Also in the News - Part 2

[leicsmac]

The events going on in Georgia now with respect to NGOs, mirroring what a few other places have done, utterly baffles me.

 

It's like nationalists simply cannot comprehend the idea of a person or group of people simply wanting to make the world better (rather than just one part of it) and so everything has to be some kind of bullshit powerplay of the kind they engage in.

 

But then I guess such nationalists were never burdened with an overabundance of foresight or empathy - it's just a shame their ideas continue to be the "prevailing wisdom" in far too many places.

[marbles]

I’m confused 

3 hours ago, leicsmac said:

The events going on in Georgia now with respect to NGOs, mirroring what a few other places have done, utterly baffles me.

 

It's like nationalists simply cannot comprehend the idea of a person or group of people simply wanting to make the world better (rather than just one part of it) and so everything has to be some kind of bullshit powerplay of the kind they engage in.

 

But then I guess such nationalists were never burdened with an overabundance of foresight or empathy - it's just a shame their ideas continue to be the "prevailing wisdom" in far too many places.

I’m confused (again).

Are you advocating or overlooking the violence that has taken place?

 

Or, are we talking about 2 different things? 

Edited 8 March 2023 by marbles

[oxford blue]

Given a similar law was adopted in Russia - who still occupy two the Georgian states of South Ossetia and Abhazia - and can be used to designate any opposition to the government a 'foreign agent', I am not surprised at the opposition.

 

If you want further info:

Introduction of new law:

https://civil.ge/archives/525575

 

Currently:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-64882475

 

The election of the current Georgian Dream party in Oct 2020 was called fraudulent by all the opposition parties; and the PM resigned 5 months later to be replaced by a 'radical.. Most Georgians cherish their freedoms since the split from the Soviet Union; it is not the first time there have been demonstrations outside parliament at anything which may restrict democracy (and the current bill has been widely condemned internally and by many external organisations). 

 

[StanSP]

23 hours ago, Lionator said:

 

If you enter the UK illegally, you won't be able to be exploited in a Leicester sweat shop!! 

 

I've only just seen this.

 

Flabbergasted even they could be so stupid.

 

Not quite the 'gotcha' they intended.

[ealingfox]

 

Dear God

 

[leicsmac]

9 hours ago, marbles said:

I’m confused 

I’m confused (again).

Are you advocating or overlooking the violence that has taken place?

 

Or, are we talking about 2 different things? 

I'm talking about the law being passed itself, which is utterly needless, puerile, cynical nationalist bollocks (as nationalism so often is) and without it being forwarded there wouldn't have been any violence concerning it in the first place - again, needless.

[Jon the Hat]

5 hours ago, StanSP said:

I've only just seen this.

 

Flabbergasted even they could be so stupid.

 

Not quite the 'gotcha' they intended.

I think what they are trying to suggest is that some people are taking advantage of the systems in place to support those who are victims of modern slavery and then escape.  Terrible comms.

[Sly]

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

[leicsmac]

12 minutes ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

Like a few things, a good idea that isn't being executed well.

 

Getting people to get around in greener and more communal ways is good, but having stuff like this with no regulation happen clearly isn't.

[filthyfox]

On 27/02/2023 at 23:55, Daggers said:

I find your comment sad tbh, and I’m guessing you never went to a pantomime as a kid.

 

I’m not debating this so don’t expect further response.

Nah, i agree with Jon here.

(OH YES I DO!!)

[marbles]

2 hours ago, leicsmac said:

I'm talking about the law being passed itself, which is utterly needless, puerile, cynical nationalist bollocks (as nationalism so often is) and without it being forwarded there wouldn't have been any violence concerning it in the first place - again, needless.

Yeah, I think we may be talking about 2 different things.

Im talking about the activists attacking/firebombing the construction site, resulting in 35 people arrested and charged with domestic terrorism

[leicsmac]

5 minutes ago, marbles said:

Yeah, I think we may be talking about 2 different things.

