Frustrating Foxes

[Leeds Fox]

So, looking at the Europa League semi final squads tonight. When we missed out on CL football two years in a row, which was bitterly disappointing and unfathomable at a point.

 
When we were playing our best football, under Rodgers. When we took Man City apart on the counter, beat Arsenal, feared nobody. The team/squad isn’t too far off what it was at its best. We had a team that would’ve bested Sevilla, Juve, Roma and any other half decent side across Europe. (I know Roma knocked us out of the ECL).

 

At our peak under Rodgers, we beat everyone across Europe, I’m sure of it. We beat pretty much everyone in England in the first 2/3s of each season when we were good.

 

I don’t know and can’t comprehend what happened to us. 
 

I’ve seen us relegated, it didn’t feel like this one will. This one hurts more than any other. 

Edited 19 May 2023 by Leeds Fox

[Heathrow fox]

The spine.It aged,left,got injured or just lost form in general.The replacement parts were either inferior or played incorrectly.

[fox_favourite]

It feels different because on paper this is one of the strongest squads we've had. Other relegations were different as we were expected to go down due to our squad ability. This one is full of internationals and not is small countries. England, Belgium, Nigeria etc....this is why it feels different. Why this one is so disheartening. Thiss squad is mid-table. In reality it's been mismanaged, lacks leadership from o the pitch to boardroom and mismanagement at a financial side  The catalogue of errors has bit us on the bum. 

 

 

Edited 19 May 2023 by fox_favourite

[volpeazzurro]

3 hours ago, Leeds Fox said:

So, looking at the Europa League semi final squads tonight. When we missed out on CL football two years in a row, which was bitterly disappointing and unfathomable at a point.

 
When we were playing our best football, under Rodgers. When we took Man City apart on the counter, beat Arsenal, feared nobody. The team/squad isn’t too far off what it was at its best. We had a team that would’ve bested Sevilla, Juve, Roma and any other half decent side across Europe. (I know Roma knocked us out of the ECL).

 

At our peak under Rodgers, we beat everyone across Europe, I’m sure of it. We beat pretty much everyone in England in the first 2/3s of each season when we were good.

 

I don’t know and can’t comprehend what happened to us. 
 

I’ve seen us relegated, it didn’t feel like this one will. This one hurts more than any other. 

What happened was that was early days until Rodgers had fully sunk his claws into the players and stamped his own tiresome, flawed footballing on them.

[gw_leics772]

24 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

What happened was that was early days until Rodgers had fully sunk his claws into the players and stamped his own tiresome, flawed footballing on them.

This, with bells on. And my proof that the overall responsibility lies at the very Top, is that written like this, shows very clearly that Rodgers was a slower, shitter version of Ranieri's time with us, but everyone fell for the PR machine. He had near instant "success", (but nowhere near Ranieri level) , which lasted longer, and started from a better squad, but then was still arrogant enough to believe that he knew best (like Ranieri's second season) and it all went wrong. 

 

The big difference is that "we" (Vichai) sacked Ranieri's before he had the chance to do any lasting damage, yet with BR, "we" (Top) kept him on for far too long until the lasting damage was done. 

 

This in no way absolves BR of even a tiny portion for what he did wrong, because he started with arguably the best squad any new Leicester manager has ever had, and was given the most support our club has ever given to any manager, yet slowly but surely made us worse, to this previously unimaginable level of shitness. 

 

Unfortunately the new we, let this continue unchecked, seemingly falling for the BS that Brendan spouted, rather than the evidence in front of our eyes, until we reached this "level" 

 

The single biggest issue we face now that we have finally got rid of BR though, imo, is the contract situation where hardly anybody has any skin in the game, and that is on the board. 

 

(conspiracy theory, BR probably privately convinced the "better" players that they should not sign a new contract, or that it certainly didn't matter, because they were all destined for bigger and better than little shitty Leicester, and when BR deservedly got his promotion, he would "look after" said players. And lo and behold, look at Spurs and apparently he should get the job because he can bring YT and JM with him because he is the "key" (why spurs would want any of the 3,let alone all 3 is on a par with us taking southamptons 9-0 defence as our future! I look forward to their decimation, especially as recruitment is being touted as what is needed for them) 

 

 

[The Horse's Mouth]

Rodgers has never been good in Europe so I’d save your breathe tbh 

[Mark_w]

This one hurts less than any other for me. Has been on the cards long enough that we could resign ourselves to it early. If we had stayed up next season would have been absolutely miserable. Got an incredible ten years to reflect on. And sort of excited to ditch the fans who were there for the Premier League and those players who were always just waiting for their next move. Depending on managerial appointment and recruitment next season could be a lot more fun than it ever would have been if we’d stayed up.

