Tactics Under Maresca

[StriderHiryu]

7 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

I felt today that once we were 1-0 up and with rotherham not looking like they wanted to concede more, we seemed to play very casually - not in a sloppy sense, but in the sense of 'we've got this, let's just play the game out' - which, right now, we simply aren't good enough to do.

 

And to an extent i can see why they play that way but, as with the cardiff equaliser, it was that one poor pass that set the ball rolling.  

 

Whilst i don't think they'll change this approach, i do think they'll get better at playing themselves out of trouble and not playing those careless costly passes.

I agree with you, I think that's been the disappointment in both games. We've got a goal pretty early on in both games. That means that they can't just sit back and defend, the game should be ours for the taking, and we should put it to bed. Instead, we've let the opposition back in both times.  But to keep sounding like a broken record:

 

• First 10 games were always going to be rough given player and staff turnover, plus pathetic Asia preseason tour.
• Transfer Window doesn't close till September 1st so we can't 100% sure who is staying until that shuts.
• It will always time to implement a new style of play.
• We will be seen as the major scalp in the division so everyone will raise their game and dig-on against us.

 

I was expecting our season to be a bit more like the start Leeds have made, and seeing a complete meltdown on our forums, before course correcting after about a quarter of the way in.

 

I will say though that we have gotten away with a fair bit, so when the first draw or loss happens, we can't be too surprised. 12 games in is roughly 25% of the way through the Championship season, so I think a more in-depth critique around then is more relevant.

 

[Dames]

Can someone explain to me the tactical advantage of completely dropping a scorer from last weeks game in favour of a goalkeeper he has no intention of playing?

 

I like Enzo and want to keep liking him but dropping a young attacking player so he ‘has to earn minutes’ and putting unwanted players on the bench over him doesnt actually send an overly positive message and is quite counter intuitive. 

[The_77]

6 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

I'll give you the crap shooting, but our passing was generally solid, at times (not quite often enough) superb.

We completed 87% of our passes which is +7% on our average from last season, and managed 14 key passes last year we averaged 8.4 per game.

 

We weren't great today but to rely on words like 'worst' 'crap' 'awful' 'lacking' and 'horrendous', and to even begin to compare this performance with the disinterested, careless efforts of last season is wildly unfair.

Agreed. And even when we’re not playing at our best, all of the early possession has our opponents completely worn out by the end of the game. Rotherham had nothing left in the tank during the last 10-15 minutes, it’s no wonder we’re scoring late goals. 

[The_77]

2 minutes ago, Dames said:

Can someone explain to me the tactical advantage of completely dropping a scorer from last weeks game in favour of a goalkeeper he has no intention of playing?

 

I like Enzo and want to keep liking him but dropping a young attacking player so he ‘has to earn minutes’ and putting unwanted players on the bench over him doesnt actually send an overly positive message and is quite counter intuitive. 

Making that goalscorer train better over the next week, perhaps. 

[MGLCFC]

4 minutes ago, Dames said:

Can someone explain to me the tactical advantage of completely dropping a scorer from last weeks game in favour of a goalkeeper he has no intention of playing?

 

I like Enzo and want to keep liking him but dropping a young attacking player so he ‘has to earn minutes’ and putting unwanted players on the bench over him doesnt actually send an overly positive message and is quite counter intuitive. 

There were tweets suggesting he had shin splints and wasn't available. Don't know if this is accurate, however.

[Dames]

Just now, The_77 said:

Making that goalscorer train better over the next week, perhaps. 

But he delivered in an actual game. Doesn’t make sense. If the lad dropped a stinker fair enough but he played quite well and scored and he reward was to not even get a place on the bench over Danny Ward. If it were Rodgers more people would be up in arms about it. Its a very suspect decision and its not the first. It feels like the manager is looking for reasons to keep our bench weak. 
 

We keep winning but that doesn’t mean there aren’t issues.

[Dames]

Just now, MGLCFC said:

There were tweets suggesting he had shin splints and wasn't available. Don't know if this is accurate, however.

Enzo has come out and said he dropped the player because he basically hasn’t earned the right to be playing despite scoring the week before. 

[Dahnsouff]

14 hours ago, Dames said:

But he delivered in an actual game. Doesn’t make sense. If the lad dropped a stinker fair enough but he played quite well and scored and he reward was to not even get a place on the bench over Danny Ward. If it were Rodgers more people would be up in arms about it. Its a very suspect decision and its not the first. It feels like the manager is looking for reasons to keep our bench weak. 
 

We keep winning but that doesn’t mean there aren’t issues.

Best guess would be managing expectations, it’s fabulous Wanya and McAteer scored and looked useful, but you (hope?) a manager would dial down the fans, and perhaps just as importantly the players expectations. Feet on the ground, ‘you ain’t made it yet’ type message. 
 

