Popular Post Ric Flair Posted 25 December 2022 Popular Post Share Posted 25 December 2022 1 hour ago, Finnegan said: He's going to go to Atleti and Simeone is going to make Brendan look an absolute mug isn't he. He will be very good there, look at some of the defenders he's had who have never been that special anywhere else and you can see Soyuncu buying in to his mentality. I don't think we've ever really appreciated Soyuncu's aggression and character as we are led by a coach who's so inoffensive and toes the party line constantly, but Simeone will have him nutting pool balls in the canteen and eating brick dust. 4 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gerblod Posted 25 December 2022 Share Posted 25 December 2022 (edited) On 21/12/2022 at 13:56, taupe said: Any player that has shown even some good games has shown the potential to convert that 'some' into most, or even all - if the conditions are right. I'd guess many/most managers are egotistical enough to believe they can create those conditions and know the magic formula to get the best out of a player. It's not like Cags hasn't shown he can play a bit, it's just that something's clicked his off switch. He's not a lost cause. Not yet anyway. If he's similarly 'not performing in training' at other clubs then maybe there's a case to give up on him, but we've yet to see that. Rodgers has, I suspect, more by fortune than judgement, managed to turn City's season around...for now anyway. Faes is predominantly responsible for this - a messiah sliding comfortably into a defence in crisis. Söyüncü has suffered his own crisis - possibly because a football defence solely operates effectively as a unit, with the injuries to Evans constantly disrupting the solidity and stability of the unit. I've banged on about this issue for three seasons - a defence cobbled together and thus bereft of the ability to defend effectively against deadball situations. Söyüncü isn't the only player who's lost confidence in himself as a result of the failure to supplement, train and regroup players. Wilf has slid down the effectiveness ratings too. Dan Amartey has come in for constant slating - chiefly because he's been the constant presence and thus the obvious suspect when things go wrong. When a player goes off-form there's several reasons why - personal stuff, maybe inter-team animosities, or ineffective leadership off-field. We get a fresh coach and a decent defender in and the slide stops. Maybe Cags is now just too disaffected to recover...for us probably. But if he goes to, say Atleti, and Simeone, who is Coach Defence, and starts to integrate into that defence, then we'll know why - failure of coaching and management. Edited 25 December 2022 by gerblod Predictive bloody word infilling. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 25 December 2022 Share Posted 25 December 2022 Looking at the stats Rodgers has picked Soyuncu 93% his been fit and available up to the Spurs game, so Rodgers has always rated him ability wise, but there has been a break down in there relationship. I'd argue that because Soyuncu performance level have dropped the near his got to the end of his contract. I think Soyuncu career plan has always been to move on, there has never been any talk of a new contract Playing for Atleti is a CBs dream you get so much protection. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silebyfox_89 Posted 25 December 2022 Share Posted 25 December 2022 Fab thinks Villa & Roma were in for him too... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sly Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 Roma And Madrid could speak to him “officially” about a free summer transfer and sign a pre contract. Villa would need to buy him. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taupe Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 My guess is that he wouldn't be interested in Villa, or probably anywhere in the UK, if there's even a sniff of an offer from abroad come summer. I reckon he'll want distance and a fresh start somewhere, if not a return to Turkey. I honestly believe he's given up on us and will want to close the book with no future reminders. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UHDrive Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 Get the contract signed. Drop Amartey. Play Soyuncu for remainder of season. May as well make our money stretch. If Rodgers can drop his ego. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersfox Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 1 hour ago, UHDrive said: Get the contract signed. Drop Amartey. Play Soyuncu for remainder of season. May as well make our money stretch. If Rodgers can drop his ego. He was absolutely horrible for us for some time before being dropped. Amartey isn't the answer but I don't think Soyuncu is either. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UHDrive Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 Just now, Bordersfox said: He was absolutely horrible for us for some time before being dropped. Amartey isn't the answer but I don't think Soyuncu is either. BR has had a hat full of chances to play Soyuncu for the past 2 seasons and completely overlooked him. Highly doubt it's his form otherwise Madrid wouldn't be wanting him for this long. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bordersfox Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 1 minute ago, UHDrive said: BR has had a hat full of chances to play Soyuncu for the past 2 seasons and completely overlooked him. Highly doubt it's his form otherwise Madrid wouldn't be wanting him for this long. I'm no Rodgers fan but I wouldn't have played Soyuncu either. He was making mistakes, serious ones, every game and the entire team were nervous when he was on the ball. Perhaps another coach can get the best out of the lad but let's not pretend he wasn't pony and trap when he got dropped. He was a bomb threat. I do take your point about the fact he's never really been given another chance, which is a Rodgers classic, but I remain unconvinced by him as a player. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TommyK Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 Evans and Cags together were great for a time. But as soon as Evans wasn't there Cags form dropped off. I think he needed to be organized. I think it's clear it's a combination of Cags making some mistakes last season and not training hard enough this one as he knows he's off. Shame really. I think hes a good player. But his time here has came to an end. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 26 December 2022 Share Posted 26 December 2022 1 hour ago, UHDrive said: BR has had a hat full of chances to play Soyuncu for the past 2 seasons and completely overlooked him. Highly doubt it's his form otherwise Madrid wouldn't be wanting him for this long. You do realise up until the Spur away game last season away BR has picked Soyuncu for around 95% of the game he was available for? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UHDrive Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 13 hours ago, coolhandfox said: You do realise up until the Spur away game last season away BR has picked Soyuncu for around 95% of the game he was available for? Does that include for when he's been on the bench ready and available and even after that when we've had injuries during games? I think we all know BR has had an issue for him for a while and it isn't about his quality... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 18 minutes ago, UHDrive said: Does that include for when he's been on the bench ready and available and even after that when we've had injuries during games? I think we all know BR has had an issue for him for a while and it isn't about his quality... Yes, up until Spurs away last season form the start of the 19/20 season he's only not been selected around 7 games when fit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adejo92 Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 (edited) There are a lot of strengths to his game but always seems hindered by his clumsiness. An all round good defender shouldn't have to reply upon being paired with a more competent player. Cags is 26 now, he's not a 'youngster' and a lot of his issues might be too far ingrained. One of those, i think he's too good for the bench, but perhaps not good enough for our back line. The Armatey V Cags saga stretches far beyond playing ability, we are certain on that. Choosing between the two of them is a bit like choosing if you'd rather be eaten by a crocodile or a shark. Edited 27 December 2022 by adejo92 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 I think people forget he wants out. Not once have we heard anything about a new contract which say the club know he's not interested. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahnsouff Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 5 hours ago, UHDrive said: Does that include for when he's been on the bench ready and available and even after that when we've had injuries during games? I think we all know BR has had an issue for him for a while and it isn't about his quality... Based on what exactly? Come on, he has regressed terribly and it happens unfortunately. Maybe it is because of manager treatment, but we would never get to know if this was the case or not. As pointed out, he is 26, he is too old to need his hand being held. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UHDrive Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 2 hours ago, Dahnsouff said: Based on what exactly? Come on, he has regressed terribly and it happens unfortunately. Maybe it is because of manager treatment, but we would never get to know if this was the case or not. As pointed out, he is 26, he is too old to need his hand being held. The question is, that after his wonder season he had a wobble after being initilally benched (like others in defence), and ever since (and in part as well) he's has been dispatched to train with the development team. It's unthinkable to me that this is about hand holding, but imo more about the mangers attitude towards the player during that period and the circumstances as to why he has effectively low balled the player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahnsouff Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 5 minutes ago, UHDrive said: The question is, that after his wonder season he had a wobble after being initilally benched (like others in defence), and ever since (and in part as well) he's has been dispatched to train with the development team. It's unthinkable to me that this is about hand holding, but imo more about the mangers attitude towards the player during that period and the circumstances as to why he has effectively low balled the player. Not sure what gone on with Caglar, but he has disappeared from view domestically and performance wise, internationally. You can blame it on Brendan as it is of course feasible that his management has had some extremely negative impact on the lad, but I cannot believe he does back himself enough to show more at an international level. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UHDrive Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 14 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said: Not sure what gone on with Caglar, but he has disappeared from view domestically and performance wise, internationally. You can blame it on Brendan as it is of course feasible that his management has had some extremely negative impact on the lad, but I cannot believe he does back himself enough to show more at an international level. I totally agree with that especially at the end 👍 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevosevic Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 4 hours ago, coolhandfox said: I think people forget he wants out. Not once have we heard anything about a new contract which say the club know he's not interested. So does Tielemans Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoboFox Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 CBA to read the thread, but assuming he goes to Atletico it would be on a Bosman and we wouldn’t be due any compensation whatsoever? It’s an absolute fvcking shambles that a valuable asset like that is being allowed to walk away from the club. Losing both Tielemans and Soy on a free is astonishing mismanagement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hackneyfox Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 46 minutes ago, RoboFox said: CBA to read the thread, but assuming he goes to Atletico it would be on a Bosman and we wouldn’t be due any compensation whatsoever? It’s an absolute fvcking shambles that a valuable asset like that is being allowed to walk away from the club. Losing both Tielemans and Soy on a free is astonishing mismanagement. How do you force players to sign contracts when they don’t want to stay? Do you have a couple of spare horse heads lying around? 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dahnsouff Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 1 hour ago, RoboFox said: CBA to read the thread, but assuming he goes to Atletico it would be on a Bosman and we wouldn’t be due any compensation whatsoever? It’s an absolute fvcking shambles that a valuable asset like that is being allowed to walk away from the club. Losing both Tielemans and Soy on a free is astonishing mismanagement. The increase in player power renders this argument empty I am afraid 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coolhandfox Posted 27 December 2022 Share Posted 27 December 2022 1 hour ago, Stevosevic said: So does Tielemans Very true, I can only assume their is a difference in how they are behind the scenes. Even in a normal work place you can have two people hand in their notice and behave differently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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