[oundlefox]

Too many of our standout players saw their form go completely AWOL while our investment was shocking when you look how bang average the likes of Daka, Soumare, Faes, Kristiansen and Souttar have been. 

[Fox92]

This relegation hurts the most for me, in my time, because of what we've done. I can accept going up and down in the past but we've won two major trophies, played in Europe and invested in infastructure so, although I obviously did think we'd get relegated one day, I didn't think relegation would be so quick.

[FoxyJim1987]

After winning the league and F.A Cup we've basically completed football as Jay from the Inbetweeners would say. Who cares if we go down and slum it for a bit, like a poster said, it would probably be more fun than staying up and massively struggling again. We need to start again as a club. At least those memories will never go away.

[Chelmofox]

31 minutes ago, Fox92 said:

This relegation hurts the most for me, in my time, because of what we've done. I can accept going up and down in the past but we've won two major trophies, played in Europe and invested in infastructure so, although I obviously did think we'd get relegated one day, I didn't think relegation would be so quick.

For me, the recent success has been astonishing (i still pinch myself that we got to chat to Brendan before drawing to Roma at home a year ago), but the part that hurts for me most is the manner in which we have gone down. Starting from preseason when it was clear something for wrong, it just feels the majority of the club and the players just gave up.  It feels very few people have been able to put anything on the line to try and make a difference. There is an apathy where pretty much everyone behaves like they will be alright no matter what, and our collection of internationals know they will get their next top tier move regardless what happens. Those involved with making it work on the pitch had very little interested in protecting any legacy. 

Edited 19 May 2023 by Chelmofox

[Thebluefox85]

This has been coming for the last 2 years you cannot keep selling your best players and replacing them with utter shite buying defenders from teams we put 9 goals past! Backroom staff that have proven to do well at the club and then been replaced by incompetent idiots! And a board that refuse to take control of the club! And get rid of a manager that should of gone 12months ago  The whole clubs a mess this isn’t a surprise when you really look into the club 

[Pliskin]

Relegation doesn’t sit well with me at all. This situation we’re in is completely ludicrous. It’s completely self inflicted but it definitely coincides with the tragic passing of Vichai. Since then the club has been on a steady decline, but a half decent transfer window could have been stabilised the situation and prevented this.  
 

The rate in which we have regressed is the most frightening aspect. It’s like sending a child to the shop with £5 and asking them to return with bread and milk…. They end up returning with an original game boy, with no buttons and no games, and on top of that they’re now in debt because they couldn’t afford it so the seller has allowed payments in instalments, and the final issue is they’ve agreed to pay over £1000 for it, and have been completely mugged off. 
 

This is going to take some planning to rectify, and I wouldn’t be surprised if the board haven’t even discussed the championship yet. 
 

For me personally there’s absolutely nothing to be excited about if we go down. I hate this sentiment of getting rid of “plastic fans”, I’ve seen people come and go over the years and it’s never bothered me. 
 

We will have to sell any half decent player either because we need the money or their wages will be too high, but that’s pretty much the whole squad. 
 

I wouldn’t want Smith to stay, I’d want a forward thinking manager. So we would ideally need a new manager, and probably need to sign an entire new squad which will be tough, especially with how slow we move in the window. 
 

I wouldn’t mind so much if I knew we would actually get it right and sign the right players with an eye to the future to develop and come up straight away, because the championship is ****ing shit, the standard of football goes from decent to absolutely honking…. I’d want us to basically be Fulham and Burnley, and absolutely piss it. The most likely outcome is we will just be feeling sorry for ourselves, get it completely wrong, and end up in league one. 
 

I’ve now just accepted it’s going to happen, but there is still a chance we can get out of it more than likely at Everton’s expense, which I would love. 
 

I don’t agree with others that staying up would be the wrong thing and we would just struggle again. If we do, it might make the board realise they can’t sit with their thumbs up their arses any longer. In the PL you can take calculated risks financially, as Everton have proven, and clearly will not be punished for. But if you take a risk in the championship and get it wrong, you’re ****ed, the EFL are far more ruthless when it comes to that sort of thing, and points deductions are far more likely. We could end up in an absolute ****ing mess if we go down… and there’s no point saying “it won’t happen” because I bet no one on here actually thought we would get relegated this season, so it could well happen if we are not careful.

 

In short, my opinion is we simply have to stay up, even though it’s a bad result away from being guaranteed, because this club simply won’t get it right with the current leadership in place. We go down, we are in serious bother.  

[Tuna]

Would be more optimistic of our situation if I had more faith in the ownership, they have really let us down in the last 18 months.

 

Why would a football club that has gotten pretty well everything wrong recently get everything right now with the same management structure?

[Foxin_Mad]

I think the biggest thing the club got wrong, they have taken their eye off the ball and put too much faith in Rodgers, who was a collosal clown. 

