Tactics Under Maresca

[Claridge]

On 14/08/2023 at 00:21, sm1 said:

Absolutely beautiful and literally impossible to defend against. The pass from Ricky was amazing. We even cut open Liverpool several times in the first 20mins, with similar moves. The problem is we have either Ndidi or Praet at the end of them and both are poor finishers.

Reckon I have more pace than Praet and im pretty slow

[Claridge]

22 hours ago, Dames said:

At the same time we've learnt the hard way that the only loser when it comes to putting pressure on Rudkin is the club.

 

Pulling stunts like putting 2 GKs on the bench isn't going to get him what he wants. If anything its going to be used as a stick to beat him with when Rudkin decides he needs to protect his position. 

It was pathetic to be fair, good job we didn't have a few injuries. Winning is everything though and that's what they did

[Death by Football]

On 13/08/2023 at 18:42, StriderHiryu said:

 

Longer clip of the Praet chance, as I missed the initial build up because the extended highlights weren't available.

 

What a beautiful move! The way we pull the opposition out of possession to make space in behind is really great! Praet finishes badly, but he's really good in the build up for the move. Ricardo has been superb since he was put in this position, we already knew he was a good player, but he deserves major credit, because this is a Tielemans-esque sliding pass, the weight on it is perfect.

 

 

 

 

What I love about that clip is there were 5 or 6 "opportunities" to play a boring pass back to the keeper or deepest defender but we didn't pick the slow option.  Mostly possible because our midfield were actually showing for the ball which is a massive difference to last couple of seasons. 

[brookfox]

2 hours ago, Dames said:

Enzo wants 4 more players and its taken Rudkin over 2 months to sign 5. We’ll see in 2 weeks if he can do it but i’m very skeptical. Especially with so many to shift on still too.

The challenge I assume we're facing is that every single club in the world will know the position we're in. We've got multiple players, who I assume are on decent contracts, that either going out of contract in the summer or seemingly not fancied for tactical reasons; Ward, Iversen, Souttar, Praet, Ndidi, Daka, Nacho, Soumare, Castagne, Kristiansen. If any club is looking to sign one of those players would you a) pay the going rate now or b) hold your nerve till late in the window hoping to pick up a bargain or one of them on loan. Lets say you want VK, no way you'd pay £15m now as opposed to holding out for a season long loan with an option to buy for £10m.

 

We're stuck in a transfer game of cat and mouse and I imagine we'll be one of the most active clubs in the last couple of days of the window for both ins and outs. In the meantime we've got 2 weeks to get by with what we have. Good news is Enzo has hit the ground running and we're picking up points in what must be a difficult position for him.

[HighPeakFox]

2 hours ago, Claridge said:

Reckon I have more pace than Praet and im pretty slow

Of COURSE you do  

[CosbehFox]

11 hours ago, Lillehamring said:

Why don't you just suspend your venom towards him and see where we're at by christmas?  I know it's hard, but something good feels like it's happening at the club right now, the players we've brought in/are looking at feel like the players Enzo wants - maybe things aren't as bad as you believe?

 

 

Waiting to see where are at Christmas is quite a significant part why everything went wrong last season. 

[SafewayFox]

41 minutes ago, CosbehFox said:

Waiting to see where are at Christmas is quite a significant part why everything went wrong last season. 

100% this.

 

I understand for the more sympathetic Rudkin supporters (I can’t believe I typed that) are trying to differentiate the now to the past.

 

HOWEVER, the issues with our over inflated wages, prospect of losing millions more of pound of talent on a free next year is nearing more and more of a reality, it’s more than natural to be a bit concerned with our lack of movement this summer.

[Lillehamring]

11 hours ago, Dames said:

Enzo wants 4 more players and its taken Rudkin over 2 months to sign 5. We’ll see in 2 weeks if he can do it but i’m very skeptical. Especially with so many to shift on still too.
 

The manager is already pulling stunts like putting 2 gks on the bench and he’s talking a lot in the media about what he needs, whilst he’s had a great start with results is he going to be able to keep it up if he doesnt get what he wants and how long is he going to be willing to tolerate not being given what he was promised? 

I don't think the goalie thing was a 'stunt' - I think he just didn't want to have players who won't be involved on the bench, especially if he didn't plan to sub them in. At worst, putting ward and iversen on the bench might remind people they still exist!

