Gary Lineker steps down from MOTD

[Guest bennytwohats]

1 minute ago, st albans fox said:

He should have tweeted something to emphasise this 

And that everyone must learn from history to avoid the catastrophic errors of the past 

 

it’s govt who have extrapolated and spun his comments but whilst he says nothing about his words then they remain able to continue to do so.  It’s easy to say - ‘yes he didn’t actually say nazi or holocaust  but he clearly meant ‘ .  So again, language is important and he should have clarified his. He still has time but it would look like a climb down now. 

He shouldn’t need to clarify anything imo because his tweet leaves little room for misinterpreting. @Dahnsouff has helpfully posted it a couple of posts up.

 

It’s clear imo. The people conflating it with nazi comments would continue to do so even if Lineker clarified things

[Voll Blau]

1 minute ago, st albans fox said:

He should have tweeted something to emphasise this 

And that everyone must learn from history to avoid the catastrophic errors of the past 

 

it’s govt who have extrapolated and spun his comments but whilst he says nothing about his words then they remain able to continue to do so.  It’s easy to say - ‘yes he didn’t actually say nazi or holocaust  but he clearly meant ‘ .  So again, language is important and he should have clarified his. He still has time but it would look like a climb down now. 

Why is the burden on him to do that? It's the government who should be apologising to him for deliberately reporting his comments inaccurately.

[Lcfc82]

Quite like the sound of this new look MOTD. No pundits talking rubbish and just using the world feed commentary.

 

Will save some money, it might catch on

[Nick]

1 minute ago, st albans fox said:

He should have tweeted something to emphasise this 

And that everyone must learn from history to avoid the catastrophic errors of the past 

 

it’s govt who have extrapolated and spun his comments but whilst he says nothing about his words then they remain able to continue to do so.  It’s easy to say - ‘yes he didn’t actually say nazi or holocaust  but he clearly meant ‘ .  So again, language is important and he should have clarified his. He still has time but it would look like a climb down now. 

No, not really! I think what he wrote is well-worded and clear that he refers to the language being akin to that used in 1930's Germany. 

 

He's not responsible for other people and media manipulation and interpretation for their own ends.

 

For me, he doesn't need to clarify anything. 

 

Just watched the Head of the BBC interviewed about this. Genuinely looks and sounded out of his depth poor fella.

[st albans fox]

6 minutes ago, bennytwohats said:

He shouldn’t need to clarify anything imo because his tweet leaves little room for misinterpreting. @Dahnsouff has helpfully posted it a couple of posts up.

 

It’s clear imo. The people conflating it with nazi comments would continue to do so even if Lineker clarified things

He speaks about Germany in the 30’s.  You and me are pretty sure he means the early thirties when it was still a democracy of sorts 

but a lack of clarification means others can compare to 1939 and that’s very different indeed

 

unfortunately, there aren’t that many people who actually listened to their history lessons and understand what happened - people struggle to concentrate for ten seconds nowadays - govt realise this and their continued three word strap lines show that. 

Edited 11 March 2023 by st albans fox

[leicsmac]

9 minutes ago, foxes21 said:

 

It’s not a conundrum. Anti-Vaxxer is a derogatory name and dehumanising. 

The necessary restrictions for COVID were achievable without the hatred of the other being spun.

 

Hopefully such division is not promoted during the next pandemic, which unfortunately might not be far away with the diminishing geopolitical climate and access to biowarfare.

 

Hmmmm... I'm not sure about the second paragraph here, given all of the "alternate facts" regarding the matter bouncing around, even as they do now. But of course there's no way to be certain either way.

 

I'd certainly agree with the sentiment in the last paragraph regarding unity in the face of whatever the next threat is and that it may well be soon (there's one already on the horizon and closing fast) as it might not be as indulgent of disunity as Covid was.

[Mark_w]

2 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

He speaks about Germany in the 30’s.  You and me are pretty sure he means the early thirties when it was still a democracy of sorts 

but a lack of clarification means others can compare to 1939 and that’s very different indeed

What? He’s obviously not talking about the Weimar Republic, he’s talking about the language used by Nazi Germany and their demonisation of people. And he’s right to.

 

If someone high profile had compared any aspect of a pre-2019 British Government to Nazi Germany it would have been laughed off and they would have been a figure of ridicule. I think the BBC and government reaction to this speaks volumes.

[Trav Le Bleu]

16 minutes ago, foxes21 said:

 

It’s not a conundrum. Anti-Vaxxer is a derogatory name and dehumanising. 

The necessary restrictions for COVID were achievable without the hatred of the other being spun.

