Dunge Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 5 hours ago, urban.spaceman said: She could at least have just said she wrote it while drinking on the tube. “Autocorrect.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Captain... Posted 23 April 2023 Popular Post Share Posted 23 April 2023 41 minutes ago, LiberalFox said: Just seems like an overreaction. She basically said that anti-Semitism isn't racism. In a party that has an anti-Semitic reputation that it's trying to get rid of it's a pretty stupid thing to say and I applaud Starmer for dealing with it quickly and without fuss. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zear0 Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 Bit of a gift for Labour the more I think about it. She's so gaff prone and bad for the party's image they'd probably wanted shot of her for years. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post urban.spaceman Posted 23 April 2023 Popular Post Share Posted 23 April 2023 1 hour ago, LiberalFox said: Just seems like an overreaction. She equated the historical suffering of the Irish, Jewish and Traveller people to the derision gingers get for being ginger, because they are "white seeming". She also erased *millions* of white victims of slavery. Not only racist and offensive, but completely ahistorical too. She's been a liability for about a decade now and should have been stood down years ago. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiberalFox Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 Maybe she's positioning herself for a role with FIFA? 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st albans fox Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 2 hours ago, LiberalFox said: Just seems like an overreaction. Is it just ignorance? I mean she’s either deeply uneducated , very stupid or a straight bigot .She shouldn’t be anywhere near any decision making bodies in this country … Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st albans fox Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 48 minutes ago, LiberalFox said: Maybe she's positioning herself for a role with FIFA? She’d need a year at the Italian fa first ……. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LiberalFox Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 1 hour ago, st albans fox said: Is it just ignorance? I mean she’s either deeply uneducated , very stupid or a straight bigot .She shouldn’t be anywhere near any decision making bodies in this country … I'd be genuinely interested what point she was trying to make. The term 'white-seeming' is a bit weird too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 42 minutes ago, LiberalFox said: I'd be genuinely interested what point she was trying to make. The term 'white-seeming' is a bit weird too. I think she was trying to say it's different being black compared to white people who experience prejudice and basically saying black people had it worse. As it says in the BBC article it is dangerous to set a hierarchy of racism and say one race has it worse than others it almost legitimises some forms of prejudice. She is right, it is different, but she should in no way be saying it is worse and prejudice against "white seeming" people cannot be racism, particularly against those groups that were persecuted by Nazis and continue to be persecuted against today. It's just a crazy thing to say. If the white seeming comment was in relation to how black people are judged instantly by the colour of their skin in a way that prejudiced "white" races aren't she would also have a point, but she didn't make that point. She just exposed her own prejudice. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbles Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 (edited) Sounds like she did the same thing Whoopi Goldberg did, twice. Too bad the network didn’t have the nuts to fire her for it. Edited 23 April 2023 by marbles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunge Posted 23 April 2023 Share Posted 23 April 2023 3 hours ago, LiberalFox said: I'd be genuinely interested what point she was trying to make. The term 'white-seeming' is a bit weird too. There is a viewpoint I have heard presented before, that white people have a monopoly on racism - ie that black people are not and potentially cannot be racist by definition. That may also extend to all non-white people. Without wanting to specifically put words in her mouth, she was likely espousing that viewpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Doctor Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 RE: Abbot, while what she said was indefensible, the way labour have handled it doesn't make them look good. She's immediately suspended, while Steve Reed faced no action for invoking antisemitic stereotypes about a Jewish Tory donor, Rosie Duffield faced no action for liking tweets denying the Holocaust, Barry Sheerman faced no action for his run on silver shekels tweet about two Jewish people missing out on peerages. very clear that this is about who said it, not what was said and amounts to a weaponisation of the disciplinary process for factional purposes, meaning they've learnt nothing from the EHRC report 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Hankey Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 Abbott knew full well what she