The Blame Game

[ARTY_FOX]

Dont be mad its over be happy it happened is the worst mentality going. Its that side of our fanbase that really need to move on 

[Rob1742]

7 hours ago, Costock_Fox said:

If one of your businesses was to be asked these questions, would you not feel like there has been mismanagement?

I haven’t said it has not been mismanaged. I said without us wracking up debt it is unlikely we would have won the FA Cup and enjoyed the delights of players like Tielemans.

 

Maddison didn’t move to Newcastle because they wouldn’t pay his wages, so that tells us the avenue we headed down. We were outspending versus our rivals.

 

You carry on doing that you get in a financial mess like we are in now. 
 

I am just saying I prefer for us to be in that mess now but have had the delights of players like Maddison and an FA Cup, rather than potter along with lesser players and not win anything.

 

As a business it has been grossly mismanaged, but without that I doubt we would have won the FA Cup and enjoyed Europe.

 

The last transfer windows show how much of a mess we are in, that has come about from overspending for several years.
 

If it was my business I wouldn’t do it no, but I’m glad they did it as I never thought we would win the FA cup
 

 

Edited 11 May 2023 by Rob1742

[Captain...]

13 hours ago, Rob1742 said:

Like a pack of wolves, a good proportion of the Leicester loyal turn on their club.

 

Top who was the hero, suddenly it’s his fault. Rudkin, well he has always been there to be shot at. Then there is Rodger’s, he will get it from the proportion that don’t blame Top.

 

The bottom line is we over invested in the club, huge contracts for the manager and massive wages to keep the likes of Kasper and Vards.

 

For me, I’m not having it. I understand we will go down, but mismanaged? 
 

Depends on how you look at it and I’m looking at it in a different way.

 

If we had lives within our means there would have been no Rodger’s, no Tielemans and certainly no F.A Cup win and no Europe.

 

We have acted like a lot of people, huge credit card bills, big mortgages, but they have had some great holidays and drive nice cars.

 

Playing it the way we did it was bound to hit us hard, and I think the next good few years will be extremely bumpy, probably a great deal more bumpy than anyone can expect.

 

But blame game, nah, we kept Vardy here instead of Arsenal, we went on  European tour, we massively overspent and now we are in a huge mess.

 

But I am glad we did it, I am glad we invested in Rodger’s, I am glad we beat the sensible spenders to the likes of Tielemans and Maddison and I am so happy I have been on the journey.

 

I ain’t blaming anyone, not least Top who sanctions deals and Rodger’s for getting us to a fantastic trophy win. 
 

I sort of don’t care what is going to happen, we have had a great time and we wouldn’t have done it playing it the sensible way. 
 

I much prefer what we have done than just potter along, I ain’t blaming anyone. I am going to look back at a fantastic era I never thought possible. 
 

I personally get disappointed when people get turned on, got to blame someone, you always have to find someone to point at.

 

Not me, it’s been great, and I am so happy it happened. 
 

Fasten your seat belts, but don’t expect what we recently achieved for many many many years. Those days are gone, but look back with fondness rather than hacking people down who made that dream possible 

Love this post, not surprising people don't get it right now we're in the thick of a relegation whimper.

 

I wouldn't trade the last 10 years for the 30 that Everton had in the PL or all the Stokes and Burnleys and Southamptons combined. We have had a decade like no other club could imagine. Real Roy of the Rovers shit. However like all underdog stories it must come to an end. It wasn't sustainable and whilst we can all look back at the errors after the fact, it was only a matter of time before it all fizzled out. Either becoming a Stoke or, as looks likely now, relegation.

 

We were fearless, we were Icarus flying too close to the sun and now we're crashing back to the ground with those that never dared to fly. Whilst our wings are clipped and we may be slogging it out with the grounded folk all too soon and those memories will fade, for those of us that were there, they will never be forgotten. 

Edited 11 May 2023 by Captain...

[StevieH]

13 hours ago, Rob1742 said:

Like a pack of wolves, a good proportion of the Leicester loyal turn on their club.

 

Top who was the hero, suddenly it’s his fault. Rudkin, well he has always been there to be shot at. Then there is Rodger’s, he will get it from the proportion that don’t blame Top.

 

The bottom line is we over invested in the club, huge contracts for the manager and massive wages to keep the likes of Kasper and Vards.

 

For me, I’m not having it. I understand we will go down, but mismanaged? 
 

