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Mark

Group B: England, Iran, USA, Wales

By Mark, in General Football and Sport

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Freeman's Wharfer

Freeman's Wharfer

Posted
Posted (edited)

Think Southgate had done the maths, hadn’t he? Playing not to lose.

 

I think now Wales would have to beat us by 3 goals to finish higher than us and he’s backing that the US will likely not take a pasting by Iran.

 

He’s being pragmatic Gareth: just get through the group.

Edited by Freeman's Wharfer
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tom27111

tom27111

Posted
Posted
Just now, Miquel The Work Geordie said:

 

Southgate has always done better than the quarters? And we've had more memorable results doing so?

 

Again I don't think he's very good but our national side was on its knees when he took over. He's bottled some huge games but at least we've been there to bottle them which wasn't the case for about 20 years beforehand

 

I'm not picking an argument with you.

 

You're right about when he came in, but we should have got someone better after 2018.

 

We did get lucky with the draw and lost against a team there for the taking.

 

My point is we have some outstanding attacking talent. A team that is probably better than the so called Golden Generation. (Although I'd love Ferdinand/Campbell/Terry in the defence)

 

We need a manager to play to our strengths, not be boring and safe.

 

It's dull, frustrating and the wrong way to utilise our strengths. 

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trabuch

trabuch

Posted
Posted
12 minutes ago, Miquel The Work Geordie said:

 

Pining for a manager who never got past the quarters when the current one has reached a semi and a final is just...

It's incomparable. Losing to Croatia in a semi final is the stuff of dreams now. We were getting knocked out by very good sides in those days. Unluckily.

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trabuch

trabuch

Posted
Posted
7 minutes ago, Freeman's Wharfer said:

Think Southgate had done the maths, hadn’t he? Playing not to lose.

 

I think now Wales would have to beat us by 3 goals to finish higher than us and he’s backing that the US will likely not take a pasting by Iran.

 

He’s being pragmatic Gareth: just get through the group.

I suspect I am less committed to a progress at all costs philosophy for England than many. If it was Leicester I might see the point of it, but I don't think I am as bothered about England. I think I'm more of a mind to want the best and most entertaining football team to win the world cup. I feel like it is a sport I love being watched by 100s of millions of people - and I want it to look good. 

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MattFox

MattFox

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, tom27111 said:

 

I'm not picking an argument with you.

 

You're right about when he came in, but we should have got someone better after 2018.

 

We did get lucky with the draw and lost against a team there for the taking.

 

My point is we have some outstanding attacking talent. A team that is probably better than the so called Golden Generation. (Although I'd love Ferdinand/Campbell/Terry in the defence)

 

We need a manager to play to our strengths, not be boring and safe.

 

It's dull, frustrating and the wrong way to utilise our strengths. 


Nobody was sacking Southgate after 2018 though.

 

That Croatia side had more experience and was arguably stronger in key positions.

 

Euro 2020 is on him though we sat back and let an average Italy side dominate us, if Chiesa didn’t go off we’d have lost in normal time

 

 

 

 

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Super_horns

Super_horns

Posted
Posted
39 minutes ago, Miquel The Work Geordie said:

 

I'm absolutely not defending tonight by the way but I can't buy into the notion we were some sort of irresistible and exciting force in Euro 96. 

In 3 of the games we were probably lucky to win/draw.

 

The 2 hardest games we played our best football v Netherlands and Germany .

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tom27111

tom27111

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, MattFox said:


Nobody was sacking Southgate after 2018 though.

 

That Croatia side had more experience and was arguably stronger in key positions.

 

Euro 2020 is on him though we sat back and let an average Italy side dominate us, if Chiesa didn’t go off we’d have lost in normal time

 

 

 

 

Much like when we qualified for the Champs League and had the chance to kick on, we invested very badly.

 

The FA dished out a contract to Southgate that he never should have got.

 

He's a yes man though.

 

Summed up by his refusal of giving Madders a run out before this tournament. 

 

The FA love a yes man.

 

We need a fvcking maverick.

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Guest StevieLynex

Guest StevieLynex

Posted
Posted
36 minutes ago, martyn said:

Tell you who gets away scot free when players are getting criticised after poor displays, Declan Rice 

 

Games like tonight you need your deep lying midfielder to show for the ball or have your teammates be comfortable giving you the ball under a bit of pressure. I don't think he received the ball once from the centre halves all night.

 

He is a player rayed far higher than he should be due to the dearth of quality options in his position.

 

Really lethargic display overall, and it was telling how pleased Southgate appeared with that 0-0. He won't release the handbrake and will waste a very talented group of front players due to that, and his lack of ability to affect positive changes in game.