said and then in her mealy-mouthed apology wanted to disassociate herself from those comments is utterly laughable. She may have been in Parliament a long time, even more reason for knowing better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 2 hours ago, The Doctor said: RE: Abbot, while what she said was indefensible, the way labour have handled it doesn't make them look good. She's immediately suspended, while Steve Reed faced no action for invoking antisemitic stereotypes about a Jewish Tory donor, Rosie Duffield faced no action for liking tweets denying the Holocaust, Barry Sheerman faced no action for his run on silver shekels tweet about two Jewish people missing out on peerages. very clear that this is about who said it, not what was said and amounts to a weaponisation of the disciplinary process for factional purposes, meaning they've learnt nothing from the EHRC report I'm not aware of those other incidents nor the context behind them. I've googled the Rosie Duffield incident I can only find transphobic (sorry gender critical) views one of them relates to a post about the Holocaust but it is gender critical guff from Graham Lineman not holocaust denial. Steve Reed's tweet seems like a genuine mistake, only he will know, but puppet master is not an anti-Semitic trope I was previously aware of and could easily be used in other contexts. Obviously a Labour minister should be briefed on such things. The Barry Sheerman is pretty clearly rooted in anti Jewish sentiment and he should have faced punishment. The big difference is that Abbot's piece was a thought out opinion letter to the Observer not the same as liking a tweet or even tweeting in haste. There was no justification of what she wrote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Doctor Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 8 minutes ago, Captain... said: I'm not aware of those other incidents nor the context behind them. I've googled the Rosie Duffield incident I can only find transphobic (sorry gender critical) views one of them relates to a post about the Holocaust but it is gender critical guff from Graham Lineman not holocaust denial. Steve Reed's tweet seems like a genuine mistake, only he will know, but puppet master is not an anti-Semitic trope I was previously aware of and could easily be used in other contexts. Obviously a Labour minister should be briefed on such things. The Barry Sheerman is pretty clearly rooted in anti Jewish sentiment and he should have faced punishment. The big difference is that Abbot's piece was a thought out opinion letter to the Observer not the same as liking a tweet or even tweeting in haste. There was no justification of what she wrote. the Duffield one (Linehans tweets) is Holocaust denialism. minimizing the Holocaust by denying specific groups were targeted is denialism. Reeds tweet describing a Jewish donor as a puppet master is your bog standard NWO conspiracy shit that always ends up in antisemitism. They are comparable to Abbot in terms of using their public profile to push bigotry. Suspending Abbot is the correct action, but suspension against her, while accepting apologies from Reed and Sheerman (and ignoring Duffield entirely, as the GLU always do no matter what she says and how many complaints it triggers. she's ridiculously bulletproof, to the point that she was harassing whistleblowers from her staffers re: bullying in her office and labour ignored it) is not consistent with the punishments and is indicative of a party using antisemitism for factional purposes (see also the sheer amount of left wing Jews suspended from the membership under Starmer for antisemitism. Gentiles deciding to moderate intracommunity disputes that they're not part of is not by any measure antiracist behaviour) 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 (edited) 28 minutes ago, The Doctor said: the Duffield one (Linehans tweets) is Holocaust denialism. minimizing the Holocaust by denying specific groups were targeted is denialism. Reeds tweet describing a Jewish donor as a puppet master is your bog standard NWO conspiracy shit that always ends up in antisemitism. They are comparable to Abbot in terms of using their public profile to push bigotry. Suspending Abbot is the correct action, but suspension against her, while accepting apologies from Reed and Sheerman (and ignoring Duffield entirely, as the GLU always do no matter what she says and how many complaints it triggers. she's ridiculously bulletproof, to the point that she was harassing whistleblowers from her staffers re: bullying in her office and labour ignored it) is not consistent with the punishments and is indicative of a party using antisemitism for factional purposes (see also the sheer amount of left wing Jews suspended from the membership under Starmer for antisemitism. Gentiles deciding to moderate intracommunity disputes that they're not part of is not by any measure antiracist behaviour) I think Lineham was denying Izzard's gender rather than the Holocaust. The puppet master tweet I'm happy to accept he wasn't aware of the antisemitic trope, mainly because I wasn't and the phrase puppet master exists politically outside of this trope. Edited 24 April 2023 by Captain... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Doctor Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 36 minutes ago, Captain... said: I think Lineham was denying Izzard's gender rather than the Holocaust. The puppet master tweet I'm happy to accept he wasn't aware of the antisemitic trope, mainly because I wasn't and the phrase puppet master exists politically outside of this trope. I'm not sure that's a distinction worth making. like the Nazis also would have denied Izzard's gender - whether you consider trans women to be women or to be men in dresses doesn't change that the Nazis targeted trans people for extermination and saying izzard would have been safe in Nazi Germany is denying that for my money. I struggle to believe anyone could genuinely not be aware of the implications of insinuating that a rich Jewish person is pulling the strings of the government and advancing their own agenda when that is one of the most common antisemitism conspiracy theories out there (and was literally one of the things Corbyn was criticised for for that mural) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 Abbott was a pretty clear electoral liability. Now, with any luck, she isn't any more. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st albans fox Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 7 minutes ago, leicsmac said: Abbott was a pretty clear electoral liability. Now, with any luck, she isn't any more. I heard that she was to be tasked with counting up the Labour vote and that they got in with 107% of that popular vote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urban.spaceman Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zear0 Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 4 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said: Buffet looked a bit ponsey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jattdogg Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 Time to get rid of our ties to the Monarchy over here. Trudeau won't do anything though. Changing demographics plays a big part i am sure. Less connections to "back home in the UK" for a lot of us. Even then, just not relevant in Canada anymore. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/king-charles-coronation-canadian-weak-support-interest-1.6816980 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lionator Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 6 hours ago, The Doctor said: RE: Abbot, while what she said was indefensible, the way labour have handled it doesn't make them look good. She's immediately suspended, while Steve Reed faced no action for invoking antisemitic stereotypes about a Jewish Tory donor, Rosie Duffield faced no action for liking tweets denying the Holocaust, Barry Sheerman faced no action for his run on silver shekels tweet about two Jewish people missing out on peerages. very clear that this is about who said it, not what was said and amounts to a weaponisation of the disciplinary process for factional purposes, meaning they've learnt nothing from the EHRC report It’s because politics is a cesspit and you have to play the game. Starmer isn’t going to suspend a blatantly transphobic MP because it would rile up the ‘daily mail the worlds gone mad’ crew which would lose him political capital in the area that he needs votes. Abbott is easy to suspend because that exact same crew despise her and she’s seen as a massive liability to the electorate. Despite that, Abbott 100% deserves suspension, it was at best stupid, at worst consciously discriminatory. Rather predictably a lot of people on the left are now trying to find reasons to defend her such as hierarchy of racism, transphobia etc when they absolutely know why this exists. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Doctor Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 53 minutes ago, Lionator said: It’s because politics is a cesspit and you have to play the game. Starmer isn’t going to suspend a blatantly transphobic MP because it would rile up the ‘daily mail the worlds gone mad’ crew which would lose him political capital in the area that he needs votes. Abbott is easy to suspend because that exact same crew despise her and she’s seen as a massive liability to the electorate. Despite that, Abbott 100% deserves suspension, it was at best stupid, at worst consciously discriminatory. Rather predictably a lot of people on the left are now trying to find reasons to defend her such as hierarchy of racism, transphobia etc when they absolutely know why this exists. that's my point though, theyve not done this because of what she said, reprehensible as it is, they've done it because it was her specifically who said it (same with Rebecca Long-Baileys tweets about Maxine Peake). Hell, her antiziganistic comments are basically labour party policy based on Charlotte Nicols leaflets and Jess Philips constant gobshitedness. it might well be how the game is played, but labour do run a racial hierarchy (see again the antiziganism) and do run the disciplinary process for factional gain, and frankly minority communities deserve better than to be used as pawns so a shit haircut in a suit can crush his opponents and become PM 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parafox Posted 24 April 2023 Share Posted 24 April 2023 4 hours ago, urban.spaceman said: Sandwiches from Costco. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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