 

And I don't think 5 signings in the window so far is unreasonable, for me i'd rather see us get in 5 players who are nailed on to start (which we have got) than 10 players that will be in and out of the team.  I think most people, at the start of the window would have been happy with - a goalie, 2 CBs, a CM, a #8 and a left winger - pretty much a RW shy of ideal, and there's still time for that - Nothing i've read or seen suggests Maresca hasn't already been given pretty much what he was promised.

[Lillehamring]

8 hours ago, CosbehFox said:

Waiting to see where are at Christmas is quite a significant part why everything went wrong last season. 

I was specifically talking about the poster, not the club, with regards to disbelieving in Rudkin's ability to rebuild this team.

[Lillehamring]

7 hours ago, SafewayFox said:

100% this.

 

I understand for the more sympathetic Rudkin supporters (I can’t believe I typed that) are trying to differentiate the now to the past.

 

HOWEVER, the issues with our over inflated wages, prospect of losing millions more of pound of talent on a free next year is nearing more and more of a reality, it’s more than natural to be a bit concerned with our lack of movement this summer.

ok, this isn't quite the discussion that we were having - my point was that rudkin-haters might benefit from waiting to see how the club does with a new manager and rebuilt squad, rather than just this endless bashing.  It's fair to say that if we're battling relegation at christmas, heads need to roll - but if we are top 6 at xmas, maybe it's equally fair to say that rudkin has got his head screwed back on again and that it's time to move on.

 

You are not obliged to do this but you might enjoy the season more if you just give it half a season and see if anything has changed....

 

 

[SafewayFox]

13 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

ok, this isn't quite the discussion that we were having - my point was that rudkin-haters might benefit from waiting to see how the club does with a new manager and rebuilt squad, rather than just this endless bashing.  It's fair to say that if we're battling relegation at christmas, heads need to roll - but if we are top 6 at xmas, maybe it's equally fair to say that rudkin has got his head screwed back on again and that it's time to move on.

 

You are not obliged to do this but you might enjoy the season more if you just give it half a season and see if anything has changed....

 

 

Or Enzo and his coaching staff have done this?

 

This bit isn’t aimed at you per se but how can Rudkin defenders on here say “we don’t know what role he does” when fans call Rudkin out for our years of neglect/poor business decisions yet in the same breath think that if we get promoted that is down to a Rudkin masterclass?

 

It can’t work both ways surely?

[Lillehamring]

6 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

Or Enzo and his coaching staff have done this?

Without a successful rebuild we won't have a team capable of pushing for promotion and the credit for rebuilding the team goes to the recruitment team (including rudkin and maresca), and it's reasonable to assume that rudkin was also involved in hiring Maresca and his coaching staff? 

 

This bit isn’t aimed at you per se but how can Rudkin defenders on here say “we don’t know what role he does” when fans call Rudkin out for our years of neglect/poor business decisions yet in the same breath think that if we get promoted that is down to a Rudkin masterclass?

I've discussed this endlesly i'm not going to start again now, suffice it to say that we really don't know what the situation was behind the  decisions we made - none of us have worked as a DOF so, no we're not in a position to assess his position, we can only hypothesise.

 

It can’t work both ways surely?

Of course it can - nobody is perfect, nobody get's it right every time in any job - bands make crap albums, directors make bad films, sportsmen have poor seasons, doctors make bad diagnoses - the club had a really bad season, even if i accept that this was due to neglect/incompetence - that doesn't mean to say that everything they do from now on must continue to be at that level - we had two good years with him and rodgers, two shit ones - whose to say that we can't have more good seasons?  If you fuched up in your job, would you hope that your boss would give you the chance to correct what you'd done wrong or just write you off?

 

This isn't necessarily about 'defending' rudkin, it's about being open-minded about what happened and accepting what is happening now.

 

[LVFox]

Nothing groundbreaking, but some average position maps from first 3 games.

 

Cov, Huddersfield and Burton from left to right.

[RumbleFox]

Riccy is genuinely world class (or could have been). Had he not had his injuries I honestly don’t think he’d look out of place at any team in the world. Probably my favourite player (not counting the GOAT obvs). Seems genuinely lovely too. 

