Is anyone genuinely going to boycott?

[CosbehFox]

The more I’ve read, learnt and listened (including a history of Qatar podcast), I think my objection to Qatar largely stems it from it being a nation which only 20% of its population are considered citizens. It’s society has layers which Western foreigners are largely immune from. 
 

The society is oppressive in its organisation. In that process you have these issues which have been well spoken about. The workers issue is underpinned that it’s a country which literally has slaves.
 

The women rights are non existent as well but that’s barely been covered in comparison to others. 
 

Freedom of speech only applies to certain people. 

[CosbehFox]

By the way I’m firmly boycotting LCFC’s World Cup Fanzone 

[Mickyblueeyes]

2 hours ago, CosbehFox said:

The more I’ve read, learnt and listened (including a history of Qatar podcast), I think my objection to Qatar largely stems it from it being a nation which only 20% of its population are considered citizens. It’s society has layers which Western foreigners are largely immune from. 
 

The society is oppressive in its organisation. In that process you have these issues which have been well spoken about. The workers issue is underpinned that it’s a country which literally has slaves.
 

The women rights are non existent as well but that’s barely been covered in comparison to others. 
 

Freedom of speech only applies to certain people. 

I always find this interesting. Like you say, the actual citizens are limited to the natives. Similar to the UAE, Saudi. And those citizens benefit from incredible benefits (on marriage a UAE citizen gets a fixed income, a house, a pension basically never has to work again). They generally get proper free health care (no tax!) and very little in terms of poverty as we see here.

 

The expats though, don’t usually get that. Yet so many from all over the world repeatedly choose to go there (for various reasons) and stay there. The UAE has turned many into multi millionaires. Speak to them, the majority love it. I’ve been in dubai and had guys who were working on the construction  now running a little (very busy) cafe - no plan to return to native India. 
 

Ok, their benefits system, care system, lifestyle puts ours to shame but it has made me wonder why so many come and many stay - it can’t all be about the passport. I’ve never been to Qatar but plan to one day. I’ve been to UAE, Saudi and Oman and it is a fantastic visit each time. 

[leicsmac]

Certainly been an interesting (and mostly civil) discussion that happened while I was asleep. Was good to read.

 

My own viewpoint remains the same, and one of the key reasons behind the circumstances of why someone might boycott this World Cup: organised religion should be a personal matter only and has absolutely no business in the running of a state in the year 2022.

[Jon the Hat]

12 hours ago, K1FOX said:

Am I bothered by ‘LGBTQ’ being thrown in peoples faces? Yes 100%. Don’t go to where it’s not accepted if you don’t like the laws. In the same way am I unhappy with the way it’s being taught and thrown at kids in this country? Yes, but there’s nothing I can do about that because that’s this countries laws.

I think if you accept that you can't teach kids to be gay by talking about it in school you will worry about that a lot less.

[Daggers]

Common Sense 1 - 0 Bigots

 

 

[K1FOX]

Not going to go back into yesterdays discussion. Very interesting nevertheless.

 

Heres another interesting video regarding migrant workers living conditions. Obviously not the full picture but someone on the floor whose done his own research rather

 

.https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMF9sPJ4L/

[Mark_w]

2 hours ago, Daggers said:

Common Sense 1 - 0 Bigots

 

 

I think we’re at about Common Sense 1-3,781 Bigots.

[Daggers]

2 minutes ago, Mark_w said:

I think we’re at about Common Sense 1-3,781 Bigots.

3,781 were disallowed for being well offside.

[shade]

17 hours ago, leicsmac said:

Certainly been an interesting (and mostly civil) discussion that happened while I was asleep. Was good to read.

 

My own viewpoint remains the same, and one of the key reasons behind the circumstances of why someone might boycott this World Cup: organised religion should be a personal matter only and has absolutely no business in the running of a state in the year 2022.

sexuality should be a personal matter only and have absolutely no business being pushed by corporations, establishments or authorities, even if in the name of virtue.

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

9 minutes ago, shade said:

sexuality should be a personal matter only and have absolutely no business being pushed by corporations, establishments or authorities, even if in the name of virtue.

sexuality should be a personal matter only and have absolutely no business being outlawed by governments, even if in the name of religion.