Depends on how you look at it and I’m looking at it in a different way.

 

If we had lives within our means there would have been no Rodger’s, no Tielemans and certainly no F.A Cup win and no Europe.

 

We have acted like a lot of people, huge credit card bills, big mortgages, but they have had some great holidays and drive nice cars.

 

Playing it the way we did it was bound to hit us hard, and I think the next good few years will be extremely bumpy, probably a great deal more bumpy than anyone can expect.

 

But blame game, nah, we kept Vardy here instead of Arsenal, we went on  European tour, we massively overspent and now we are in a huge mess.

 

But I am glad we did it, I am glad we invested in Rodger’s, I am glad we beat the sensible spenders to the likes of Tielemans and Maddison and I am so happy I have been on the journey.

 

I ain’t blaming anyone, not least Top who sanctions deals and Rodger’s for getting us to a fantastic trophy win. 
 

I sort of don’t care what is going to happen, we have had a great time and we wouldn’t have done it playing it the sensible way. 
 

I much prefer what we have done than just potter along, I ain’t blaming anyone. I am going to look back at a fantastic era I never thought possible. 
 

I personally get disappointed when people get turned on, got to blame someone, you always have to find someone to point at.

 

Not me, it’s been great, and I am so happy it happened. 
 

Fasten your seat belts, but don’t expect what we recently achieved for many many many years. Those days are gone, but look back with fondness rather than hacking people down who made that dream possible 

Well said. Absolutely spot on. Someone talking sense for a change.

[VLC86]

16 minutes ago, Rob1742 said:

I haven’t said it has not been mismanaged. I said without us wracking up debt it is unlikely we would have won the FA Cup and enjoyed the delights of players like Tielemans.

 

Maddison didn’t move to Newcastle because they wouldn’t pay his wages, so that tells us the avenue we headed down. We were outspending versus our rivals.

 

You carry on doing that you get in a financial mess like we are in now. 
 

I am just saying I prefer for us to be in that mess now but have had the delights of players like Maddison and an FA Cup, rather than potter along with lesser players and not win anything.

 

As a business it has been grossly mismanaged, but without that I doubt we would have won the FA Cup and enjoyed Europe.

 

The last transfer windows show how much of a mess we are in, that has come about from overspending for several years.
 

If it was my business I wouldn’t do it no, but I’m glad they did it as I never thought we would win the FA cup
 

 

That’s all fair enough, but I still believe that we had a choice after the FA Cup win that would have seen us continue to be a challenger for the top 6 without the complete ruin which is to follow.

 

Would I take relegation and what’s likely to come for what we have lived? Absolutely, but it didn’t need to be like this and only has been due to glaring errors.

[Nod.E]

The only moment we truly rolled the dice is when we stopped selling a big player each year and started signing crocks. I.e shortly after Rodgers arrived. 

 

Then we bottled UCL and the rest is history.

[Foxedit]

Good lord. What a season.. battered throughout! 

[Guest Mee-9]

10 minutes ago, Nod.E said:

The only moment we truly rolled the dice is when we stopped selling a big player each year and started signing crocks. I.e shortly after Rodgers arrived. 

 

Then we bottled UCL and the rest is history.

I feel like the big shift was the change in transfer policy overseen by Rodgers. 

 

Instead of buying young players for the future we were buying anything. Vestergaard and Bertrand for example. 

[Captain...]

18 minutes ago, Costock_Fox said:

That’s all fair enough, but I still believe that we had a choice after the FA Cup win that would have seen us continue to be a challenger for the top 6 without the complete ruin which is to follow.

 

Would I take relegation and what’s likely to come for what we have lived? Absolutely, but it didn’t need to be like this and only has been due to glaring errors.

We've had many choices at many times over the last 10 years, some popular, some unpopular, some very risky, some safe and some paid off some didn't. 

[Les-TA-Jon]

1 hour ago, Captain... said:

Love this post, not surprising people don't get it right now we're in the thick of a relegation whimper.

 

I wouldn't trade the last 10 years for the 30 that Everton had in the PL or all the Stokes and Burnleys and Southamptons combined. We have had a decade like no other club could imagine. Real Roy of the Rovers shit. However like all underdog stories it must come to an end. It wasn't sustainable and whilst we can all look back at the errors after the fact, it was only a matter of time before it all fizzled out. Either becoming a Stoke or, as looks likely now, relegation.

