in it, or the fact that incidents happen in which people say racist things, does not disprove this. I actually think taking the knee and the race-centric "social justice" movements more broadly are undoing that progress.

So you don't think that racism exists in this country to a sufficient extent to constitute 'a problem'?

 

Thus we don't need to do anything about racism? 

 

What if you're wrong? 

[st albans fox]

why is there a discussion about BLM ??

 

BLM was dropped from association with the anti racist agenda by the players fairly quickly last summer. 
 

BLM has nothing to do with the players taking a knee now -  I wonder if anyone who disagrees with taking the knee and accepts the booing of it would have any objections if the players made a different gesture like holding their fists above their heads ??  

[Leeds Fox]

After scanning through 19 pages, can I just say… 

 

Ian Wright is a fuching great ambassador of our sport! 
 

Feel free to show him some love and respect on social media and show him we’re not like the muppets abusing him yesterday afternoon 

[Claridge]

2 hours ago, RumbleFox said:

I love having my mind changed about things if I’m wrong and I love listening to opposing viewpoints. Please explain to me why it’s idiotic and in what ways and why I’m wrong. I’d genuinely like to hear what you think. Thank you. X 

Because you don't know the reasons whilst all of the people don't support the taking of the knee or support the black live matters movement .Of course there is a need to stop racism , but a lot of the BLM members are odious characters who are as bad as the racists in some cases. I don't support the knee because of this connection and because its related to George Floyd who was a nasty piece of work(Didn't deserve what that policeman did to him). Be quite happy to support another form of protest,but taking the knee, no thanks.

I would never boo it, but I wouldn't applaud it either.

[Babylon]

How a grown ups mind works…

 

Players: “We aren’t supporting a political party”

Grown Up: “Fair enough”.

 

How a man baby / closet racist mind works…

 

Players: “We aren’t supporting a political party”

Man baby: “But you support BLM”.

Players: “No we aren’t, we just clarified this”

Man baby: “well I shall continue to boo because my feeble mind cannot comprehend you not supporting them”.

 

[STUHILL]

3 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

 I wonder if anyone who disagrees with taking the knee and accepts the booing of it would have any objections if the players made a different gesture like holding their fists above their heads ??  

They absolutely would have objections. They are making it about the gesture to try and stop the message being heard. Many have their own motives for this, some are genuine racists, some would just prefer they don't have to see or hear about it. Both are the problem. 

 

 

[KFS]

1 minute ago, Claridge said:

Because you don't know the reasons whilst all of the people don't support the taking of the knee or support the black live matters movement .Of course there is a need to stop racism , but a lot of the BLM members are odious characters who are as bad as the racists in some cases. I don't support the knee because of this connection and because its related to George Floyd who was a nasty piece of work(Didn't deserve what that policeman did to him). Be quite happy to support another form of protest,but taking the knee, no thanks.

I would never boo it, but I wouldn't applaud it either.

What the fvcking hell?

[Babylon]

2 minutes ago, Claridge said:

Because you don't know the reasons whilst all of the people don't support the taking of the knee or support the black live matters movement .Of course there is a need to stop racism , but a lot of the BLM members are odious characters who are as bad as the racists in some cases. I don't support the knee because of this connection and because its related to George Floyd who was a nasty piece of work(Didn't deserve what that policeman did to him). Be quite happy to support another form of protest,but taking the knee, no thanks.

I would never boo it, but I wouldn't applaud it either.

How many more times exactly do you need clubs, players or the league to disassociate themselves with BLM (the group, not the notion)? 

[TJB-fox]

Feel utterly disgusted reading through Twitter and this thread. 
 

Whether it was Londoners or Leicester fans involved, I am so ashamed it’s linked with Leicester city. Look at our fan base and a lot of our players ffs. 
 

This whole Marxism nonsense is a complete joke, do people genuinely believe it? It’s almost like it was a parody idea set up for a laugh that’s accidentally gone a bit far and people now take seriously. Just gives the racists a small excuse to Cling on to. 
 

Let’s be fair, if you don’t believe in the BLM movement or taking the knee, it’s a high chance you’re a dumb racist idiot. 
 

If you’re a dumb racist idiot, fvck off. Fvck off as far away from my glorious football club as you possibly can. You’re not wanted and you never will be. Honestly raging about this. 

[LiberalFox]

For those talking about "Cultural Marxism"

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Marxism_conspiracy_theory

 

"Cultural Marxism is a far-right antisemitic conspiracy theory which claims Western Marxism as the basis of continuing academic and intellectual efforts to subvert Western culture."

 

I don't think you can really "both sides" an ideology that is basically modernised Nazi ideology. 

 

 

[Guest MarshallForEngland]

1 minute ago, leicsmac said:

I don't think that anyone said that all people that hold racist beliefs were not smart. Some of them were (and are) very smart indeed, the officer class, as it were. And that makes them dangerous. (Not implying that you belong in that group by the way, it's a simple statement of fact).