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, shade said:

sexuality should be a personal matter only and have absolutely no business being pushed by corporations, establishments or authorities, even if in the name of virtue.

In an ideal world, it would be. However...

 

56 minutes ago, Manley Farrington-Brown said:

sexuality should be a personal matter only and have absolutely no business being outlawed by governments, even if in the name of religion.

....because of this, it has to be.

 

Ideally, neither religion nor sexuality would have any business in state policymaking whatsoever beyond the former not being used to craft laws but being open to belief and the latter being between consenting adults.

Edited 25 November 2022 by leicsmac

[shade]

11 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

In an ideal world, it would be. However...

 

....because of this, it has to be.

 

Ideally, neither religion nor sexuality would have any business in state policymaking whatsoever beyond the former not being used to craft laws but being open to belief and the latter being between consenting adults.

I don't know, homosexuality is far from being outlawed in the UK, but we still see pride MONTH, major corporations changing their logo to the rainbow, police vans repainted with rainbows, sports stars wearing armbands, coloured corner flags, adverts, billboards, talking heads. You need to consider, when literally everyone is pushing your agenda, are you really the persecuted minority?

[leicsmac]

1 minute ago, shade said:

I don't know, homosexuality is far from being outlawed in the UK, but we still see pride MONTH, major corporations changing their logo to the rainbow, police vans repainted with rainbows, sports stars wearing armbands, coloured corner flags, adverts, billboards, talking heads. You need to consider, when literally everyone is pushing your agenda, are you really the persecuted minority?

When 71 countries still criminalise LGBT relationships. and 11 of them carry a potential death penalty for it, and that's just the criminally institutionalised discrimination, there's also the everyday civil discrimination where LGBT folks have trouble obtaining healthcare, housing and work without being discriminated against that is much more prevalent in many more places...then yes, persecution of minorities is still happening and still needs addressing.

 

This is not just a UK issue, and perhaps those corps and other luminaries look further than just the walled borders of the little island.

[Manley Farrington-Brown]

1 hour ago, shade said:

I don't know, homosexuality is far from being outlawed in the UK, but we still see pride MONTH, major corporations changing their logo to the rainbow, police vans repainted with rainbows, sports stars wearing armbands, coloured corner flags, adverts, billboards, talking heads. You need to consider, when literally everyone is pushing your agenda, are you really the persecuted minority?

No need to capitalise the word month, unless you want to look like an intolerant homophobe, which of course I'm sure you don't and am precisely the same amount of sure you aren't.

The 'pushing the agenda' (obnoxious term btw) - aka a few gestures to encourage a bit more tolerance - happens precisely because of the persecution. And if 'literally everyone' is indeed doing this 'agenda pushing' maybe you 'need to consider' why you're literally the only person in the country who has a problem with it.

 

I'm out, we're done, goodbye.

[Raj]

I think now the tounament has started the emphasis is more on the footy and most people dont really bother about the other stuff.

Nothing done now is going to change anything.

People have had 20 odd years since Qatar  was announced as bribing their way to this!

[kingkisnorbo]

15 hours ago, K1FOX said:

Not going to go back into yesterdays discussion. Very interesting nevertheless.

 

Heres another interesting video regarding migrant workers living conditions. Obviously not the full picture but someone on the floor whose done his own research rather

 

.https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMF9sPJ4L/

That settles it then! Every piece of tenuous, radical left leaning libtard journalism must be making things up. 

[tom27111]

I just don't get it.

 

Whatever you think of Qatar is one thing, the issue lies with FIFA who have awarded the last two World Cups to Russia and Qatar. 

 

The solution is pretty simple.

 

You boycott any company that has a sponsorship agreement with FIFA.

 

Do that and the companies paying them combined billions of dollars, will stop.

 

Refuse to buy Adidas, don't go to McDonalds, don't drink Coca-Cola or Budweiser (who would anyway?)...the list goes on.

 

Any company that has an advertising hoarding at the World Cup, add it to the list that you won't use.

 

It's amazing that people haven't started campaigns on this, especially given the power of social media.

 

Literally cut off all money supply to FIFA.

 

That's all that matters.

