Manager for the Championship rebuild - who do you want?

[yorkie1999]

5 minutes ago, Babylon said:

We don’t, because we have nothing to do with it. We don’t see training, we’re unliking to notice incremental improvements in positioning etc. 

 

It’s been going on since the bloke has been here, the second things go wrong… “sack Mike Stowell”, it’s ridiculous. 
 

People were noticeably quiet about his involvement when we were winning numerous leagues and cups… sort of makes me think it’s reactionary nonsense. 

I think one of the problems for the current coaches is we've just been relegated. We'll have a number of new players coming in who'll be thinking "who's this guy coaching me that's just failed with the player i'm replacing". I think it's time for a new start and that means coaches with different ideas and methods. I hope whoever we bring in as manager brings his own coaching team with him. Stowells a bit of a funny one because although he's supposed to be the goalie coach, from what i've seen, he always appears to be in the managers ear suggesting things.

[JimmyC74]

If it’s Enzo Maresca or a similar style of manager who wants to undertake a complete overhaul of the Club it’s probable it will take time to implement their plans / forge us an identity.

The danger is the later it takes to bring them in and / or if the Board does not back them with numbers of players we start slowly and we improve as the season progresses.

 

I am open minded on appointing the likes of Maresca, but would like someone who comes in and gives us an identity (as compared to the group of semi-interested individuals).
 

You could see how they might view Smith or Parker as a safer bet (know the division, players, promotion on cv) but I hope we don’t go that route.

 

 

 

 

 

[dannythefox]

25 minutes ago, foxfanazer said:

His personality seems so dour to me. I can't imagine his team talks being too motivational 

Give over one of the most passionate players there was. A proper leader on and off the pitch. I’m sure his team talk would be the same 

[ClaphamFox]

1 minute ago, Chelmofox said:

There wont be time for any of that. What you are saying there takes half a year to get in motion, if not longer. There has to be a short term aim to bounce back to the PL in one go. To do that, recruitment have to be doing there jobs now ready to strike a range of candidates asap. The club have to appoint the manager they feel who can get us promoted in the first attempt, and if this is a manager we sack once in the PL so be it. No Mercy, no long term projects that muddy short term goals. Get back to the PL and build again once in there.

Yes but such a manager is likely to want a major say in this summer’s transfers. The scouting team will have shortlists of players but the new manager will have the final say. Our best chance of getting straight back up will be to give the new manager the tools he wants. And the kind of leader we need would never come anyway unless they were guaranteed a major say in player sales and purchases.

[foxfanazer]

Just now, dannythefox said:

Give over one of the most passionate players there was. A proper leader on and off the pitch. I’m sure his team talk would be the same 

Key word right there. He could lead by example on the pitch. As a manager he's fully relying on his personality which I'm not convinced he has

[volpeazzurro]

27 minutes ago, coolhandfox said:

So your saying Kasper didn't improve at all in his time at City from when he arrive from Leeds?

Not in those areas, do you think he did?

[Chelmofox]

1 minute ago, ClaphamFox said:

Yes but such a manager is likely to want a major say in this summer’s transfers. The scouting team will have shortlists of players but the new manager will have the final say. Our best chance of getting straight back up will be to give the new manager the tools he wants. And the kind of leader we need would never come anyway unless they were guaranteed a major say in player sales and purchases.

Following what happened with Rodgers , the new manager will not have the final say on transfers. He will work with what he is given. I’m not sure people fully understand what a new manager is capable on activating in 7-8 weeks. 

[ClaphamFox]

1 minute ago, foxfanazer said:

Key word right there. He could lead by example on the pitch. As a manager he's fully relying on his personality which I'm not convinced he has

When he had Michael Beale as his number two, Beale apparently took the training sessions, led team meetings and gave the pre-match talks. Gerrard was a peripheral figure. Hence Villa’s steep decline when Beale left.

[ClaphamFox]

1 minute ago, Chelmofox said:

Following what happened with Rodgers , the new manager will not have the final say on transfers. He will work with what he is given. I’m not sure people fully understand what a new manager is capable on activating in 7-8 weeks. 

What kind of manager worth his salt would agree to work under those terms? Hardly any. If we want to do it that way, we may as well give up on trying to recruit a manager with a strong personality and leadership skills and just try to find an obedient figure with zero gravitas who won’t shake things up. Which is the polar opposite of what the club needs.

