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Lionator

The I cant believe it’s not politics thread.

By Lionator, in General Chat

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ealingfox

ealingfox

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20 minutes ago, Fazzer 7 said:

So now the IMF are threatening Truss and her government over tax cuts. Just like the EU commissioner has threatened the new Italian PM. It’s all orchestrated, anyone would think they want a one world government. Keep in line now. 

 

Yes it's all one big conspiracy against the Conservative Party and its supporters isn't it mate?

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Houdini Logic

Houdini Logic

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2 hours ago, Livid said:

1 in 4 still willing to vote for them. Wow!! 
 

We need to stop this change of PM change of policy, mid parliament. Yes they were elected into government in 2019 but they need to be bound to the manifesto at the time of the election. 
 

No one, 80000 deluded Conservative Party members exempt, voted for this madness. 

I don't think it is the change mid parliament that's the problem - I think it's more the fact that the outgoing PM was a crook and their replacement is absolutely clueless and a PR nightmare

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gerblod

gerblod

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3 hours ago, Dahnsouff said:

How do I know if you are voting for the Greens on local or national issues then? There is a disconnect I do agree, but I am not sure this approach changes it in a meaningful way.

How do you know! That's an awkwardly phrased question at best...with no qualification as to why I (or any other voter) would choose to vote for different parties at those two levels.

But, were there issues at local level about which one party's policies differed favourably from the party I'd voted for at national level, then that is my inviolable choice to vote where I wish. 

Thankfully I live in a state where the parties are obliged to convince me their manifesto reflects my stance on important (for me) issues. 

 

PR solves the problem of the need for tactical voting and having to accept manifesto pledges I don't agree with.

With a truly representative Parliament decisions are made after proper debate, rather than the rather milk water rubber stamping that goes on now. Of course, it doesn't stop alliances being formed, but no system is going to be perfect.

The Electoral Reform Society has a lot of info. on the subject.

 

 

 

 

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BrokenRecord

BrokenRecord

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6 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

Yes it's all one big conspiracy against the Conservative Party and its supporters isn't it mate?

I love watching this going from the upset that there was nothing in the budget to benefit him to now deciding that everything bad that's happened is a grand concpiracy and not just Tory incompetence. 

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urban.spaceman

urban.spaceman

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1 hour ago, Fazzer 7 said:

Go over to Calais get in a dingy and set off, BF will meet and greet you, put you in a hotel a nice warm room all paid for, give you 3 meals a day, clothing health and dental care, a phone and £39 a week spending money. Cost of living problem solved.

You make being an asylum seeker sound preferable to being an actual citizen. Maybe this was the Conservative’s idea all along? Degrade living conditions here to put people off wanting to come?

 

On that note does anyone know how I can get myself deported?

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StanSP

StanSP

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You'd think those real staunch Tory voters would look closer to home as to why there are so many issues with current life. As if they've not been in power for the last 12 years to make some kind of improvement to society or life. 

 

But nope, it's always everyone else's fault... 

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ealingfox

ealingfox

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3 minutes ago, Fazzer 7 said:

No, anyone who stray’s from the globalist agenda it would seem. 

 

Well it's much easier for them now Bill Gates has microchipped everyone with his covid vaccines and 5G masts right?

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Dahnsouff

Dahnsouff

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13 minutes ago, StanSP said:

You'd think those real staunch Tory voters would look closer to home as to why there are so many issues with current life. As if they've not been in power for the last 12 years to make some kind of improvement to society or life. 

 

But nope, it's always everyone else's fault... 

Thats a poor post in my opinion - did you as a Labour voter start the Iraq war, or cause every negative that occurred under Labour stewardship?

 

As a one time Tory voter (Not any more I confess) I contribute to improve things for myself, others and the environment, to label everyone as ignorant of the state of the country and be unable to take action against without being drip fed the how by the Government is just lazy and points to a societal problem regardless of party preference.

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Daggers

Daggers

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28 minutes ago, StanSP said:

You'd think those real staunch Tory voters would look closer to home as to why there are so many issues with current life. As if they've not been in power for the last 12 years to make some kind of improvement to society or life. 

 

But nope, it's always everyone else's fault... 