 

So while I personally appreciate the eloquence of your delivery and the verbose way in which you posit your argument, my own take on it is that it is possibly the biggest red herring put forth since smoking herring for the purposes of preservation became available, and a smokescreen to attempt to cloud a matter that has been made crystal clear by the Prem, the players and practically everyone else involved, most often by parties with their own axe to grind on the issue one way or another. Especially when it is put forth that racism isn't that big of an issue on a thread where a popular black figure has suffered racist abuse.

 

Of course, the opinion is valid to be expressed. It's just logically fallacious.

 

 

Don't underestimate the above officer class.

Ian Wright's own response was measured and proportionate. He acknowledged that it was a subset of a group of fans he generally has a lot of respect for. He said the people who did it let themselves down; not that they were scum, irredeemably evil etc (not saying you have said this either by the way). If you are willing to make the claim that racism IS a big issue until there are zero cases of anybody even saying something racist, then of course your argument is totally unfalsifiable. We will never get to the point where literally nobody says anything racist, so you'll always believe that this is an urgent problem big enough to warrant performative gestures, demonstrations, public denouncements etc. I do not believe that incidents such as the one in which some people shouted racist insults at Wrighty is evidence that the country has a big problem with racism. As I have said before, it's like saying that the fact that somebody cut you up this morning means that we are a nation of poor drivers. Isolated incidents don't suggest an overall trend. Our country is not one in which shouting racist insults at black people is considered acceptable; the fact that some people don't agree or sometimes do not behave as if that is true does not disprove that.

[dmayne7]

52 minutes ago, Boethius said:

This is a welcome paragraph of common sense in a thread of hollow, virtue-signalling gambits. Of course racism is 'an' issue, but the time and coverage the topic is afforded by the media far outweighs that of other, equally important, issues. Even in the realm of equality, racism is seen by many as more offensive than homophobia or sexism, whilst ageism is almost accepted. Surely, Leicester is one of the most tolerant cities in one of the most tolerant countries in the world? Yes, it can be argued that one racist incident is one too many but, again, why is racism placed on a higher plain than any other form of abuse? Race is one facet of many that make up a human being. If we keep dividing people into groups and sub-groups, when we drill down far enough we find that we are all in a minority of one. We are all individuals. Our modern media are obsessed with external identifiers, whilst rarely considering diversity of thought. My opinion, is that BLM and taking the knee, is creating rather than closing division. Having spent many years campaigning for equality, true equality, this is why I will continue to boo players taking the knee. I fully appreciate that some will disagree with my thoughts, and I respect all views. If only all could do the same.

Why's that? Because of the high ethnic Asian population? You could argue that it creates and added level of understanding, appreciation etc. leading to a single sense of community idea. On the flip side it can also create a sense of resentment as the white population see shops, jobs etc previously held by white people, now held by the Asian community? Not saying I would ever share nor subscribe to the latter viewpoint but there are 2 sides to the coin. Just as somebody earlier was blaming London based Leicester fans, where London has a black population, proportionately double that of Leicester (so many 100's of thousands people more), does that create inclusion or division? Not an easily answered question.

 

The point on inclusion is an interesting one. If you take gender/sexual identity as an example, a lot of these movements are ironically labelling and creating new segments of individuals, so consequently forcing everyone to identify as different and inadvertently create further divisions. I speak from a place of ignorance but not sure how creating more and more labels is helping in the fight for equality. Appreciate that's a massive oversimplification and there's clearly way more to do to tackle gender and sexual discrimination

 

The sad thing is that human beings are not all equal. We each have our own set of strengths and weaknesses. And we will always see somebody's race, age and gender at first glance because that is how human beings are hardwired. But what we need to do, is to afford the same opportunities to all and not allow discrimination of any kind.

 

Don't have to agree with taking the knee but why you would boo it is beyond me.

[Bert]

I think the club should make it a non offence to punch any twat that partakes in any booing during the players taking the knee. 

[Spudulike]

Little late to this conversation but do we know how many were abusing Ian Wright? Are we talking 5, 10, 50 or more? Hopefully it's low numbers that can be tracked down and dealt with. I'm disgusted by these people and trying not to let it take the shine off of yesterday. 

 

I've tweeted Ian Wright to assure him that the vast overwhelming majority of LCFC fans are horrified by these few (hopefully) morons. 

[Guest Cujek]

2 hours ago, Haydos said:

Normal people agree that racism should stop.

 

 

Why go out of your way to boo it? It's a harmless gesture that doesn't affect you.

 

Do you really think the people booing it are big on racial equality and just think it's been done in the wrong way?

No, but I think everyone arguing about who is the least racist is pathetic and it's just getting boring now.

[KFS]

2 minutes ago, Babylon said:

How many more times exactly do you need clubs, players or the league to disassociate themselves with BLM (the group, not the notion)? 

Even if they did the utter fake news that people are spouting on this thread is frightening. Literally will use anything to justify not supporting anti racism. It’s perplexing.