[RumbleFox]

12 hours ago, SafewayFox said:

Or Enzo and his coaching staff have done this?

 

This bit isn’t aimed at you per se but how can Rudkin defenders on here say “we don’t know what role he does” when fans call Rudkin out for our years of neglect/poor business decisions yet in the same breath think that if we get promoted that is down to a Rudkin masterclass?

 

It can’t work both ways surely?

(By the way I actually agree with you) but to play devils advocate…… your argument could also be used in reverse. How can the Rudkin bashers blame him for all the bad things but not give him credit for winning the league/FA Cup, etc. I do agree though, he is shit and needs to go. 

[Dames]

14 hours ago, Lillehamring said:

I don't think the goalie thing was a 'stunt' - I think he just didn't want to have players who won't be involved on the bench, especially if he didn't plan to sub them in. At worst, putting ward and iversen on the bench might remind people they still exist!

 

And I don't think 5 signings in the window so far is unreasonable, for me i'd rather see us get in 5 players who are nailed on to start (which we have got) than 10 players that will be in and out of the team.  I think most people, at the start of the window would have been happy with - a goalie, 2 CBs, a CM, a #8 and a left winger - pretty much a RW shy of ideal, and there's still time for that - Nothing i've read or seen suggests Maresca hasn't already been given pretty much what he was promised.

Its a stunt. We have plenty of youth outfield players to fill positions if needed. 

[Lillehamring]

7 hours ago, Dames said:

Its a stunt. We have plenty of youth outfield players to fill positions if needed. 

I think the last two years have brain washed you!  Not everything about the club should be viewed with such suspicion and cynicism, there doesn't have to be an ulterior negative meaning to every incident.

Maresca seems to be extremely methodical, almost scientific, he talks about the game as being like chess - why then, in just his 2nd league game, would he stoop to something as juvenile and divisive as deliberately putting on a stunt, and one of such lameness it wouldn't have the slightest impact.  And in the game he used 4 subs, vardy, ndidi, albrighton and hamza - no one else, especially not from the youth team were going to be involved - it is far more likely that he just wanted the keepers to be involved in the match day squad.  There's nothing to suggest that maresca is pissed at the club and unhappy with our transfer activity - we've spent 9M more than the next highest club (coventry), almost 3 times more than the third highest club (southampton have spent) - why would he make such a silly, ineffective protest?

[lcfc sheff]

10 hours ago, RumbleFox said:

Riccy is genuinely world class (or could have been). Had he not had his injuries I honestly don’t think he’d look out of place at any team in the world. Probably my favourite player (not counting the GOAT obvs). Seems genuinely lovely too. 

He’s way too good to be playing for us but think he knows he owes us a little bit for the loyalty we’ve shown him from his injuries. Fingers crossed he stays fit and is with us a while yet 

[dynamark]

Other than a RW we have a hell of a squad which should be able to do the job this season.NOt sure we need a lot more new faces 

[Dames]

14 hours ago, Lillehamring said:

I think the last two years have brain washed you!  Not everything about the club should be viewed with such suspicion and cynicism, there doesn't have to be an ulterior negative meaning to every incident.

Maresca seems to be extremely methodical, almost scientific, he talks about the game as being like chess - why then, in just his 2nd league game, would he stoop to something as juvenile and divisive as deliberately putting on a stunt, and one of such lameness it wouldn't have the slightest impact.  And in the game he used 4 subs, vardy, ndidi, albrighton and hamza - no one else, especially not from the youth team were going to be involved - it is far more likely that he just wanted the keepers to be involved in the match day squad.  There's nothing to suggest that maresca is pissed at the club and unhappy with our transfer activity - we've spent 9M more than the next highest club (coventry), almost 3 times more than the third highest club (southampton have spent) - why would he make such a silly, ineffective protest?

I see what you're saying but I just don't buy that his thinking is wanting two keepers involved with the matchday squad he's clearly got no intention of keeping or playing. If he wasn't pulling stunts he would have involved another outfield player he doesn't intend on keeping too because the attacking options were very limited. Either way he doesn't want to keep any of the players so why on earth has he opted to include the 2 keepers he doesn't want to keep? For someone as methodical as you say, he left himself very open with that gamble if we got caught short in attacking positions. 