 

Im tempted to think that Rudkin and Whealen need to go but they probably wont. 

 

This needs an action plan for what happens the moment relegation is confirmed, in fact it should already be started. There is no way on earth the 3 teams above us dont pick up at least, no chance on earth. We are done aceept it, get planning.

 

I do fear we have quite a big rot like Stoke and maybe down for a number of years. 

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

There were good times under Rodgers for sure, but even in the good times we had an incredibly soft mentality (contriving to throw away what was a safe top 4 finish twice with bizarre errors and results) - and I think that sowed the seeds for the consistent capitulation that we see now and have led us to the brink of embarrassment frankly. Imagine taking away some of the leaders - ie Kasper - from such a soft group. Who made that decision? 
 

The next manager HAS to revisit what Pearson always used to say - you need to recruit the right characters. I think not doing that has been a consistent thread, and accelerated since Rodgers influenced recruitment more and more.

[Pliskin]

5 minutes ago, Wasyls Pec Deck said:

There were good times under Rodgers for sure, but even in the good times we had an incredibly soft mentality (contriving to throw away what was a safe top 4 finish twice with bizarre errors and results) - and I think that sowed the seeds for the consistent capitulation that we see now and have led us to the brink of embarrassment frankly. Imagine taking away some of the leaders - ie Kasper - from such a soft group. Who made that decision? 
 

The next manager HAS to revisit what Pearson always used to say - you need to recruit the right characters. I think not doing that has been a consistent thread, and accelerated since Rodgers influenced recruitment more and more.

Exactly this.

 

Why Pearson gets so much respect from me wasn’t all to do with what he did for us on the pitch, but he leaves nothing to chance. There’s no winging it under Pearson, each area of the club had a specialist heading it up. From injury prevention to in game analysis, he had it covered. 
 

It’s why we were so successful, and in my opinion it’s one of the biggest reasons we went onto win the league. Because the infrastructure of the club was sound, everyone knew what they were doing. It wasn’t the team that won the league it was the entire organisation from top to bottom, that was when the club was at its peak. 
 

Claudio was the first manager to start messing with that system, and since then we’ve just made mistake after mistake and have tried but failed to recreate that structure. 
 

Pearson is a rare breed in football, I think he likes security, he likes things to be done properly… I imagine he’s the type of guy who when decorating a room will spend a week prepping for it so he knows it will be done right first time round. 
 

Like you say, it’s a model we really need to get back to. 

[Chelmofox]

1 hour ago, Pliskin said:

Relegation doesn’t sit well with me at all. This situation we’re in is completely ludicrous. It’s completely self inflicted but it definitely coincides with the tragic passing of Vichai. Since then the club has been on a steady decline, but a half decent transfer window could have been stabilised the situation and prevented this.  

 

<snip>

 

This is going to take some planning to rectify, and I wouldn’t be surprised if the board haven’t even discussed the championship yet. 
 

For me personally there’s absolutely nothing to be excited about if we go down. I hate this sentiment of getting rid of “plastic fans”, I’ve seen people come and go over the years and it’s never bothered me. 

 

<snip>
 

I don’t agree with others that staying up would be the wrong thing and we would just struggle again. If we do, it might make the board realise they can’t sit with their thumbs up their arses any longer. In the PL you can take calculated risks financially, as Everton have proven, and clearly will not be punished for. But if you take a risk in the championship and get it wrong, you’re ****ed, the EFL are far more ruthless when it comes to that sort of thing, and points deductions are far more likely. We could end up in an absolute ****ing mess if we go down… and there’s no point saying “it won’t happen” because I bet no one on here actually thought we would get relegated this season, so it could well happen if we are not careful.

 

 

Agree with all of that, and far better explained than i could ever do. I posted a 'logistics' thread because, like you, i have a horrible hunch that championship hasn't been a huge topic of discussion by the board. 

 

Like you, i think if we were to stay up the board would have seen this season as a huge 'fingers burnt' moment and would have likely taken more calculated risks and be more willing to asses what went wrong. We are not prepared for what awaits us at all in the Championship, and i am deeply concerned the quick turnaround (8 weeks until the first game) is going to catch them out horribly. 

Edited 19 May 2023 by Chelmofox

[Wasyls Pec Deck]

4 minutes ago, Pliskin said:

Exactly this.

 

Why Pearson gets so much respect from me wasn’t all to do with what he did for us on the pitch, but he leaves nothing to chance. There’s no winging it under Pearson, each area of the club had a specialist heading it up. From injury prevention to in game analysis, he had it covered. 
 

It’s why we were so successful, and in my opinion it’s one of the biggest reasons we went onto win the league. Because the infrastructure of the club was sound, everyone knew what they were doing. It wasn’t the team that won the league it was the entire organisation from top to bottom, that was when the club was at its peak. 
 