He’s a central defender playing in midfield. Vastly overrated 

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tom27111

tom27111

Posted
Posted
38 minutes ago, martyn said:

Tell you who gets away scot free when players are getting criticised after poor displays, Declan Rice 

 

Games like tonight you need your deep lying midfielder to show for the ball or have your teammates be comfortable giving you the ball under a bit of pressure. I don't think he received the ball once from the centre halves all night.

 

He is a player rayed far higher than he should be due to the dearth of quality options in his position.

 

Really lethargic display overall, and it was telling how pleased Southgate appeared with that 0-0. He won't release the handbrake and will waste a very talented group of front players due to that, and his lack of ability to affect positive changes in game.

 

I've never got the fuss about Rice to be honest.

 

There's probably 10 better holding midfielders in the league, but they aren't English.

 

He doesn't seem to do much. He isn't a feared ball winner, or someone that makes loads of interceptions.

 

Then he doesn't get forward as a box to box player to add any threat.

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Guest Col city fan

Guest Col city fan

Posted
Posted

How I see tonight’s performance is like this:

It was a very pragmatic display, quite simply because Southgate is exactly that… a pragmatist. That’s his personality type. I guess his whole life has been thought out, according to some blueprint, based on sensibility, timing, setting a good foundation, being pleasant, not controversial etc.

That’s why he got the England job.

Like a game of chess, he’ll be planning his next moves already. He’s that kind of guy.

And that’s ok if you adhere to that. If you agree that playing it safe against the USA was the right thing to do, so that we qualify without much of a fuss, then you’ll be at ease with tonight. Mission accomplished, bar the shouting.

But if, like me, you’ve been looking forward all day to seeing what this team can really offer and putting the USA to the sword, thus qualifying already and looking forward to more of the same, then you’ll be disappointed at watching a very dour game of football, possibly the most dull game so far and actually wondering if we could LOSE it.
This forum will contain both types of people. Those that concur with the notion that Gareth has achieved ‘the most with England since Alf Ramsay’ and those, like me, who think we could actually win the bloody thing if he just took the shackles off and let these very talented players just play.

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tom27111

tom27111

Posted
Posted
1 minute ago, Col city fan said:

How I see tonight’s performance is like this:

It was a very pragmatic display, quite simply because Southgate is exactly that… a pragmatist. That’s his personality type. I guess his whole life has been thought out, according to some blueprint, based on sensibility, timing, setting a good foundation, being pleasant, not controversial etc.

That’s why he got the England job.

Like a game of chess, he’ll be planning his next moves already. He’s that kind of guy.

And that’s ok if you adhere to that. If you agree that playing it safe against the USA was the right thing to do, so that we qualify without much of a fuss, then you’ll be at ease with tonight. Mission accomplished, bar the shouting.

But if, like me, you’ve been looking forward all day to seeing what this team can really offer and putting the USA to the sword, thus qualifying already and looking forward to more of the same, then you’ll be disappointed at watching a very dour game of football, possibly the most dull game so far and actually wondering if we could LOSE it.
This forum will contain both types of people. Those that concur with the notion that Gareth has achieved ‘the most with England since Alf Ramsay’ and those, like me, who think we could actually win the bloody thing if he just took the shackles off and let these very talented players just play.

Well put.

 

We don't have the right to put any teams to the sword, even if they're supposedly inferior, but he should have played to the strengths of the squad and put qualifying to bed tonight.

 

Rest the players against Wales and give others a chance to stake their claim.

 

Easy as that.

 

 

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Guest ttfn

Guest ttfn

Posted
Posted

Absolutely ridiculous that we’re not using Foden. He walks into every other team in this tournament, he’s our most talented player and we’re not using him so we can indulge Southgate’s control fantasy.

 

Better right winger than Saka, better left winger than Sterling, better 8 than Mount. Absolutely scandalous he’s getting so little football.

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Deeg67

Deeg67

Posted
Posted (edited)

That was a really strong performance by the USA, who showed that the progress is real.  Incredibly young team on the rise, and with a better manager and international experience they can be a dark horse in 2026.  

 

That said, Wales' choke against Iran effectively made that a useless point.  Even with a loss we were still fine if we beat Iran and screwed if we don't.  And if they play the way they did against Wales beating them won't be easy.  Nevertheless, even against an unambitious English side clearly playing it safe, that was a performance by the US that will open some eyes.  After the first 15 minutes they were the better side.  And England has still never beaten the American in the World Cup...

Edited by Deeg67
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