 

Therefore the only conclusion you can really come too is that its a stunt. Like it or not his game of chess is with the board at the minute. 

[eblair]

26 minutes ago, Dames said:

I see what you're saying but I just don't buy that his thinking is wanting two keepers involved with the matchday squad he's clearly got no intention of keeping or playing. If he wasn't pulling stunts he would have involved another outfield player he doesn't intend on keeping too because the attacking options were very limited. Either way he doesn't want to keep any of the players so why on earth has he opted to include the 2 keepers he doesn't want to keep? For someone as methodical as you say, he left himself very open with that gamble if we got caught short in attacking positions. 

 

Therefore the only conclusion you can really come too is that its a stunt. Like it or not his game of chess is with the board at the minute. 

i dont think 2 keepers on bench was a protest at all

 

we travel with 3 keepers, but no other players not in squad

 

think macteer pulled out late so either 6 on bench or put ward on there as well

[Lillehamring]

12 hours ago, Dames said:

I see what you're saying but I just don't buy that his thinking is wanting two keepers involved with the matchday squad he's clearly got no intention of keeping or playing. If he wasn't pulling stunts he would have involved another outfield player he doesn't intend on keeping too because the attacking options were very limited. Either way he doesn't want to keep any of the players so why on earth has he opted to include the 2 keepers he doesn't want to keep? For someone as methodical as you say, he left himself very open with that gamble if we got caught short in attacking positions. 

 

Therefore the only conclusion you can really come too is that its a stunt. Like it or not his game of chess is with the board at the minute. 

Can you give me one concrete piece of evidence to back up this theory?

Whilst there seems to be a lot of lingering negativity and spite from some fans towards the club - the general feeling projected outwards seems to be one of harmony and a new start.   Sure, we don't know what is happening in the inner sanctum, but until i see or hear something from a player or member of staff to suggest it's not good, i'm going to stick with believing that there is a new life swept into the club this summer.

[Dames]

7 hours ago, Lillehamring said:

Can you give me one concrete piece of evidence to back up this theory?

Whilst there seems to be a lot of lingering negativity and spite from some fans towards the club - the general feeling projected outwards seems to be one of harmony and a new start.   Sure, we don't know what is happening in the inner sanctum, but until i see or hear something from a player or member of staff to suggest it's not good, i'm going to stick with believing that there is a new life swept into the club this summer.

Its in my post. He’s picking 2 goalkeepers on the bench, neither of which he rates or wants over outfield players he neither rates or wants whilst also neglecting to fill additional spots with youth/development players. 
 

A manager only pulls antics like that in league games when there isn’t a widespread injury crisis/illness when they are trying to make a point. You dont need ‘concrete’ evidence to see that. 

[Eskay]

I think we are getting there - but I look at this with a pinch of reality.

 

We have played some a couple of really poor sides. When we come up against Southampton, Norwich, Leeds & WBA....we will need to be a lot better than we were last week. But I totally agree with Enzo's thoughts that he has only had the team for a matter of days and is having to turn a huge ship around. They have clearly prioritised plugging the leaky defending but in the next few weeks I really hope we get cohesive in attack. There has been some chopping and changing in the first 3 games....he needs to realise we don't have the depth of a Man City. 

 

I really think we need a striker too - Vardy is totally done. He had fresh legs last week and couldn't out run their defenders. I would love for him to prove me wrong....again!!! 

 

[Babylon]

On 17/08/2023 at 09:02, Dames said:

I see what you're saying but I just don't buy that his thinking is wanting two keepers involved with the matchday squad he's clearly got no intention of keeping or playing. If he wasn't pulling stunts he would have involved another outfield player he doesn't intend on keeping too because the attacking options were very limited. Either way he doesn't want to keep any of the players so why on earth has he opted to include the 2 keepers he doesn't want to keep? For someone as methodical as you say, he left himself very open with that gamble if we got caught short in attacking positions. 

 

Therefore the only conclusion you can really come too is that its a stunt. Like it or not his game of chess is with the board at the minute. 

I think @eblair is probably on the mark. Away selections are always different to home selections as you pick your squad and they travel the day before. A player pulling out last minute can mean you just make do with who is there. If it was at home, it's quite likely we'd have just used someone else.