 

Hopefully such division is not promoted during the next pandemic, which unfortunately might not be far away with the diminishing geopolitical climate and access to biowarfare. 

 

 

 

 

Dehumanising?

 

A label makes you non-human? No name calling is dehumanising; at the end of the day, because bad people will always be able to find a word to insult you.

 

Insult - yes.

 

Dehumanising - give me a break.

[Le Renard]

You see, this is what it does to us "we are outraged" whilst we forget about the real things in life, like our team.......and that's a good thing for us supporters at this moment in time!

[Finnegan]

7 hours ago, filbertway said:

Mad world where an opinion results in job losses. Nothing new though. Le tiss had the same. Nasty culture were living in now where you're literally forced into having a certain opinion or your livlihood is at stake.

 

This is a very poor take in my opinion. Even a borderline dangerous one. 

 

Matt Le Tissier has repeatedly gotten himself in trouble for using his position of fame to push dangerous misinformation. Not "opinions" that ThE eStAbLiShMeNt don't like, actual lies. 

 

He denied the dangers of COVID, a disease that was killing hundreds of thousands of British citizens, and pushed for people to resist taking precautionary measures like masks and compared lockdowns to the holocaust. 

 

He shamelessly used the tragic cardiac arrest of fellow professional Christian Eriksen to push unfounded anti vaccine rhetoric. 

 

Then when COVID blew over and the news cycle moved on to the war in Ukraine he switched up to a new bunch of conspiracy theories and went all Russian shill, questioning reports of Russian war crimes and the invasion. 

 

The response to all of these was simply that his employers wanted nothing to do with him. They didn't want the association to a man who was repeatedly spreading crazy lies. Not opinions, a really important distinction, but significant misinformation. There was no government intervention, no law breaking, no arrests, he just simply got fired because the companies he was working for didn't want to be seen to be endorsing his behaviour. 

 

Gary Lineker however did share an opinion, an opinion that was pretty close to objectively true and significantly an opinion that was critical of the current government. 

 

That government has not only used its influence to have him removed by his employer but is now following up with its MPs and Lords demanding a witch hunt and a public apology because they're terrified of popular public figures like Lineker speaking out against their authoritarian policies. 

 

That's not just unethical, it's actually terrifying. We should all care about this, he likened them to fascists and they responded with fascism. I don't care if you are a conservative, a liberal or a socialist - if you believe in democracy, freedom of the press and freedom of expression then the behaviour of this government and their reaction to Lineker should not just worry but enrage you. 

 

This is a time to be bipartisan and stand together because his silencing is alarming. It isn't "cancel culture", its actual oppression. 

[st albans fox]

10 minutes ago, Mark_w said:

What? He’s obviously not talking about the Weimar Republic, he’s talking about the language used by Nazi Germany and their demonisation of people. And he’s right to.

 

If someone high profile had compared any aspect of a pre-2019 British Government to Nazi Germany it would have been laughed off and they would have been a figure of ridicule. I think the BBC and government reaction to this speaks volumes.

The WM ended in 1933 when AH became chancellor. The language used by the national socialists in the early thirties is, imo, what lineker is speaking about.  Laws were passed in 33 to limit what Jews were allowed to do. so post 1933 is not applicable imo.  If he is referencing post 1933 then I dont agree with him. 

[phoneticerror]

Not sure if this has already been posted, but it made me chuckle this morning

 

[Daggers]

4 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

This is a very poor take in my opinion. Even a borderline dangerous one. 

 

Matt Le Tissier has repeatedly gotten himself in trouble for using his position of fame to push dangerous misinformation. Not "opinions" that ThE eStAbLiShMeNt don't like, actual lies. 

 

He denied the dangers of COVID, a disease that was killing hundreds of thousands of British citizens, and pushed for people to resist taking precautionary measures like masks and compared lockdowns to the holocaust. 

 

He shamelessly used the tragic cardiac arrest of fellow professional Christian Eriksen to push unfounded anti vaccine rhetoric. 

 

Then when COVID blew over and the news cycle moved on to the war in Ukraine he switched up to a new bunch of conspiracy theories and went all Russian shill, questioning reports of Russian war crimes and the invasion. 

 

The response to all of these was simply that his employers wanted nothing to do with him. They didn't want the association to a man who was repeatedly spreading crazy lies. Not opinions, a really important distinction, but significant misinformation. There was no government intervention, no law breaking, no arrests, he just simply got fired because the companies he was working for didn't want to be seen to be endorsing his behaviour. 

