Tactics Under Maresca

[Stevosevic]

Not too sure why people make such a big deal out of having 2 GKs.

 

You can have 9 subs now. There’s as much sense as having 2 GKs as there is having 3 strikers. You’re never going to bring on 3 strikers either. 
 

And tbh, GK is the only position you can’t just have someone fill in and see an adequate job done if needed. 
 

It’s not worth the risk when you can have 9 subs. I would understand the moaning if it was still 5 subs. 

[Lillehamring]

25 minutes ago, kyleolly said:

Yeah I get it but at times it just looks like a lack of urgency 

Because it is, that's part of the tactic. And i think it's very easy and seemingly commonplace to allow this element of the game to overwhelm until all the really sexy football we play is forgotten.  It would help if some of the great moves we have made in these games ended in goals, the focus would fall much more on the exciting moments that the pedestrian moments enable.

[Lillehamring]

20 minutes ago, Beachyboy said:

After the window closes you sit them down (if they don't go) and say are we going  to get you playing for the first team? If there's no positive response to that, I'd say or shall we get you training with the youth team?

Sure, so not playing them isn't necessarily cutting your nose off to spite your face.

[Lillehamring]

14 minutes ago, kyleolly said:

Vardy came off vs cov 

My bad - but it doesn't change the point though, it was a substitution that worked.

[Lillehamring]

12 minutes ago, RowlattsFox said:

I already feel like there are vultures just waiting for a defeat to stick the boot in. 

 

 

They aren't even waiting for the defeat....

[Lillehamring]

15 minutes ago, AjcW said:

Might just be me seeing things. But when Vardy came on, Ricardo was told to stay as a right back predominantly as Cardiff were in the ascendency. 
 

It’s subtle but to me that at least looked like awareness of Faes being total shit and needing support. 

But when the opponents are in the ascendency or, more simply, attacking us, Ricardo, by the very nature of the system, reverts back to RB - I don't think it was anything special, that's just the way it works....

[Beachyboy]

3 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

Sure, so not playing them isn't necessarily cutting your nose off to spite your face.

Not now it isn't as they may get transfered out, the club doesn't want to risk injuries to them if they are going. When the window closes, it's clear who our squad is for 4 months. It's a different conversation with the players to ascertain the attitude of the players, as ability isn't in question for some as they are internationals.

[fkas]

9 minutes ago, kyleolly said:

Yeah and Ricardo started at Rb and should stay there and not go into centre mid that was my original point do we need 3 centre backs I’d rather play a back four with the full backs bombing on and the wingers coming inside abit more to fill the void left in the middle of the attacking 3rd but hopefully Casadei will do that in time I suppose it’s nice that we can have these type of tactical discussions

 

So you want us to go back to playing Rogers tactics?

 

Maresca is 4 wins from 4 so far. He can play all the hybrid positions he wants if we keep winning. The more he shapes the squad and the longer we play the system the more profecent we'll get at it.

[kyleolly]

5 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

Because it is, that's part of the tactic. And i think it's very easy and seemingly commonplace to allow this element of the game to overwhelm until all the really sexy football we play is forgotten.  It would help if some of the great moves we have made in these games ended in goals, the focus would fall much more on the exciting moments that the pedestrian moments enable.

Very true suppose it’s just a frustration that when it clicked it’s not resulted in goals if nachos shot had have gone in off the post and we’d have got the pen and scored it we’d have steam rolled them and I wouldn’t be bothered about a seemingly stagnant second half period

[Lillehamring]

7 minutes ago, Stevosevic said:

Not too sure why people make such a big deal out of having 2 GKs.

 

You can have 9 subs now. There’s as much sense as having 2 GKs as there is having 3 strikers. You’re never going to bring on 3 strikers either. 
 

And tbh, GK is the only position you can’t just have someone fill in and see an adequate job done if needed. 
 