Im talking about the activists attacking/firebombing the construction site, resulting in 35 people arrested and charged with domestic terrorism

Yeah, I'm referring to Georgia the country, not the US state.

 

Edit: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64892213

 

(Beg pardon if this crosses the "politics" line.)

Edited 9 March 2023 by leicsmac

[marbles]

1 minute ago, leicsmac said:

Yeah, I'm referring to Georgia the country, not the US state.

 

Edit: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64892213

 

(Beg pardon if this crosses the "politics" line.)

You know, I thought that may be the case - but there is a few things going on in the state - (activist, new abortion laws), so I wasn't entirely sure.

How funny would it have been if we argued, and had a back and forth for several posts before figuring it out    

[leicsmac]

5 minutes ago, marbles said:

You know, I thought that may be the case - but there is a few things going on in the state - (activist, new abortion laws), so I wasn't entirely sure.

How funny would it have been if we argued, and had a back and forth for several posts before figuring it out    

That's most of FT discourse I reckon.

 

On topic, realpolitik sucks, as it has done since the term first arose, and it will continue to do so pretty much ad infinitum.

[Jon the Hat]

3 hours ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

The law is all over the place.  On one hand the same thing could and does happen with a bicycle.  It happens more with Scooters because they are not allowed to use cycle paths or roads.  Here in WA they are now allowed on pavements (slowly) and to use cycle paths and up to 50kph roads. However if they can travel over 15kph you much be over 16 and be wearing a helmet.  Much much safer. that ignoring the reality they are here to stay and should be accomodated on the road / cycle network like a bicycle.

[nnfox]

4 hours ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

They are great if used responsibly but there are too many idiots that use them,  It doesn't help that the law isn't all that clear.  E Scooters are basically illegal unless you use one of the public hire ones that are left around town.  The problem is, as in this tragic case, lots of people don't realise this.  They see the hire ones around town, think they're cool and decide that instead of hiring them all the time, they'll buy one, but they aren't actually allowed to be used anywhere other than on private land.  you can't go on roads or pavements or anywhere else in public.

 

Lots of public education needed around safety and the law.

[grobyfox1990]

4 hours ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

Quality. In a decade or so time we will be laughed at for spending £1000s on huge lumps of metal that sit idle on a street for 99% of their existence whilst also moaning about having no money. In jersey there are more cars than people, pathetic 

 

As usual like with most things (social media, internet etc) negative humans will focus on the immediate minority negative parts (omg I saw this young hoodlum riding one on the pavement!!! They’re a shambles!!!) than all the benefits they can bring 

 

An example of negative reactionary human behaviour is Twitter. Apparently Elon musk has killed it. Despite his extensive track record of long term business success, nah mate he’s already killed it 

 

 

[filthyfox]

5 hours ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

Mechanically propelled vehicles, requiring licensing and insurance...  ex copper talking (hence the name "Filthy")

[Bellend Sebastian]

6 hours ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

It's the way that they're being used by individuals and the fact that the existing transport network doesn't accommodate them that's the issue rather than the product itself. It's not helped by the fact that, to use one in the UK you've got to be prepared to break the law, and whilst that doesn't by default make you an irresponsible willy puller, those of a less public spirited outlook do seem to be common amongst the e scooter community judging by how you see them being used (the quoted story a case in point: 20 mph in a pedestrian space is FAST).

 

If you could start again you'd probably build infrastructure with separate provision for pedestrians, single user transport (bikes, e-scooters and whatnot) with buses, cars lorries etc completely separate. Where do e scooters go in the current set up?

 

It's a far from popular opinion but I don't see what the answer is other than to reduce the share of infrastructure space for the latter category and increase provision for the middle one 

 

 

 

 

[Sampson]

7 hours ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

I do think there’s a place for them. I’ve seen them in Stockholm and Amsterdam where they are considered motorised bicycles and because there are cycle lanes on every road/pavement they have their own lane separate to cars and pedestrians and I think they work well there and they have regulated parking spots and you have to take a photo to show you’ve parked in one afterwards or get a fine.