Edited 25 November 2022 by tom27111

[Daggers]

I’d just like to say well done to Southgate and England for apparently joining me tonight in my boycott of the World Cup and refusing to play against the USA. Brilliant news. 

[K1FOX]

26 minutes ago, kingkisnorbo said:

That settles it then! Every piece of tenuous, radical left leaning libtard journalism must be making things up. 

Clearly said it’s obviously not the full picture. But it’s a different point of view. Or are we only going with one point of view on these matters?

[K1FOX]

4 hours ago, shade said:

I don't know, homosexuality is far from being outlawed in the UK, but we still see pride MONTH, major corporations changing their logo to the rainbow, police vans repainted with rainbows, sports stars wearing armbands, coloured corner flags, adverts, billboards, talking heads. You need to consider, when literally everyone is pushing your agenda, are you really the persecuted minority?

You make a very good point. This country is one of the most tolerant on the matter with its laws and inclusivity. So what’s the need for pushing it so much? It’s almost got to a stage where if you don’t actively show that you support LGBTQ you are doing something wrong. 

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, K1FOX said:

You make a very good point. This country is one of the most tolerant on the matter with its laws and inclusivity. So what’s the need for pushing it so much? It’s almost got to a stage where if you don’t actively show that you support LGBTQ you are doing something wrong. 

Because, in case you missed the reply, there is more to this earth and the species than one small island, no matter how supposedly enlightened the island (which isn't at the top by comparison to other places in this matter btw)...so perhaps it's not a bad idea to look further than it.

[K1FOX]

18 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

Because, in case you missed the reply, there is more to this earth and the species than one small island, no matter how supposedly enlightened the island (which isn't at the top by comparison to other places in this matter btw)...so perhaps it's not a bad idea to look further than it.

But why’s it the people in this countries right to tell other countries how they should act? 
 

Let’s take Qatar as an example - People of Qatar are at peace with their religion and the laws of their religion and the laws of their country - nothing anyone from Qatar has said would dispute this fact as far as I’m aware. So why are the LGBTQ community (I include the footballers and football teams participating in this) taking the rainbow demonstrations to their country? Now you may say they’re hosting the World Cup? Well in that case boycott and demonstrate against FIFA for giving them the World Cup, don’t attack Qataris for sticking by their laws and their religion and having the backbone to do this. Lighting up Wembley arch and tweeting about it today serves what purpose?

Edited 26 November 2022 by K1FOX

[leicsmac]

4 minutes ago, K1FOX said:

But why’s it the people in this countries right to tell other countries how they should act? 

... well, according to the rules of national identity, beyond some fundamental issues (and folks like the Chinese play fast and loose with even those), it isn't. International responses tend to have far more bark than bite.

 

However, and I'm just theorising here, when one sees a group of people being both institutionally and otherwise oppressed in a variety of places despite having done nothing to actually harm anyone else with consenting and adult decisions, one is inclined to want to help them.

 

Of course, evidently that doesn't apply to everyone and some folks evidently think that the right of some people to exert power and control and fear over other people (through centuries old religious dogma being applied as state policy) outweighs equal rights as a whole. Not exactly my ethical cup of tea, but hey ho, the world would be a funny place if everyone thought alike, wouldn't it?

[K1FOX]

8 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

... well, according to the rules of national identity, beyond some fundamental issues (and folks like the Chinese play fast and loose with even those), it isn't. International responses tend to have far more bark than bite.

 

However, and I'm just theorising here, when one sees a group of people being both institutionally and otherwise oppressed in a variety of places despite having done nothing to actually harm anyone else with consenting and adult decisions, one is inclined to want to help them.

 

Of course, evidently that doesn't apply to everyone and some folks evidently think that the right of some people to exert power and control and fear over other people (through centuries old religious dogma being applied as state policy) outweighs equal rights as a whole. Not exactly my ethical cup of tea, but hey ho, the world would be a funny place if everyone thought alike, wouldn't it?

So in essence what we’re saying is we celebrate and promote the LGBTQ cause so much in this country to stand up for people in other countries even though the people in said countries are more than happy with how they are living? Again who are we as a country, or as members of the gay community to decide that someone’s religious views or laws are wrong when it doesn’t affect us?

Edited 26 November 2022 by K1FOX