 

We were fearless, we were Icarus flying too close to the sun and now we're crashing back to the ground with those that never dared to fly. Whilst our wings are clipped and we may be slogging it out with the grounded folk all too soon and those memories will fade, for those of us that were there, they will never be forgotten. 

This is all true. But it's not correct to say that our relegation is all down to an inevitable 'what goes up must come down' or that underdogs that overachieve eventually regress to a lower level. Or that the icarus analogy is the cause of our relegation. 

 

Yes, we speculated on long contracts and high wages, in an attempt to retain our best players (or maximise their value if selling).  

 

We're going to go down this season because:

• We had a manager who had checked out of the job, was frustrated at the summer window, and quickly began prioritising his own brand/legacy, rather than what the club needed. See: complete lack of recognition of us being in a relegation battle, not playing our best players due to non-footballing reasons, not adjusting our tactics to be harder to beat and better at grinding out points
• We had 2 disastrous summer windows in a row, which contributed to a stagnating/declining squad
• Our model was eroded and dismantled from within. Rennie left. Recruitment model was changed. Head of Analysis left after being vetoed on signings like Vestergaard and Bertrand. Injuries epidemic.  

[bovril]

Reading the OP I've just got one question - Rodger's what? 

[inckley fox]

2 hours ago, Rob1742 said:

I haven’t said it has not been mismanaged. I said without us wracking up debt it is unlikely we would have won the FA Cup and enjoyed the delights of players like Tielemans.

 

Maddison didn’t move to Newcastle because they wouldn’t pay his wages, so that tells us the avenue we headed down. We were outspending versus our rivals.

 

You carry on doing that you get in a financial mess like we are in now. 
 

I am just saying I prefer for us to be in that mess now but have had the delights of players like Maddison and an FA Cup, rather than potter along with lesser players and not win anything.

 

As a business it has been grossly mismanaged, but without that I doubt we would have won the FA Cup and enjoyed Europe.

 

The last transfer windows show how much of a mess we are in, that has come about from overspending for several years.
 

If it was my business I wouldn’t do it no, but I’m glad they did it as I never thought we would win the FA cup
 

 

In your original post you literally said 'but mismanaged?' before going on to say you dldn't look at matters that way. Maybe you're talking about two different things and I've missed one of them, but it does seem here that you think pretty much what everyone else does (i.e. yes, it's been mismanaged).

 

Any club in any division which is in the top 5 one year and bottom 1-5 two years later has to accept that things have been mismanaged in the interim. And it's been quite easy to see the errors by Rodgers - be it in team selections, target-setting, the public undermining of our capacity, his game management or in his actual results - and by some of those (e.g. recruitment head / fitness coach / set piece coaches) that he's brought in or worked with.

 

It's been equally easy to see that the apparent misunderstanding about how much we'd be able to spend, the club policy of hanging on till the last minute to see if we can eke out better transfer deals (the opposite of our old policy, and VERY risky if we want to rebuild thoroughly and effectively after relegation), the lack of urgency (coupled with media reports of behind the scenes complacency) in changing the manager, and the financial mess, are all evidence of club-level mismanagement.

 

It doesn't mean we should want to lynch anyone. But there's no point in denying what you can clearly see, or being too kind about it.

 

As for the FA Cup, well, I don't actually think Maddison - a sub, wasn't he? - was all that crucial to us actually winning anything. Tielemans, of course, but surely the mismanagement with him - and it's not one of the more incomprehensible infractions by any measure - was not thay we signed him in a summer when we made a profit on our transfers, but that we didn't sell him when his value was highest and he was coming into his final two years. So does that impact on our FA Cup win? I don't know. If your argument is that the mismanagement stretches back before that, which may be true, then no, I still wouldn't say that - when we were top of the table with one of the lowest wage bills and transfer outlays in the division - I was saying to myself 'we'll never win anything else unless we spend big, take risks, and generally start trying to do everything like the clubs that we've just usurped.'

 

I don't believe that any of what has happened since then has been necessary, or just part of that normal football rollercoaster. It is largely a result of incompetence.

Edited 11 May 2023 by inckley fox

[Mickyblueeyes]

Its one way of looking at it but realistically  this is so much more than the little club rolling the dice and not getting the breaks. 