 

They’re essentially just an easy way for people to get across the city fairly quickly there and a cleaner, way cheaper and better alternative to driving if you’re just going within the city. In the UK we don’t really have that infrastructure for them though due to the lack of cycle lanes.

Edited 9 March 2023 by Sampson

[leicsmac]

16 hours ago, oxford blue said:

Given a similar law was adopted in Russia - who still occupy two the Georgian states of South Ossetia and Abhazia - and can be used to designate any opposition to the government a 'foreign agent', I am not surprised at the opposition.

 

If you want further info:

Introduction of new law:

https://civil.ge/archives/525575

 

Currently:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-64882475

 

The election of the current Georgian Dream party in Oct 2020 was called fraudulent by all the opposition parties; and the PM resigned 5 months later to be replaced by a 'radical.. Most Georgians cherish their freedoms since the split from the Soviet Union; it is not the first time there have been demonstrations outside parliament at anything which may restrict democracy (and the current bill has been widely condemned internally and by many external organisations). 

 

Some good news on this:

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64899041

 

2 hours ago, grobyfox1990 said:

Quality. In a decade or so time we will be laughed at for spending £1000s on huge lumps of metal that sit idle on a street for 99% of their existence whilst also moaning about having no money. In jersey there are more cars than people, pathetic 

 

As usual like with most things (social media, internet etc) negative humans will focus on the immediate minority negative parts (omg I saw this young hoodlum riding one on the pavement!!! They’re a shambles!!!) than all the benefits they can bring 

 

An example of negative reactionary human behaviour is Twitter. Apparently Elon musk has killed it. Despite his extensive track record of long term business success, nah mate he’s already killed it 

 

 

As much as I would agree with you about the reactionary nature of folks, I don't think it's a reach to point out that the start of Musks ownership of Twitter hasn't really been ideal.

[ozleicester]

7 hours ago, Sly said:

https://news.sky.com/story/boy-14-on-e-scooter-who-struck-amazing-grandmother-and-caused-her-death-avoids-custody-12828981
 

What’s the conscious on E Scooters? 
 

I detest the things. We ran into me last year and totally wiped me out. Bloody kid didn’t even say sorry and just rode off. 

fantastic option for people who cant afford or dont need  a car, they are all around my small town and are terrific for cutting down emissions.

Alwyas some issues with new ideas that just need to be ironed out.

[Otis]

2 hours ago, filthyfox said:

Mechanically propelled vehicles, requiring licensing and insurance...  ex copper talking (hence the name "Filthy")

As are electric bikes/mobility scooters.

What's the difference?

[RoboFox]

Horrible story aside, in general E-scooters are absolutely fantastic. 

 

I'm a regular in Northampton and Milton Keynes in which the majority of the urban area is covered by these and use them often to get around. Many towns around the Northamptonshire / Bedfordshire have adopted the trials. 

 

In Northampton, Kettering and Wellingborough they have to be ridden either on the road or cycle paths, otherwise your account just gets revoked which IS linked to your driving license. Milton Keynes they're a little more lax simply because of MK's huge footpath network. 

 

Agree that some legislation probably needs to be clarified, and residents get fed up with them being left everywhere - but, IMO they're a great, clean, fun way to get around. 

 

Same rule applies to any vehicle, motorised or not... Just don't act like a twat and you'll be fine.

 

Edited 9 March 2023 by RoboFox

[grobyfox1990]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

Some good news on this:

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-64899041

 

As much as I would agree with you about the reactionary nature of folks, I don't think it's a reach to point out that the start of Musks ownership of Twitter hasn't really been ideal.

Totally, read a lot of comments on Twitter and they are much more reactionary than that. Twitter's dead!! Much like the comments on here when the club ban sandwiches or something equally pathetic. Club's dead mate shambles mate!!!!