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Sampson

Ukraine

By Sampson, in General Chat

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String fellow

String fellow

Posted
Posted
19 hours ago, thursday_next said:

Oh, that poor woman who went on Russian TV with a placard protesting the war during their main bulletin. That's true courage. Apparently she'd been an employee for years on the station and she got fed up with broadcasting Kremlin propaganda. I hate to think of how they're treating her in prison. She is a genuine hero :(:(

It's a mad world when doing that could land her in jail, whilst the guy in the Kremlin is directly responsible for mass murder on a daily basis.   

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blabyboy

blabyboy

Posted
Posted
19 hours ago, thursday_next said:

Oh, that poor woman who went on Russian TV with a placard protesting the war during their main bulletin. That's true courage. Apparently she'd been an employee for years on the station and she got fed up with broadcasting Kremlin propaganda. I hate to think of how they're treating her in prison. She is a genuine hero :(:(

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60749279  just a fine apparently...

 

on and an invitation to tea with Putin later on..:ph34r:

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LiberalFox

LiberalFox

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, Strokes said:

It’s odd how some people are all of a sudden uncomfortable with things, now the onus is on them to do something.

Having said that, I think I heard something along the lines of 40k+ have registered firm interest. :appl:

Fair play to them.

I'd have liked the government to have made it easy for people with Ukrainian relatives to get them over here. It's what every other country in Europe managed to do. It's likely that would involve an order of magnitude in the 1000's rising to the 10,000's. As far as I'm aware people are still struggling to get their visas sorted out and are getting stranded in Europe despite having people in the UK ready to take care of them. Even right wing press like the Spectator was critical of the government's approach. 

 

So I can't help but look at the "homes for Ukraine" scheme and feel like it's been rushed out to grab headlines with very little planning. Someone else I know put it well:

 

'If you like refugees so much why don't you put them in your spare bedroom' is a legitimate voting demographic which this govt relies on and the govt continually shifts collective responsibility into personal responsibility (being green, corona etc). It is also the prevailing mindset and an argument a lot of people, for some reason, seem to get behind. The fact that it is entirely unrealistic and implausible is a secondary issue."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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fuchsntf

fuchsntf

Posted
Posted
6 hours ago, kenny said:

We have a housing shortage in the UK as it is. England has the highest population density in Europe.

 

As a country we can offer many things, an abundance of empty homes isn't one of them. As such, the only solution the government has is to invite people to open their doors. The issue is what will happen in 6 months, when it is realised that the Ukraine remains unstable and people aren't willing to return to their homes.

I'd rather have them here (Western Europe) than being murdered...in fact annihilated

This World  Really does stink..!!

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SecretPro

SecretPro

Posted
Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, kenny said:

We have a housing shortage in the UK as it is. England has the highest population density in Europe.

 

As a country we can offer many things, an abundance of empty homes isn't one of them. As such, the only solution the government has is to invite people to open their doors. The issue is what will happen in 6 months, when it is realised that the Ukraine remains unstable and people aren't willing to return to their homes.

It's a wholly manufactured 'Housing Crisis' in this country which suits the Government, Landowners and construction companies. Like the myth of affordable housing, the Government consider a £250k house affordable - I'm pretty sure actual affordable housing should sit around the £100k mark but the construction companies won't build them as there is no profit in it. See how in any housing price spike or fall, bungalows always retain their value - companies don't build them anymore because for the square footage they do not create enough profit, hence Bungalows are now some of the most sought after and most buoyant properties on the market. 

 

There is no housing shortage in England, the fact is there are over 1 million empty homes here. What there is in this country is a lack of affordable housing and the appetite by the powers that be to build them or renovate those already standing. 

Edited by SecretPro
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FoxesDeb

FoxesDeb

Posted
Posted
35 minutes ago, LiberalFox said:

I'd have liked the government to have made it easy for people with Ukrainian relatives to get them over here. It's what every other country in Europe managed to do. It's likely that would involve an order of magnitude in the 1000's rising to the 10,000's. As far as I'm aware people are still struggling to get their visas sorted out and are getting stranded in Europe despite having people in the UK ready to take care of them. Even right wing press like the Spectator was critical of the government's approach. 

 

So I can't help but look at the "homes for Ukraine" scheme and feel like it's been rushed out to grab headlines with very little planning. Someone else I know put it well:

 

'If you like refugees so much why don't you put them in your spare bedroom' is a legitimate voting demographic which this govt relies on and the govt continually shifts collective responsibility into personal responsibility (being green, corona etc). It is also the prevailing mindset and an argument a lot of people, for some reason, seem to get behind. The fact that it is entirely unrealistic and implausible is a secondary issue."

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I think the reason the EU is able to make it easy for them to travel is because they are free to travel within the Schengen area visa free. It would always have been more difficult for Ukrainians to travel to the UK. 

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thursday_next

thursday_next

Posted
Posted
53 minutes ago, westernpark said:

Soft response in full view of the West. 

 

Seems so. They don't want her in prison as a martyr, they had enough problems with Pussy Riot. She would be well advised to eat only food that's been prepared in front of her, and leave Russia if at all possible. 

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st albans fox

st albans fox

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, blabyboy said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-60749279  just a fine apparently...

 

on and an invitation to tea with Putin later on..:ph34r:

 

1 hour ago, westernpark said:

Soft response in full view of the West. 

I believe the fine is in relation to the video she released 

it could be that she hasn’t yet had her punishment for the tv protest …..