[volpeazzurro]

24 minutes ago, Babylon said:

We don’t, because we have nothing to do with it. We don’t see training, we’re unliking to notice incremental improvements in positioning etc. 

 

It’s been going on since the bloke has been here, the second things go wrong… “sack Mike Stowell”, it’s ridiculous. 
 

People were noticeably quiet about his involvement when we were winning numerous leagues and cups… sort of makes me think it’s reactionary nonsense. 

Nevertheless, he's part of the coaching staff and therefore, for me, part of the general malaise, poor standards and problem in general therefore. Their message or training is clearly stale. As I mentioned, just watching them warm up before a match compared with opposition teams was enough to see their lack of focus, is it any wonder we conceded early goals, they were half asleep! Surely that is part of the coaches job? They all seemed to be far too comfortable, coaching staff and players under Rodgers reign. Time for a change, restructure and new impetus throughout. Just another sharp talking media friendly manager and coaching staff won't cut the mustard in a fixture rich dog eat dog Championship.

[smudger63]

5 minutes ago, Chelmofox said:

Following what happened with Rodgers , the new manager will not have the final say on transfers. He will work with what he is given. I’m not sure people fully understand what a new manager is capable on activating in 7-8 weeks. 

If that's the logic, we might as well bring the players in before recruiting the manager then. Otherwise it could be like recruiting Neil Warnock next week, giving him no say in what players we bring in,  giving him some technically gifted midfielders to use, and then he totally bypasses them all season, as the ball flys over their heads for 90 minutes.

[JimmyC74]

9 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

When he had Michael Beale as his number two, Beale apparently took the training sessions, led team meetings and gave the pre-match talks. Gerrard was a peripheral figure. Hence Villa’s steep decline when Beale left.

As you point out if we were looking at Gerrard his choice of coaching team would be critical.

 

the great Martin O’Neill delegated coaching to the likes of Steve Walford but he was front and centre before / during matchday. I don’t know if Gerrard has the inspirational qualities that, combined with the right coach, would make him a success but I think there are better / less risky candidates for us.

[Weller Wing]

11 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

Nevertheless, he's part of the coaching staff and therefore, for me, part of the general malaise, poor standards and problem in general therefore. Their message or training is clearly stale. As I mentioned, just watching them warm up before a match compared with opposition teams was enough to see their lack of focus, is it any wonder we conceded early goals, they were half asleep! Surely that is part of the coaches job? They all seemed to be far too comfortable, coaching staff and players under Rodgers reign. Time for a change, restructure and new impetus throughout. Just another sharp talking media friendly manager and coaching staff won't cut the mustard in a fixture rich dog eat dog Championship.

That start against Newcastle, just after the WC was totally embarrassing and showed how badly prepared the team was for games.

They were so much more up for it at the kick off, you had to wonder if the squad, many that didn't go to the WC , did anything football and fitness related during that break😡

[Vlad the Fox]

It won’t be gerrard, he thinks he’s a premier league manager, it will take a couple more failures ur long spell without job offers before he will step down into the championship. 

[ClaphamFox]

3 minutes ago, Vlad the Fox said:

It won’t be gerrard, he thinks he’s a premier league manager, it will take a couple more failures ur long spell without job offers before he will step down into the championship. 

No Premier League club will offer him a job. I doubt if many Championship clubs would either.

[Fox1norfolk]

1 minute ago, ClaphamFox said:

No Premier League club will offer him a job. I doubt if many Championship clubs would either.

We seem to be concentrating on a list of managers who are out of work, they all failed! We need to target a successful inspirational. manager who will take on a massive challenge. Maybe the answer is in Europe ?

[deep blue]

30 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

When he had Michael Beale as his number two, Beale apparently took the training sessions, led team meetings and gave the pre-match talks. Gerrard was a peripheral figure. Hence Villa’s steep decline when Beale left.

Do you know where Beale is now? Maybe he would come here as part of the deal with Gerrard.  Would still prefer a more adventurous appointment, though, like McKenna.  Maybe he could get Hirst working for us too.

[ClaphamFox]

2 minutes ago, Fox1norfolk said:

We seem to be concentrating on a list of managers who are out of work, they all failed! We need to target a successful inspirational. manager who will take on a massive challenge. Maybe the answer is in Europe ?

If we were concentrating on managers who are out of work, it would probably have been done by now.