It’s not worth the risk when you can have 9 subs. I would understand the moaning if it was still 5 subs. 

Well the debate originally started because of the suggestion that Maresca was lining up with two keepers purely as part of a battle he's having with the board, some kind of elaborate stunt to show how frustrated he is with the clubs lack of transfer activity and so on.  

[HankMarvin]

11 minutes ago, Stevosevic said:

Not too sure why people make such a big deal out of having 2 GKs.

 

You can have 9 subs now. There’s as much sense as having 2 GKs as there is having 3 strikers. You’re never going to bring on 3 strikers either. 
 

And tbh, GK is the only position you can’t just have someone fill in and see an adequate job done if needed. 
 

It’s not worth the risk when you can have 9 subs. I would understand the moaning if it was still 5 subs. 

Other positions are more versatile, and a gk is limited to being a gk

[Lillehamring]

2 minutes ago, Beachyboy said:

Not now it isn't as they may get transfered out, the club doesn't want to risk injuries to them if they are going. When the window closes, it's clear who our squad is for 4 months. It's a different conversation with the players to ascertain the attitude of the players, as ability isn't in question for some as they are internationals.

I think one of us has forgotten what you're original point was, we seem to be arguing on the same side now? 

[ARM1968]

1 minute ago, Lillehamring said:

Well the debate originally started because of the suggestion that Maresca was lining up with two keepers purely as part of a battle he's having with the board, some kind of elaborate stunt to show how frustrated he is with the clubs lack of transfer activity and so on.  

Bit early to be getting annoyed I’d say. He must have known the position. It’s not easy shipping out crap for good money. 

[Lillehamring]

2 minutes ago, kyleolly said:

Very true suppose it’s just a frustration that when it clicked it’s not resulted in goals if nachos shot had have gone in off the post and we’d have got the pen and scored it we’d have steam rolled them and I wouldn’t be bothered about a seemingly stagnant second half period

Exactly - look at some of those clips posted after the previous games, some wonderful fast attacking football that finished with, for example, praet blowing a 1on1 - end product and inconsistent ball recovery are the two real issues for maresca right now - hopefully Casadei can make a huge dent in both.

[Stevosevic]

1 minute ago, HankMarvin said:

Other positions are more versatile, and a gk is limited to being a gk

But you’ve still got 7 players to play with for those other positions and you still can’t use them all. 
 

A GK is limited to being a GK but you’re pretty screwed if you have to end up putting an outfield player in goal. Yes it’s rare, but it does happen. 
 

9 subs basically means this never has to be a possibility and you’ve still got more options than you need for outfield. 
 

7 subs to cover 10 positions, of which many players can play more than 1, is plenty. 

[Lillehamring]

2 minutes ago, ARM1968 said:

Bit early to be getting annoyed I’d say. He must have known the position. It’s not easy shipping out crap for good money. 

You'd think, but others, i'm sure in good faith, are convinced otherwise.

[Beachyboy]

3 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

I think one of us has forgotten what you're original point was, we seem to be arguing on the same side now? 

My exact words were if after the window closes and the players don't get sold, not selecting them is cutting off your nose to spite your face. Right now we are in limbo, I'm talking about a hypothetical situation in September where the players haven't been sold. That's the managers job to say the right words to motivate the players to want to play, as the alternative is training with the kids for 4 months. I think Castagne goes somewhere but Daka doesn't. We may aswell use him, if he's here, I don't see us getting any sensible offers for him.

Edited 19 August 2023 by Beachyboy

[Lillehamring]

1 minute ago, Stevosevic said:

But you’ve still got 7 players to play with for those other positions and you still can’t use them all. 
 

A GK is limited to being a GK but you’re pretty screwed if you have to end up putting an outfield player in goal. Yes it’s rare, but it does happen. 
 

9 subs basically means this never has to be a possibility and you’ve still got more options than you need for outfield. 
 

7 subs to cover 10 positions, of which many players can play more than 1, is plenty. 