[RumbleFox]

6 minutes ago, Claridge said:

Because you don't know the reasons whilst all of the people don't support the taking of the knee or support the black live matters movement .Of course there is a need to stop racism , but a lot of the BLM members are odious characters who are as bad as the racists in some cases. I don't support the knee because of this connection and because its related to George Floyd who was a nasty piece of work(Didn't deserve what that policeman did to him). Be quite happy to support another form of protest,but taking the knee, no thanks.

I would never boo it, but I wouldn't applaud it either.

I didn’t mention BLM movement at all. I said the statement “black people’s lives matter”. You seem to be arguing against a strawman there? 

[Babylon]

In a statement today, Palace said: “As people will have seen from our first home game, we have placed banners over our seated areas at Selhurst Park that read: BLACK LIVES MATTER.

“We stand proudly alongside members of the BAME community, our players and employees, and behind the ideals and ethos of 'black lives matter'.

 

“However, we would like to make clear that we do not endorse any pressure group or body that carries the same term in its name, and we strongly believe that organisations should not use this important force for change and positivity to push their own political agendas.

 

 

“We want to be part of a world that is fair, inclusive and open to all.

“As an organisation, we recognise that we need to do more, and we will do more to contribute towards this goal.”

 

Premier league:

Masters insisted the League had responded to a “unanimous” view of players they wanted to mark both the work done by the NHS during the coronavirus crisis and BLM.

He said: “I think it is perfectly possible to support Black Lives Matter - the sentiment - without being seen to support any political organisation.

“We are an apolitical organisation but I think we are happy to support the players.

 

“It is the right moment to do it and for the first time I feel that players, managers, leagues and clubs are on the same page on the issue of discrimination and that feels to me like a positive step.”

 

[sheffield_fox]

2 minutes ago, Claridge said:

Because you don't know the reasons whilst all of the people don't support the taking of the knee or support the black live matters movement .Of course there is a need to stop racism , but a lot of the BLM members are odious characters who are as bad as the racists in some cases. I don't support the knee because of this connection and because its related to George Floyd who was a nasty piece of work(Didn't deserve what that policeman did to him). Be quite happy to support another form of protest,but taking the knee, no thanks.

I would never boo it, but I wouldn't applaud it either.

I think it's been made abundantly clear that the gesture no longer has anything to do with the BLM group. 

 

That said, despite not liking the knee, you're tolerating it by not booing. Plenty of others could learn from that. 

[Claridge]

3 minutes ago, KFS said:

What the fvcking hell?

Might have worded that badly, but he did hold a knife to a pregnant woman's stomach to rob her, doesn't excuse the policeman, but portraying him as some kind of hero by the BLM movement doesn't feel right to me.

[HighPeakFox]

7 minutes ago, Claridge said:

Be quite happy to support another form of protest,but taking the knee, no thanks.

I would never boo it, but I wouldn't applaud it either.

And for me, that's fine. There are many who think it ineffective too, Zaha for one. It's the booing of it that is the issue here, and what it really stands for.

[Claridge]

1 minute ago, RumbleFox said:

I didn’t mention BLM movement at all. I said the statement “black people’s lives matter”. You seem to be arguing against a strawman there? 

I read it wrong then, my mistake. If someone says black lives don't matter, then they are obviously a nut job racist

[Fightforever]

7 minutes ago, dmayne7 said:

Why's that? Because of the high ethnic Asian population? You could argue that it creates and added level of understanding, appreciation etc. leading to a single sense of community idea. On the flip side it can also create a sense of resentment as the white population see shops, jobs etc previously held by white people, now held by the Asian community? Not saying I would ever share nor subscribe to the latter viewpoint but there are 2 sides to the coin. Just as somebody earlier was blaming London based Leicester fans, where London has a black population, proportionately double that of Leicester (so many 100's of thousands people more), does that create inclusion or division? Not an easily answered question.

 

The point on inclusion is an interesting one. If you take gender/sexual identity as an example, a lot of these movements are ironically labelling and creating new segments of individuals, so consequently forcing everyone to identify as different and inadvertently create further divisions. I speak from a place of ignorance but not sure how creating more and more labels is helping in the fight for equality. Appreciate that's a massive oversimplification and there's clearly way more to do to tackle gender and sexual discrimination

 

The sad thing is that human beings are not all equal. We each have our own set of strengths and weaknesses. And we will always see somebody's race, age and gender at first glance because that is how human beings are hardwired. But what we need to do, is to afford the same opportunities to all and not allow discrimination of any kind.

 

Don't have to agree with taking the knee but why you would boo it is beyond me.

Biggest myth in Leicester is the city is diverse and therefore not racist. The Asian areas TEND to be seperate from the areas where English people live and few people have freinds of the other race. Different races tend to see each other at work be cordial then go home to their own communities. Why do you think the regular attendence at the King Power stadium is like 97% English?

Edited 8 August 2021 by Fightforever
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