[inckley fox]

26 minutes ago, inckley fox said:

In your original post you literally said 'but mismanaged?' before going on to say you dldn't look at matters that way. Maybe you're talking about two different things and I've missed one of them, but it does seem here that you think pretty much what everyone else does (i.e. yes, it's been mismanaged).

 

Any club in any division which is in the top 5 one year and bottom 1-5 two years later has to accept that things have been mismanaged in the interim. And it's been quite easy to see the errors by Rodgers - be it in team selections, target-setting, the public undermining of our capacity, his game management or in his actual results - and by some of those (e.g. recruitment head / fitness coach / set piece coaches) that he's brought in or worked with.

 

It's been equally easy to see that the apparent misunderstanding about how much we'd be able to spend, the club policy of hanging on till the last minute to see if we can eke out better transfer deals (the opposite of our old policy, and VERY risky if we want to rebuild thoroughly and effectively after relegation), the lack of urgency (coupled with media reports of behind the scenes complacency) in changing the manager, and the financial mess, are all evidence of club-level mismanagement.

 

It doesn't mean we should want to lynch anyone. But there's no point in denying what you can clearly see, or being too kind about it.

 

As for the FA Cup, well, I don't actually think Maddison - a sub, wasn't he? - was all that crucial to us actually winning anything. Tielemans, of course, but surely the mismanagement with him - and it's not one of the more incomprehensible infractions by any measure - was not thay we signed him in a summer when we made a profit on our transfers, but that we didn't sell him when his value was highest and he was coming into his final two years. So does that impact on our FA Cup win? I don't know. If your argument is that the mismanagement stretches back before that, which may be true, then no, I still wouldn't say that - when we were top of the table with one of the lowest wage bills and transfer outlays in the division - I was saying to myself 'we'll never win anything else unless we spend big, take risks, and generally start trying to do everything like the clubs that we've just usurped.'

 

I don't believe that any of what has happened since 2021 has been necessary, or just part of that normal football rollercoaster. It is largely a result of incompetence.

 

[inckley fox]

Sorry, I've just managed to repost myself. That's not because I want to make sure nobody has missed it, it's because I'm a bit crap and can't edit properly.

[Dahnsouff]

15 hours ago, MattFox said:

 

17th in the net spend table since 2016

 

”Maxed out the credit card” 

Irrelevant. Wages without income increases matching the rises has killed us.

 

[OntarioFox]

I blame Rodgers, the board and the players, in that order. I don't have anything more to say.

 

Thanks a lot for killing Vichai's dream in 18 months, all of you.

[dannythefox]

18 hours ago, Rob1742 said:

Like a pack of wolves, a good proportion of the Leicester loyal turn on their club.

 

Top who was the hero, suddenly it’s his fault. Rudkin, well he has always been there to be shot at. Then there is Rodger’s, he will get it from the proportion that don’t blame Top.

 

The bottom line is we over invested in the club, huge contracts for the manager and massive wages to keep the likes of Kasper and Vards.

 

For me, I’m not having it. I understand we will go down, but mismanaged? 
 

Depends on how you look at it and I’m looking at it in a different way.

 

If we had lives within our means there would have been no Rodger’s, no Tielemans and certainly no F.A Cup win and no Europe.

 

We have acted like a lot of people, huge credit card bills, big mortgages, but they have had some great holidays and drive nice cars.

 

Playing it the way we did it was bound to hit us hard, and I think the next good few years will be extremely bumpy, probably a great deal more bumpy than anyone can expect.

 

But blame game, nah, we kept Vardy here instead of Arsenal, we went on  European tour, we massively overspent and now we are in a huge mess.

 

But I am glad we did it, I am glad we invested in Rodger’s, I am glad we beat the sensible spenders to the likes of Tielemans and Maddison and I am so happy I have been on the journey.

 

I ain’t blaming anyone, not least Top who sanctions deals and Rodger’s for getting us to a fantastic trophy win. 
 

I sort of don’t care what is going to happen, we have had a great time and we wouldn’t have done it playing it the sensible way. 
 

I much prefer what we have done than just potter along, I ain’t blaming anyone. I am going to look back at a fantastic era I never thought possible. 
 

I personally get disappointed when people get turned on, got to blame someone, you always have to find someone to point at.

 

Not me, it’s been great, and I am so happy it happened. 
 

Fasten your seat belts, but don’t expect what we recently achieved for many many many years. Those days are gone, but look back with fondness rather than hacking people down who made that dream possible 

It’s on Top he’s the main man, then Rodger’s there are loads of other issues but even without investment this squad should be top half. 
 