Why Ward on the bench? Must assume every other single bipedal humanoid on  the planet was injured.

Edited 27 August 2023 by Dahnsouff

[The_77]

2 minutes ago, Dames said:

But he delivered in an actual game. Doesn’t make sense. If the lad dropped a stinker fair enough but he played quite well and scored and he reward was to not even get a place on the bench over Danny Ward. If it were Rodgers more people would be up in arms about it. Its a very suspect decision and its not the first. It feels like the manager is looking for reasons to keep our bench weak. 
 

We keep winning but that doesn’t mean there aren’t issues.

Players get left out of squads all the time for things that occur between the games and I don’t think there’s anything wrong with managers who demand high standards throughout the week. But of course, I’m only speculating on what the reason could be. We’ll see what comes out of this. 

[davieG]

56 minutes ago, Lillehamring said:

I'll give you the crap shooting, but our passing was generally solid, at times (not quite often enough) superb.

We completed 87% of our passes which is +7% on our average from last season, and managed 14 key passes last year we averaged 8.4 per game.

 

We weren't great today but to rely on words like 'worst' 'crap' 'awful' 'lacking' and 'horrendous', and to even begin to compare this performance with the disinterested, careless efforts of last season is wildly unfair.

We see what we see facts don’t show everything there was some really sloppy careless passing at crucial attacking opportunities and als putting our defence under unnecessary pressure. Of course there was some good stuff but I expect more from a highly paid and talented team. 

[lanefox]

Long reign our Italian bastard

 

Parma eat your hearts out you could've had the days on Batistuta if you trusted him

[coolhandfox]

Only us And Man City in all 4 division left with a 100% record.

[Lillehamring]

3 hours ago, Dames said:

Can someone explain to me the tactical advantage of completely dropping a scorer from last weeks game in favour of a goalkeeper he has no intention of playing?

 

I like Enzo and want to keep liking him but dropping a young attacking player so he ‘has to earn minutes’ and putting unwanted players on the bench over him doesnt actually send an overly positive message and is quite counter intuitive. 

Enzo explained it in some detail, post match, on radio leicester 

[Lillehamring]

2 hours ago, davieG said:

We see what we see facts don’t show everything there was some really sloppy careless passing at crucial attacking opportunities and als putting our defence under unnecessary pressure. Of course there was some good stuff but I expect more from a highly paid and talented team. 

Of course, but i feel like you saw stuff that really wasn't as significant as it seemed - i understand what you're getting at but you seem to have blown it out of proportion.  I'm not sure why you're so down about a performance that shows we're learning and adjusting each week, that at times featured the sort of flowing passing football that we haven't seen since we were in the top 4 of the prem.?

[davieG]

1 minute ago, Lillehamring said:

Of course, but i feel like you saw stuff that really wasn't as significant as it seemed - i understand what you're getting at but you seem to have blown it out of proportion.  I'm not sure why you're so down about a performance that shows we're learning and adjusting each week, that at times featured the sort of flowing passing football that we haven't seen since we were in the top 4 of the prem.?

So many times that flowing football ended with us giving the ball away and being counter attacked and to that the number of times we gave the ball away before we even got half way up the pitch.. I just think that irrespective of the playing the new system the passing should be much better. There were 3/4 passes that were just sloppy and not even needing to go any distance.

 

Anyway as I said we we see what we see and I was disappointed especially against such a lowly winless team.

[Lillehamring]

11 minutes ago, davieG said:

So many times that flowing football ended with us giving the ball away and being counter attacked and to that the number of times we gave the ball away before we even got half way up the pitch.. I just think that irrespective of the playing the new system the passing should be much better. There were 3/4 passes that were just sloppy and not even needing to go any distance.

 

Anyway as I said we we see what we see and I was disappointed especially against such a lowly winless team.

It wasn't that bad, besides, it's still early, most of the team have played 4 or less competitive games together, they're still getting used to each other and getting into the grove of the season.

 

It saddens me that you've watched us win 5 straight games with players that look like they're enjoying themselves, where we seem to have a definite plan and yet you feel it's just the same as last year

[StriderHiryu]

 

"We could play a little bit more for me." Not scathing but good he's not just Brendan style buttering his own bread.

 

He was beaming when asked about Kasey McAteer. That's nice to see!

[Collymore]

I think the big ones for me:

 

1. There's been numerous times we've won back possession in final third and rather than go for the jugular we've recycled the ball again through defence. This is by no means Rodgers levels but we've definitely missed some opportunities. 

 

2. We have a reoccurring theme of coming out after HT absolutely abysmal. We seem to just fade into oblivion and then pick up on about the hour. Whatever message is said at HT seems to be having a negative impact on the performance straight after the restart.

 

3. We don't seem to go for any more goals than needed. Once in the lead (yes a lot of the times it's been injury time) but we need to give a team a good spanking and I don't see that at the moment. 