[Aus Fox]

6 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

I love your posts but this is soooo wrong. The new manager has absolutely no say in 'who he wants' .... this is a fire sale. Everybody out until 100m+ has been banked. Then maybe the new guy (or girl) has a minor say

 

The brief is (should be) simple; here's a sqaud of players. The coaching staff have conditioned them. Now go manage and get us up 

I get that and players like Castagne,

Maddison, Barnes and then one of maybe Ndidi or Iheanacho will make up the most of the shortfall.

Players like KDH, Thomas, Justin, Faes, even Vardy it would be good for a manager to decide if he wants to keep them around, or try and cash in and bring in a different type of player.

The earlier we can get a manager to assess the squad we have the better.

[Chelmofox]

26 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

What kind of manager worth his salt would agree to work under those terms? Hardly any. If we want to do it that way, we may as well give up on trying to recruit a manager with a strong personality and leadership skills and just try to find an obedient figure with zero gravitas who won’t shake things up. Which is the polar opposite of what the club needs.

Its what Potter signed up to at Chelsea and was largely happening to him at Brighton. Its what happens to any manager who takes over a team during a transfer window. Dyche hasn't yet had any involvement in a single Everton transfer.  This romantic notion that the manager decides on who all the players should be doesn't exist much in todays game, and if the manager pulls off that sort of power you end up with exactly the sort of trouble we had with Brendan. The manager should be working with the recruitment team, but the manager shouldn't be the recruitment team. In the position we find ourselves now, the recruitment team are going to have to find probably 15 new players and would (or should!) have been working on this for some time. No way do we get a manager in in 3 weeks time who starts this process. In this window, a new manager is going to have to expect to have limited involvement in who we recruit, otherwise we aren't getting 15 new players. If the manager has contacts that allows us to bring in some appropriate players in this window, then that should be viewed as a bonus, not the strategy.

 

Remember, we are talking about this transfer window in preparation for trying to get promoted. What happens more long term is up to the DOF, manager and recruitment teams to decide for sure if the club want to retain the manager. I am certain as the manager understands his team more he will know what the priorities are that he can get the team working on ready for the January window.

 

27 minutes ago, smudger63 said:

If that's the logic, we might as well bring the players in before recruiting the manager then. Otherwise it could be like recruiting Neil Warnock next week, giving him no say in what players we bring in,  giving him some technically gifted midfielders to use, and then he totally bypasses them all season, as the ball flys over their heads for 90 minutes.

This is largely what sambiasso (unless im mistaken) said was happening. Recruitment are working on options now but the club are willing to take a bit more time with the correct appointment (in their eyes at least).  I think its largely why names such as Parker are being banded around.

[Vlad the Fox]

17 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

No Premier League club will offer him a job. I doubt if many Championship clubs would either.

Probably true but does he and/or his agent realise that. However I’m sure someone will take a punt on him at some point, probably someone like luton or shef united if they struggle and start looking for a change. 

[Tommy Fresh]

42 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

What kind of manager worth his salt would agree to work under those terms? Hardly any. If we want to do it that way, we may as well give up on trying to recruit a manager with a strong personality and leadership skills and just try to find an obedient figure with zero gravitas who won’t shake things up. Which is the polar opposite of what the club needs.

What do you think happens at Red Bull clubs? Salzburg in particular aren't straying from their recruitment stratergy based on the manager, add in clubs like Nordsjælland or data driven sides like AZ. You'd identify managers suited to overall direction you want the club to go in.

[Spudulike]

The only reason the club would appoint Gerrard is to raise our profile in the far east. Same reason they appointed Sven. 

[ClaphamFox]

2 minutes ago, Tommy Fresh said:

What do you think happens at Red Bull clubs? Salzburg in particular aren't straying from their recruitment stratergy based on the manager, add in clubs like Nordsjælland or data driven sides like AZ. You'd identify managers suited to overall direction you want the club to go in.

That would be all well and good if our club had leaders above the manager who are capable of setting the direction. But we don’t. Hence why I think we need a manager with a strong personality to lead.

[nnfox]

22 minutes ago, Fox1norfolk said:

We seem to be concentrating on a list of managers who are out of work, they all failed! We need to target a successful inspirational. manager who will take on a massive challenge. Maybe the answer is in Europe ?

So you want a successful, inspirational manager that's never been sacked to come to newly relegated Leicester City.  No doubt he'll arrive riding a unicorn too.

 

Truth is that we aren't the attractive proposition we once were and are fishing in something of a limited pond.

 

Different managers "fit" different clubs for a number of reasons.  Just because a manager has been sacked at another club, doesn't mean they'll fail with us.