He’s been a really good chairman but he’s got this one terribly wrong. I bet he’ll never wait to sack a manager as long as he Rodger’s ever again. His dad would of had him out with minimum 15/16 games to go. 
 

It could have been so easy to stay up with the standard of football around the bottom this season but he’s simply showed too much loyalty to Rodger’s. 
 

I’ve seen us being poor for around 18-20 months so why couldn’t he? It’s a very expensive mistake.

[CrispinLA in Texas]

Remembering the first game of season at home against Brentford. 

We were playing brilliantly, scored 2 good goals in the first half, Brentford were awful in that half. 

And come the second half Thomas Frank makes 5 changes I think, totally changes the look and playing style of his team. While Brendan just stands their and does nothing and we concede 2 goals and probably gave Frank's team great motivation to go at teams for the rest of their season. 

And at the end of the game Brendan says the hot weather exhausted his players....🙄 but he didn't bother using any subs except putting Daka on for KDH.

I do think Brendan's lack of helping the players out in the second half must affected in how they saw him and how much they were willing to work for him.

[erlee]

at least Saints hv only wasted 8m quids on JOnes .. how much have we squandered

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/22347205/nathan-jones-southampton-manager-sky-sports/

[CosbehFox]

Sorry but the assertion that we don’t win the FA Cup or get into Europe without gross mis-spending is utter nonsense. 
 

The situation financially hangs on four major points. 
 

1. The failure to maintain a model where we sell a player every season to have the largest income of finance. That happened in the FA Cup season because we’d sold Chilwell. In part this led to our largest ever incoming revenue to the club. Didn’t sell anyone in 21/22 of major note. 
 

2. The summer window of 21/22 where the club spent significant sums of money without funding it via an outgoing player. All of those players have been dead ducks and have no possible positive financial return on them. 
 

3. The wage bill. Wages handed out to Maddison and Tielemans are perfectly deserved when their output is. The issues around the inflated wage bill centre on giving squad players way too much money. 
 

4. Allowing players to run down their contracts and therefore reduce your ability to get a return on them. 
 

It’s less overspending, more utterly complete mismanagement that was largely off the back of the FA Cup win as opposed to due to the FA Cup win. 
 

Still scratching my head on the paying off of an internal debt to yourselves when the club urgently needed a cash injection all summer because of a failure to good player trading - unless the end game is to sell the club. 

[FrankieADZ]

On 11/05/2023 at 12:54, OntarioFox said:

I blame Rodgers, the board and the players, in that order. I don't have anything more to say.

 

Thanks a lot for killing Vichai's dream in 18 months, all of you.

this is spot on for me,

was plan to see the performances under Rodgers where falling off for at least 18 months, as in that time i dont think we had 10 "good" performances, 

 

for me its journo's and shit of it all, how the hell did none of them notice the club were sleepwalking to relegation and placing very little blame from what I can see at BR's door

[Free Falling Foxes]

It's been a shit show for many/all of the reasons given in this and other threads.

All are culpable.

Strangly though, if it wasnt for the mid season break for the world cup, we wouldn't be going down imo.

We were on a roll and who's to say it wouldn't have carried on?

My guess is we would be at least 6 points better off. Still a poor season, but we would have survived.

[kingston_fox]

9 hours ago, CrispinLA in Texas said:

Remembering the first game of season at home against Brentford. 

We were playing brilliantly, scored 2 good goals in the first half, Brentford were awful in that half. 

And come the second half Thomas Frank makes 5 changes I think, totally changes the look and playing style of his team. While Brendan just stands their and does nothing and we concede 2 goals and probably gave Frank's team great motivation to go at teams for the rest of their season. 

And at the end of the game Brendan says the hot weather exhausted his players....🙄 but he didn't bother using any subs except putting Daka on for KDH.

I do think Brendan's lack of helping the players out in the second half must affected in how they saw him and how much they were willing to work for him.

Spot on... Would be great to have those 2 points we threw away whilst he was making a stupid point and not rotating players in the first game

[Sly]

This season is a mess. 
 

A real, real mess. 
 

However if Rodgers has played Iversen and Soyuncu, instead of Ward and Amartey, he’d still most likely be in a job.

 

The club has fallen from its peak, however it still had the tools to be mid table.