Claudio was the first manager to start messing with that system, and since then we’ve just made mistake after mistake and have tried but failed to recreate that structure. 
 

Pearson is a rare breed in football, I think he likes security, he likes things to be done properly… I imagine he’s the type of guy who when decorating a room will spend a week prepping for it so he knows it will be done right first time round. 
 

Like you say, it’s a model we really need to get back to. 

Maybe he could team up with Dion Dublin on tele - ‘Home improvement, decorating and wallpapering with Dion Dublin and Nigel Pearson’.

 

But I agree with you. The infrastructure, structure and model of the club is radically different to what it used to be. I suspect the thinking was in the right area, but application has been found wanting. The example of ignoring the data specialists in the recruitment team seems like a good example. 
 

Or is the biggest underlying factor that we lost Vichai who was holding it all together? I’m starting to see the helicopter crash to be more significant now. Vichai goes, which enables a slippery character like Rodgers/Rudkin to assert more influence and control over Top. I really would like to know who has been running the show in the last few years at board level because Rudkin was also looking after the horses and Top seems to have been more distanced. Sort of suggests a bit of a vacuum at the very top.

[AjcW]

My main frustration watching West Ham last night, is that even with the threat of relegation they never once considered ditching the European competitions.

We pretty much gave up on the conference league because BR didn't care about it, no effort whatsoever in that Roma second leg.

 

Think what the momentum of a European trophy win could have done for us going into this season!

[Foxin_Mad]

14 minutes ago, Pliskin said:

Exactly this.

 

Why Pearson gets so much respect from me wasn’t all to do with what he did for us on the pitch, but he leaves nothing to chance. There’s no winging it under Pearson, each area of the club had a specialist heading it up. From injury prevention to in game analysis, he had it covered. 
 

It’s why we were so successful, and in my opinion it’s one of the biggest reasons we went onto win the league. Because the infrastructure of the club was sound, everyone knew what they were doing. It wasn’t the team that won the league it was the entire organisation from top to bottom, that was when the club was at its peak. 
 

Claudio was the first manager to start messing with that system, and since then we’ve just made mistake after mistake and have tried but failed to recreate that structure. 
 

Pearson is a rare breed in football, I think he likes security, he likes things to be done properly… I imagine he’s the type of guy who when decorating a room will spend a week prepping for it so he knows it will be done right first time round. 
 

Like you say, it’s a model we really need to get back to. 

100% this all day long.

 

We need to get back to this structure. Its more about this than having a fancy golf course training ground, you need the mentality, the coaching, the recovery, the fitness etc etc etc. All of that has been eroded under Rodgers, it started under Raneri who believed his wasy were better, same with Rodgers. I actually think Puel did mor eplayer development than Rodgers ever did.. 

[Stadt]

22 minutes ago, AjcW said:

My main frustration watching West Ham last night, is that even with the threat of relegation they never once considered ditching the European competitions.

We pretty much gave up on the conference league because BR didn't care about it, no effort whatsoever in that Roma second leg.

 

Think what the momentum of a European trophy win could have done for us going into this season!

Post Roma defeat Maddison said they threw everything at it, we categorically didn't. They're either stupid or delusional.

[Dan LCFC]

I really do think it's a squander on another level to anything I've seen. I didn't think it were possible for us to get this bad this quickly even if I did see some red flags at the time (such as the Congerton appointment and Perez signing). I did think even if we mssed up Europe and whatnot we'd still have a decent foundation for another crack down the line.

 

I'd love to know the real value of our squad on a player by player basis from this point three years ago to now. Must be an unprecedented decline. Soyuncu, Tielemans and Ndidi - that's arguably £150mil worth of talent three years ago now barely worth a tenth of it.

 

The fact we're going down and will have to use our parachute payments up to pay off earnings against future TV money we took a loan for. Just remarkable mismanagement. This would get so much more coverage if we were a bigger club or if we were more bullish about ourselves. Unfortunately though we allowed a manager to talk the club down for ages so it became a bit of a self-fulfilling prophecy. Almost makes you wonder if that's why they kept him so long.

[Stadt]

We were joint favourites with Napoli to win the Europa League, then we failed to get out the group (after leading 2-0 against current Serie A winners Napoli) including dreadful Spartak and Legia sides. We then dropped into the Conference League where, again, we were one of the front runners. We stumbled past sides we have for superior players and budgets before going out in a whimper to Roma.

 

It'll sting if West Ham win it, especially as we're relegated. The signs were all there, the board are morons.

[AjcW]

10 minutes ago, Stadt said:

Post Roma defeat Maddison said they threw everything at it, we categorically didn't. They're either stupid or delusional.

He says that a lot