Exactly, and as i posted previously Maresca has been limited and specific with the players he has brought on (vardy x 2, hamza x 2, albrighton x 2, Nacho, Praet & casadei) - in the most part, mature, experienced and arguably of a calibre above this level.

[kyleolly]

8 minutes ago, fkas said:

 

So you want us to go back to playing Rogers tactics?

 

Maresca is 4 wins from 4 so far. He can play all the hybrid positions he wants if we keep winning. The more he shapes the squad and the longer we play the system the more profecent we'll get at it.

Not at all part of the 2nd half reminded me of the Rogers era with a lack of creativity and ideas in the final 3rd 

[Aleksz]

29 minutes ago, RowlattsFox said:

I already feel like there are vultures just waiting for a defeat to stick the boot in. 

 

 

1000%.

 

This thread will be absolutely invaded after the first loss, or when Hermansen inevitably gets caught in possession 10 yards inside his own half.

[Beachyboy]

Just now, kyleolly said:

Not at all part of the 2nd half reminded me of the Rogers era with a lack of creativity and ideas in the final 3rd 

If we have a lack of attacking options and the opposition defend well, I won't be suprised to see more similarities to Rogers era. What's markedly different is the weak mentality. I believed we'd nick a winner from somewhere today. The last 12 months I always felt we were going to throw away a lead, an on about 15 occasions we did.

[Lillehamring]

3 minutes ago, Beachyboy said:

My exact words were if after the window closes and the players don't get sold, not selecting them is cutting off your nose to spite your face. Right now we are in limbo, I'm talking about a hypothetical situation in September where the players haven't been sold. That's the managers job to say the right words to motivate the players to want to play, as the alternative is training with the kids for 4 months. I think Castagne goes somewhere but Daka doesn't. We may aswell use him, if he's here, I don't see us getting any sensible offers for him.

Sure. I mean, let's hope they are all sold, but i don't see Maresca acting like Rodgers, i think he'll use anyone he feels can offer something and who will give 100%.  But he does seem to already be limiting the amount of changes and players he uses - 7 players have played all three (no doubt it would have been 8 if Mads wasn't injured), and three others have been involved in all 3 games - i know it's early but, considering how little time he's had with the squad, i feel sure that he is comfortable with what his best XI is.

[Lillehamring]

4 minutes ago, kyleolly said:

Not at all part of the 2nd half reminded me of the Rogers era with a lack of creativity and ideas in the final 3rd 

I think the 'lack of creativity' thing is a myth - only southampton, norwich and watford have managed more shots than us, and only southampton, hull and norwich have score more goals than us.  Despite playing teams that have been happy to sit and defend and counter.

[Beachyboy]

Just now, Lillehamring said:

Sure. I mean, let's hope they are all sold, but i don't see Maresca acting like Rodgers, i think he'll use anyone he feels can offer something and who will give 100%.  But he does seem to already be limiting the amount of changes and players he uses - 7 players have played all three (no doubt it would have been 8 if Mads wasn't injured), and three others have been involved in all 3 games - i know it's early but, considering how little time he's had with the squad, i feel sure that he is comfortable with what his best XI is.

To think that Liverpool friendly so many questions about the lineup and what it would be for me when everyone is fit. 

 

Mads

Ricky coady Faes Doyle

Casedai Winks KDH

? Nacho Madividi

 

He knows what he's doing, but doesn't have that reputation that Rogers had as a head coach yet. He definitely won't be throwing his toys out the pram.

[smudger63]

17 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

Well the debate originally started because of the suggestion that Maresca was lining up with two keepers purely as part of a battle he's having with the board, some kind of elaborate stunt to show how frustrated he is with the clubs lack of transfer activity and so on.  

I tend to think it's more Maresca sending a message to those players and their agents that they don't have a future under him, and they best sort themselves a move out pronto, rather than any kind of beef he has with the board.