 

Gary Lineker however did share an opinion, an opinion that was pretty close to objectively true and significantly an opinion that was critical of the current government. 

 

That government has not only used its influence to have him removed by his employer but is now following up with its MPs and Lords demanding a witch hunt and a public apology because they're terrified of popular public figures like Lineker speaking out against their authoritarian policies. 

 

That's not just unethical, it's actually terrifying. We should all care about this, he likened them to fascists and they responded with fascism. I don't care if you are a conservative, a liberal or a socialist - if you believe in democracy, freedom of the press and freedom of expression then the behaviour of this government and their reaction to Lineker should not just worry but enrage you. 

 

This is a time to be bipartisan and stand together because his silencing is alarming. It isn't "cancel culture", its actual oppression. 

This ^

 

 

[Trav Le Bleu]

Re: all those who are (bizarrely) sticking the boot in on Lineker.

 

You need to recognise that it was largely him who organised and ran the campaign that saved this club when it very nearly disappeared forever.

 

You may not agree with what he said, but some of the comments here make me wonder about the definition, "Leicester City Supporter."

[Greg2607]

12 hours ago, urban.spaceman said:

Nobody cared because he was right about Corbyn and was proved so.

So now he's wrong?

[Trav Le Bleu]

1 minute ago, Daggers said:

This ^

 

 

Saint Gaz

[Le Renard]

2 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

He shamelessly used the tragic cardiac arrest of fellow professional Christian Eriksen to push unfounded anti vaccine rhetoric. 

Yes it is a problem of "one swallow doesn't make a summer", and we should follow the evidence, but there is enough information out there now that reinforces the evidence of an increase in Myocarditis and pericarditis due to the vaccines, by how much is the question that should be asked!

[Strawberry_Jam]

44 minutes ago, bennytwohats said:

Just to be clear, as it has been misquoted multiple times in this thread. He never mentioned the holocaust, he never mentioned the nazis. What he’s said is more nuanced than that and his views have been echoed by many.

I'd instantly ignore anybody that mentions the Holocaust because they clearly don't know their history. "Language used in 1930's Germany" is a mile away from "dispicable action taken in 1940's Germany and surrounding territories"

[The Horse's Mouth]

4 hours ago, The_77 said:

The anger and resentment that  some on here have toward Gary Lineker is beyond strange, especially considering we all live in a world with plenty of choice when it comes to actual villains. 

It’s a weird one, like I get his twitter is really grating, I had to simply just block it. But he seems like a relatively good bloke, was a huge factor in saving the club and genuinely I don’t think many would argue that he’s not a good presenter either 

[Guest David Oldfields Gate]

6 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

He made no such comparison.  He commented that the language used by the Home Secretary was reminiscent of the German government in the 1930s to whip up the people against the “others”.  Which is clearly true.

I don’t understand the language at all.  I understand a policy of trying to stop young men coming here as economic migrants illegally.  That would be easy enough to justify.  

The German government in the 1930s were Nazis, it is possible and expected to extract inference from a statement, especially one using that period of time as the reference.

I agree his use of language himself was exceptionally poor, he could of made so much more progress on the issue by using less of a loaded statement!

 

[Daggers]

I for one would like to congratulate and thank Mark for allowing the thread to remain open and so people could show they are mature enough to have a rational political discussion without resorting to calling all Tories (in parliament, at the BBC, in the media, and everywhere else) a bunch of cvnts 👏

 

I’m impressed FT.

 

A full-on alcohol fuelled Friday night potentially nightmarish thread and yet zero abuse of the fvckers. You’ve outdone yourselves. 👏

[Mr Weller 2]

36 minutes ago, Lcfc82 said:

Quite like the sound of this new look MOTD. No pundits talking rubbish and just using the world feed commentary.

 

Will save some money, it might catch on

No viewers might be a problem 

[Mark_w]

13 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

The WM ended in 1933 when AH became chancellor. The language used by the national socialists in the early thirties is, imo, what lineker is speaking about.  Laws were passed in 33 to limit what Jews were allowed to do. so post 1933 is not applicable imo.  If he is referencing post 1933 then I dont agree with him. 

I don’t think the language and rhetoric of the Nazi party significantly changed after 1933? Post 1933 is perfectly applicable for a comparison about rhetoric rather than policy.

[Lcfc82]

1 minute ago, Mr Weller 2 said:

No viewers might be a problem 

People will still watch it

[Mr Weller 2]

All together now

 

Gary

Lineker

Gary, Gary Lineker

Gary

Lineker

Gary, Gary Lineker

 

Repeat until the BBC reinstate him..,