Cost of living crisis.

[kenny]

1 hour ago, dsr-burnley said:

If we renationalise energy companies, will energy be cheaper?  There are obviously lots of factors involved, but in simple numbers, the total household spending on domestic energy in 1986 (the year british Gas was privatised - electricity was a little later) was £10.8 billion.  In 2021, it was £33.5 billion.  But if it had gone up with inflation, it would have been £34.4 billion.  

 

So total spending has gone up fractionally less than inflation, but remember there are more households now, and those households have a lot more uses for fuel.  There is far more central heating, tumble driers, dishwashers, TV and computers, for example, than there were then.  costs have fallen significantly since privatisation.  Where would we have been if it hadn't happened?

I'm not sure that fits the narrative of this thread?

[filthyfox]

£1925 pay rise (the highest I've ever had) should help me through.  But I'm not really struggling anyway 

[Parafox]

1 minute ago, filthyfox said:

£1925 pay rise (the highest I've ever had) should help me through.  But I'm not really struggling anyway 

Well, good for you. 

[Foxdiamond]

1 hour ago, dsr-burnley said:

If we renationalise energy companies, will energy be cheaper?  There are obviously lots of factors involved, but in simple numbers, the total household spending on domestic energy in 1986 (the year british Gas was privatised - electricity was a little later) was £10.8 billion.  In 2021, it was £33.5 billion.  But if it had gone up with inflation, it would have been £34.4 billion.  

 

So total spending has gone up fractionally less than inflation, but remember there are more households now, and those households have a lot more uses for fuel.  There is far more central heating, tumble driers, dishwashers, TV and computers, for example, than there were then.  costs have fallen significantly since privatisation.  Where would we have been if it hadn't happened?

Not much comfort if we are paying £500 per month soon as is being reported 

[filthyfox]

10 hours ago, Lako42 said:

 If the government of this country wasn't so corrupt / incompetent I would say we need to nationalise anything that provides the things we need to actually be alive. 

 

ABSOLUTELY THIS!

This should also include basic food supply and toilet roll. 

But the amount of administration required would kill any benefit.

 

On a side note.

This month I paid £4 for the gas I actually used....

And £8 standing charge.

THAT'S CRIMINAL!

Edited 28 July 2022 by filthyfox

[yorkie1999]

2 hours ago, dsr-burnley said:

If we renationalise energy companies, will energy be cheaper?  There are obviously lots of factors involved, but in simple numbers, the total household spending on domestic energy in 1986 (the year british Gas was privatised - electricity was a little later) was £10.8 billion.  In 2021, it was £33.5 billion.  But if it had gone up with inflation, it would have been £34.4 billion.  

 

So total spending has gone up fractionally less than inflation, but remember there are more households now, and those households have a lot more uses for fuel.  There is far more central heating, tumble driers, dishwashers, TV and computers, for example, than there were then.  costs have fallen significantly since privatisation.  Where would we have been if it hadn't happened?

There’s just too many variables. I did a bit of a costing exercise at home to work out how much each appliance actually cost to run and how much power it is consuming, the most expensive stuff are things like a kettle and an electric shower , but you don’t use them much, things like a lcd tv cost something like 2p an hour to run, try that with your old cathode tube tvs, probably triple that cost, fridge freezer is about 3p an hour,  in my kitchen there’s 14 led lights which is about 50 watts, compare that to old fashioned bulbs at 60 watts apiece! 80% of our electrical items are far far cheaper to run than 35 years ago. I think even things like combi boilers were only just coming in during the mid 80’s so the concept of keeping a tank of hot water meant having the gas on most of the day, nowadays we only heat what we use, so much cheaper.

 One things for certain though, the country wouldn’t be held to ransom by a few huge companies trying to maximise their profits year on year, and if energy were to be nationalised, the government, or the electorate, would have a say in it. All those profits are to keep some shareholders happy, not to reinvest in new forms of energy and keep the prices down etc, which is probably why green technology is not, and probably never will be during our lifetimes, be at the forefront of the powers that be’s agenda, and probably why the government is expecting private companies to invest in it.

Edited 28 July 2022 by yorkie1999

[Fazzer 7]

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-city-of-hanover-turns-off-the-lights-and-hot-water-as-it-braces-for-winter-energy-crisis-12660848

[yorkie1999]

12 minutes ago, Fazzer 7 said:

https://news.sky.com/story/germany-city-of-hanover-turns-off-the-lights-and-hot-water-as-it-braces-for-winter-energy-crisis-12660848

Thing is, we, the taxpayer, owned our own gas and oil fields, we paid for its discovery and extraction, it’s ours. How could the government sell it off, it wasn’t theirs to sell. Since the 1980s £100’s of billions have been extracted, all gone to private companies, Norway didn’t privatise and now have the largest sovereign wealth fund on earth. Successive governments have completely destroyed this country and its wealth.