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bovril

bovril

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, FoxesDeb said:

I think the reason the EU is able to make it easy for them to travel is because they are free to travel within the Schengen area visa free. It would always have been more difficult for Ukrainians to travel to the UK. 

Ireland and Romania aren't in Schengen and as far as I'm aware they've taken in many more, especially Romania, though obviously they are a neighbour. Poland already had a large immigrant and refugee population and I don't believe their infrastructure or finances are any better than ours. 

 

People have voted repeatedly for strict immigration controls, it was the main reason for leaving the single market no? 

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FoxesDeb

FoxesDeb

Posted
Posted
13 minutes ago, bovril said:

Ireland and Romania aren't in Schengen and as far as I'm aware they've taken in many more, especially Romania, though obviously they are a neighbour. Poland already had a large immigrant and refugee population and I don't believe their infrastructure or finances are any better than ours. 

 

People have voted repeatedly for strict immigration controls, it was the main reason for leaving the single market no? 

Honestly I have no idea of the numbers, my post was purely a response to Liberal Fox who was asking why it seems easier for EU countries to accept the refugees. It's logistical, my local town has sent two buses to the Polish border to collect people and they are on the way as we speak. No visas needed, and paperwork will be sorted out once they are settled. 

 

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kenny

kenny

Posted
Posted
58 minutes ago, SecretPro said:

It's a wholly manufactured 'Housing Crisis' in this country which suits the Government, Landowners and construction companies. Like the myth of affordable housing, the Government consider a £250k house affordable - I'm pretty sure actual affordable housing should sit around the £100k mark but the construction companies won't build them as there is no profit in it. See how in any housing price spike or fall, bungalows always retain their value - companies don't build them anymore because for the square footage they do not create enough profit, hence Bungalows are now some of the most sought after and most buoyant properties on the market. 

 

There is no housing shortage in England, the fact is there are over 1 million empty homes here. What there is in this country is a lack of affordable housing and the appetite by the powers that be to build them or renovate those already standing. 

The population of the UK is growing by around 300k per year and we are building around 160k homes.

 

So despite the development going on and the relaxation on planning laws, we break even each year.

 

Like it or not we are running out of space in the UK which will only be resolved by reducing the population. 

 

As material prices and wages increase at the rate they have the cost to build will only increase. If the proposal is that the government is to build houses for people to live in then the sale cost is irrelevant anyway.

 

Its also worth mentioning that affordable housing includes a variety of schemes including housing association rentals, assisted living accommodation and part purchasing schemes. This mix is decided upon by the local authority and they have to balance between building enough houses and forcing the developers to build what type of accomodation.

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bovril

bovril

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, FoxesDeb said:

Honestly I have no idea of the numbers, my post was purely a response to Liberal Fox who was asking why it seems easier for EU countries to accept the refugees. It's logistical, my local town has sent two buses to the Polish border to collect people and they are on the way as we speak. No visas needed, and paperwork will be sorted out once they are settled. 

 

Yes us being out of the EU makes it harder it's just weird to me people are saying there's nothing more we can do as if the electorate hasn't voted more than once to make it harder for Eastern Europeans to come here

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kenny

kenny

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, bovril said:

Yes us being out of the EU makes it harder it's just weird to me people are saying there's nothing more we can do as if the electorate hasn't voted more than once to make it harder for Eastern Europeans to come here

The red tape and the ineptitude of the home office goes back for many years.

 

I know much isn't made of the security aspect, but this far the UK is the only country to have been specifically threatened by Putin and we have already suffered from a chemical attack by Russia. 

 

If any country is to be targeted by non conventional weapons, I would guess that the UK will be top of the list. A bit of paranoia in these times is no bad thing IMO.

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st albans fox

st albans fox

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, kenny said:

The red tape and the ineptitude of the home office goes back for many years.

 

I know much isn't made of the security aspect, but this far the UK is the only country to have been specifically threatened by Putin and we have already suffered from a chemical attack by Russia. 

 

If any country is to be targeted by non conventional weapons, I would guess that the UK will be top of the list. A bit of paranoia in these times is no bad thing IMO.

I’ve seen a few simulations of how a nuclear exchange would go and the initial ones don’t really affect the U.K. - very Central Europe centred 

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Sampson

Sampson

Posted
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When our Home Secretary is having a go at the Irish PM for letting refugees in more laxly, because of our open borders with Ireland, then it’s pretty obvious we can do more and many saying we can do more would like to see a similar policy to that which Ireland is doing. Or a joint CTA policy with Ireland.

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westernpark

westernpark

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

I’ve seen a few simulations of how a nuclear exchange would go and the initial ones don’t really affect the U.K. - very Central Europe centred 

I would argue we’d be first targeted. Based on the fact that we’ve been so unnecessarily vocal in comparison to our actual actions, Johnson is trying to take charge on Europe’s reaction, outside of EU boundary. Russia on many occasions has specifically mentioned us, regarding Truss comments and others. We are isolated and if the winds were westwards, Europe can cry for us and just move on. Wouldn’t necessarily cause Nuclear holocaust for rest of world.

 

But we’re not there yet. There has been positive movement in regard to talks. Russian UN ambassador this morning acknowledged Zelenskyy saying they wouldn’t join NATO. Russia would recognise this if written in constitution. As someone who studies this topic at University, I am far more positive than I was two weeks ago regarding the situation. This has also been reflected in what the experts who teach me have been saying.

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