 

We're top of the league though so well done Enzo but the difference in quality between Premier League and Championship has surprised me just how big it is. We'd simply be bottom of the league if we played like this in the Prem. 

 

 

 

 

Edited 26 August 2023 by Collymore

[Lillehamring]

5 minutes ago, Collymore said:

I think the big ones for me:

 

1. There's been numerous times we've won back possession in final third and rather than go for the jugular we've recycled the ball again through defence. This is by no means Rodgers levels but we've definitely missed some opportunities. 

 

2. We have a reoccurring theme of coming out after HT absolutely abysmal. We seem to just fade into oblivion and then pick up on about the hour. Whatever message is said at HT seems to be having a negative impact on the performance straight after the restart.

 

3. We don't seem to go for any more goals than needed. Once in the lead (yes a lot of the times it's been injury time) but we need to give a team a good spanking and I don't see that at the moment. 

 

We're top of the league though so well done Enzo but the difference in quality between Premier League and Championship has surprised me just how big it is. We'd simply be bottom of the league if we played like this in the Prem. 

 

 

 

 

I noted elsewhere that today, at least, we didn't seem to do anything differently between the start of the half and them scoring, in fact we only misplaced three out of 57 passes, but it felt like rotherham pressed way way harder, and put us under more pressure than at any time in the first half - the goal cam from Mads being forced out of his box and pinned almost to the goal line and just hoofing it to a rotherham player (one of the 3 misplaced passes sadly). 

 

And yet, despite not changing tactics or approach, or diminishing the quality of our passing, in that 8 minute spell rotherham conjured up 3 corners and 3 of their 10 attempts.

 

It's odd, but seems like something that can be corrected.

[Chrysalis]

1 hour ago, Lillehamring said:

I noted elsewhere that today, at least, we didn't seem to do anything differently between the start of the half and them scoring, in fact we only misplaced three out of 57 passes, but it felt like rotherham pressed way way harder, and put us under more pressure than at any time in the first half - the goal cam from Mads being forced out of his box and pinned almost to the goal line and just hoofing it to a rotherham player (one of the 3 misplaced passes sadly). 

 

And yet, despite not changing tactics or approach, or diminishing the quality of our passing, in that 8 minute spell rotherham conjured up 3 corners and 3 of their 10 attempts.

 

It's odd, but seems like something that can be corrected.

If you talking about the second half up until they scored.

 

The differences I observed.

 

1 - we didnt win back possession well, probably our worst game of the season for it.  Winning ball back quickly is probably more important than passing accuracy.

2 - when we had the ball we lacked urgency going forward, the point collymore made on sitting back on a one goal lead.

 

The fall off started right after we scored, just gradually getting worse until they scored.  So half time wasnt the trigger for me, but I do agree with collymore that we have yet to come out at HT firing on all cylinders.

 

When they scored we clearly upped our game, and of course got a second goal.

 

Once we got second goal however we played much better vs after scoring our first goal and were more urgent on winning it back and keeping the ball moving with pace, which made the end of the game relatively comfortable for us.

[Drink Water]

5 minutes ago, Chrysalis said:

Once we got second goal however we played much better vs after scoring our first goal and were more urgent on winning it back and keeping the ball moving with pace, which made the end of the game relatively comfortable for us.

I noticed this too, surprisingly much more fluid and energetic after the second goal. I do think Casadei was a big component in this, Justin too with his pace. 

[Dan LCFC]

We remind me almost a bit of France under Deschamps. Blatantly better than the opposition but play quite within themselves, however will generally get the job done.

[davieG]

9 hours ago, Lillehamring said:

It wasn't that bad, besides, it's still early, most of the team have played 4 or less competitive games together, they're still getting used to each other and getting into the grove of the season.

 

It saddens me that you've watched us win 5 straight games with players that look like they're enjoying themselves, where we seem to have a definite plan and yet you feel it's just the same as last year

I don't think overall it's the same as last year it's just the bad passing which was a major symptom of our downfall last season is still with us otherwise I'm very happy with the way were going. Competent passing it's not something Enzo can do about it's down to individual players concentration and awareness etc.

[st albans fox]

It’s likely that teams come out for the second period refreshed and able to press us better 

but after fifteen/twenty minutes their legs have gone again 

 

I’m not sure that enzo will change our approach because that may make our last twenty five minutes less effective - that’s when their lack of fitness will be most telling. If we go toe to toe for that first spell of the second half then it potentially changes our dynamics for the decisive period of a close game score wise.  Would be nice to see us two goals up in a second half. 

 

[BenTheFox]

2 hours ago, Dan LCFC said:

We remind me almost a bit of France under Deschamps. Blatantly better than the opposition but play quite within themselves, however will generally get the job done.

They often scrap past poor teans but do well against sides that are closer to their level. I hope that's the case with us too.