Edited 28 July 2022 by yorkie1999

[Foxdiamond]

I hear Truss does not agree with energy company windfall tax despite announced profits. No surprise there then. 

[filthyfox]

27 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said:

Thing is, we, the taxpayer, owned our own gas and oil fields, we paid for its discovery and extraction, it’s ours. How could the government sell it off, it wasn’t theirs to sell. Since the 1980s £100’s of billions have been extracted, all gone to private companies, Norway didn’t privatise and now have the largest sovereign wealth fund on earth. Successive governments have completely destroyed this country and its wealth.

I've just come back from Norway...

I would rather not be paying £2.20 per litre of fuel!

[grobyfox1990]

9 hours ago, filthyfox said:

I've just come back from Norway...

I would rather not be paying £2.20 per litre of fuel!

Yeh but you’d be earning 2x your salary with some insane benefits as standard 

[leicsmac]

8 minutes ago, grobyfox1990 said:

Yeh but you’d be earning 2x your salary with some insane benefits as standard 

And having the single largest soverign wealth fund in the world meaning that you are guaranteed a good pension without having to contribute much to it.

[FoyleFox]

12 hours ago, filthyfox said:

I've just come back from Norway...

I would rather not be paying £2.20 per litre of fuel!

And £15 for a pint!

[Spudulike]

17 hours ago, filthyfox said:

ABSOLUTELY THIS!

This should also include basic food supply and toilet roll. 

But the amount of administration required would kill any benefit.

 

On a side note.

This month I paid £4 for the gas I actually used....

And £8 standing charge.

THAT'S CRIMINAL!

My gas boiler was removed due to building work and I've not used any gas for over 12 weeks. I'll still get the standing charge though. 

 

[Parafox]

5 hours ago, Spudulike said:

My gas boiler was removed due to building work and I've not used any gas for over 12 weeks. I'll still get the standing charge though. 

 

Everyone gets the standing charge whether you use nil or have the gas on 24/7. The standing charge is meant to cover costs of pipeline maintenance etc.

[Parafox]

21 hours ago, filthyfox said:

I've just come back from Norway...

 

 

8 hours ago, FoyleFox said:

And £15 for a pint!

Norway needs a Weatherspoon's. 

Edited 29 July 2022 by Parafox

[Trumpet]

9 minutes ago, Parafox said:

Everyone gets the standing charge whether you use nil or have the gas on 24/7. The standing charge is meant to cover costs of pipeline maintenance etc.

Not doubting it’s for maintenance, just frustrating that the standing charge has gone up so much. I reckon last year I was using £1.50 in gas and electricity a day, more towards £2.50 with the heating on in the day. I’m at about 90p without even flicking the kettle on in the morning now.

[Parafox]

5 minutes ago, Trumpet said:

Not doubting it’s for maintenance, just frustrating that the standing charge has gone up so much. I reckon last year I was using £1.50 in gas and electricity a day, more towards £2.50

1)with the heating on in the day. I’m at about 90p

2)without even flicking the kettle on in the morning now.

1) What? Or do you mean in the winter months? 

2) I know a couple of people that have caravans or like camping that are using the camping stoves with Calor gas to make hot drinks. 

Edited 29 July 2022 by Parafox

[Trumpet]

3 minutes ago, Parafox said:

What?

I meant last year in general, so summertime I was hitting about £1.50 and then £2.50 in the winter 

 

I’d consider £2.50 a good day right now. Winter’s going to be ridiculous.

Edited 29 July 2022 by Trumpet

[Foxdiamond]

24 minutes ago, Trumpet said:

Not doubting it’s for maintenance, just frustrating that the standing charge has gone up so much. I reckon last year I was using £1.50 in gas and electricity a day, more towards £2.50 with the heating on in the day. I’m at about 90p without even flicking the kettle on in the morning now.

With these levels of profits is it too much to ask that the companies cover some of the pipeline costs. 

[grobyfox1990]

2 hours ago, Foxdiamond said:

With these levels of profits is it too much to ask that the companies cover some of the pipeline costs. 

Lol. We are on the hook for millions after so many suppliers failed and the govt had to step in to guarantee supply. Of course this was down to pure mismanagement and opening the market up to all and sundry. But I’m sure plenty will also ‘blame it on putin’ 

[Foxdiamond]

2 hours ago, Foxdiamond said:

With these levels of profits is it too much to ask that the companies cover some of the pipeline costs. 

I know this would never happen.

[fox_up_north]

Allowing every man and his dog the ability to get into energy was a huge mistake. History will show the last decade as being a series of bad decisions - opening up the market, Ofgem's poor management, selling off gas reserves, etc.

 

Three things you need to keep humans happy - food, warmth and healthcare. Yet those in power can't even get that right. 

[The Year Of The Fox]

Nice of Lacoste to help out this morning 😂

[ozleicester]

oh no, we mustnt tax them more, it wouldnt be fair...