 

4C2F2639-0974-43EF-8C90-443B10D4DF82.jpeg

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StanSP

StanSP

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7 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Thats a poor post in my opinion - did you as a Labour voter start the Iraq war, or cause every negative that occurred under Labour stewardship?

 

As a one time Tory voter (Not any more I confess) I contribute to improve things for myself, others and the environment, to label everyone as ignorant of the state of the country and be unable to take action against without being drip fed the how by the Government is just lazy and points to a societal problem regardless of party preference.

'staunch' perhaps wasn't strong enough a word then. It wasn't directed to all Tory voters. More those that are just straight-up and non-negotiable as a Tory. 

 

I didn't label everyone as ignorant of the state of the country. Basically there's one particular voter/member here it was posted towards lol

 

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foxes1988

foxes1988

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21 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Thats a poor post in my opinion - did you as a Labour voter start the Iraq war, or cause every negative that occurred under Labour stewardship?

 

As a one time Tory voter (Not any more I confess) I contribute to improve things for myself, others and the environment, to label everyone as ignorant of the state of the country and be unable to take action against without being drip fed the how by the Government is just lazy and points to a societal problem regardless of party preference.

Thats not what he is saying though is it?   The point is tory voters are not blaming the Conservative party for the current mess in the economy not that Tory voters caused it.  I'm sure the vast majority of Labour voters blame the Labour party for the Iraq war.

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gerblod

gerblod

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1 hour ago, Greg2607 said:

I was born in bosworth 40 years ago.  It's always been a Tory seat for as long as I've been alive.  

 

Now I live in Ashby where the Tory MP is guilty of perjury.  I guess NW Leics will remain blue as well given the size of his majority. 

 

Which is mental when you think that it's main town is coalville, which is the very definition of working class. 

I think this is all about aspiration and social position. Why comparatively poor rural voters would vote Tory defies logic. Many younger inhabitants have been pushed into the towns as numbers of the well-off middle-class have 'out-bought' them for properties in villages. But the older 'poor' still have a feudal way of respecting Conservatism.

Coalville, as a working-class entity was pretty much destroyed when Thatcher forced the pits to close, yet the local miners disaffiliated themselves from the NUM. 

I suspect that many have become resistant to promises delivered by politicians. Corbyn wasn't so far off - in hindsight. But the perception of him was as a far left loony and it was easy to pick him off. Now Starmer is talking about renationalisation of energy and it's a popular move!

The Tory Party is in tatters and, almost by default, Labour should get in next time. But they have a huge task ahead of them in even beginning to turn things round.

I think the main problem is that people view politics as not actually involving them. That's a mistake. Some rosette wearing candidate comes around every five years and says vote for me, I'll look after you - don't concern yourself. Then he or she becomes a nodding dog in Parliament. That's just not good enough. 

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Dahnsouff

Dahnsouff

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2 minutes ago, foxes1988 said:

Thats not what he is saying though is it?   The point is tory voters are not blaming the Conservative party for the current mess in the economy not that Tory voters caused it.  I'm sure the vast majority of Labour voters blame the Labour party for the Iraq war.

Why don`t you think the vast majority of Tory voters do not blame the Government for this current mess?

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BenTheFox

BenTheFox

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9 minutes ago, foxes1988 said:

Thats not what he is saying though is it?   The point is tory voters are not blaming the Conservative party for the current mess in the economy not that Tory voters caused it.  I'm sure the vast majority of Labour voters blame the Labour party for the Iraq war.

I also find it funny when traditional tory voters use the Iraq war as a stick to beat Labour with. They are living in a cartoon world if they think that a Tory government wouldn't have taken us to war at the time.

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foxes1988

foxes1988

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Posted (edited)
21 minutes ago, Dahnsouff said:

Why don`t you think the vast majority of Tory voters do not blame the Government for this current mess?

Not through any sophisticated study to be fair so they may will do. 

 

I just hear an awful lot of the but covid/ ukraine war/woke left excuses/conspiracies which leaves me with that impression.

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Daggers

Daggers

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"Sky News understands he will ask financiers not to bet against the pound, which has fallen to record lows against the dollar in recent days."

 

Kwarteng: "Can you not bet against Sterling, please?"

 

Bankers: "No."

 

Kwarteng: "Oh, OK then."

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