UniFox21 Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March The next thing is club owned networks between leagues. The City group, Chelsea, Man Utd etc all utilising ownership models should be one of the next things to be focused upon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UniFox21 Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 25 minutes ago, The Bear said: A similar thing happened to us when we finished 7th in our first season back in the PL under Nuno. We played in the Europa League the following season and EUFA punished us for failing their version of FFP. Thankfully we only got fined €200k and limited to 23 players instead of 25 in future European campaigns. Basically we flew too close to the sun too quickly and got slapped down for it. I imagine Villa will be very close this year. I expect Newcastle are struggling too. As we've seen, the system doesn't allow smaller clubs to progress at any rate. And by the time any off the pitch infrastructure is at a level to allow them to compete, their opportunity is likely gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st albans fox Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 6 minutes ago, MPH said: Well they peddled the idea at the time that Top had fallen in love with football after watching his first live game which happened to be our League cup win in the replay... It's all something i found hard to believe at the time.. Top (and his father) attended way more games than would have been the case if they weren’t in love with the club we can’t know what their motivations really were at the outset but clearly they care(d) immensely 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelmofox Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 4 minutes ago, MPH said: Well they peddled the idea at the time that Top had fallen in love with football after watching his first live game which happened to be our League cup win in the replay... It's all something i found hard to believe at the time.. Just Marketing BS. There is no difference between KP ownership or any other multi billion $ business. When everything goes well we live in this Symbiotic relationship where we can brush that to one side. Right now, the dysfunctional side of KP ownership is very, very grating. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPH Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 1 minute ago, st albans fox said: Top (and his father) attended way more games than would have been the case if they weren’t in love with the club we can’t know what their motivations really were at the outset but clearly they care(d) immensely They definitely come across as caring people no matter what they are involved in, for sure. So even if buying Leicester City was a business decision, they take their heart with them wherever they go,.. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosbehFox Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 15 minutes ago, UniFox21 said: I imagine Villa will be very close this year. I expect Newcastle are struggling too. As we've seen, the system doesn't allow smaller clubs to progress at any rate. And by the time any off the pitch infrastructure is at a level to allow them to compete, their opportunity is likely gone. Until this dodgy Betano sponsorship 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CosbehFox Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 13 minutes ago, MPH said: They definitely come across as caring people no matter what they are involved in, for sure. So even if buying Leicester City was a business decision, they take their heart with them wherever they go,.. Only wish they may held the same views with democracy and their home country of Thailand 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPH Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March Just now, CosbehFox said: Only wish they may held the same views with democracy and their home country of Thailand hard to say for sure, really.... It's like in Russia... you want to own more than a slice of bread, you cant really criticize the ruling powers... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageFox73 Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March I wish the big six would just fook right off and get that super league going ! 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Barrowblue Posted 26 March Popular Post Share Posted 26 March 1 minute ago, VintageFox73 said: I wish the big six would just fook right off and get that super league going ! I prefer the big Five..... & Tottenham. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 45 minutes ago, VintageFox73 said: I wish the big six would just fook right off and get that super league going ! they'll never do that for them it's all about the PL and a more remunerative Euro Comp cutting out UEFA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 2 hours ago, Babylon said: People's anger needs to be spread around, John Rudkin does not run this football club. He answers to the board and Top and there are others there who have their hand on the finances more than he. They could have, at any point, put a stop to it by saying NO. No to that signing, no to that contract, no, we can't overspend by £100m a season. This isn't one persons doing, our game plan would have been accepted and approved by all the senior management and the owners. Jon Rudkin is likely to be in charge of negotiations for incomings, negotiations for outgoings and the financial obligations for wages for signings and concessions for outgoings. The finance department will work every year with the football side of the operations to set out the budget but there will be many moving parts for arriving at the bottom line, which for a football club tends to be ensuring the maximum loss isn't breached. What is interesting is what was forecast in recent years for outgoings because we've been the utter pits at moving players on. If Rudkin and Co managed to put forward the case that £100m would be generated in the year for the likes of Soyuncu, Tielemans, Praet and Maddison etc and we got nowhere near that then suddenly the budget is blown apart. The wage structure tends to be pretty fixed in any given year in whats likely to be incurred and maximum bonuses forecasted and he'd not have been solely responsible for ensuring every player was on an average of 95k a week for example, but the structure itself will have been developed over a few years with a total amount allowable and then would be down to negotiations and sign off by the footballing operations area rather than finance as long as it all came in under that. A strong negotiator or strategist would have an eye on the bigger picture which we were hurtling towards. It's hard to make a case for him being in the dark about the financial situation after the summer of 2022 and then just a few months later heading up the area that will have been trying to give Leeds £20m for Jack Harrison and in excess of £100k a week. Sometimes people get caught in the cross fire and might be the fall guy, it's pretty understandable as to why the spotlight is heavily on him. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March (edited) 10 minutes ago, Ric Flair said: Jon Rudkin is likely to be in charge of negotiations for incomings, negotiations for outgoings and the financial obligations for wages for signings and concessions for outgoings. The finance department will work every year with the football side of the operations to set out the budget but there will be many moving parts for arriving at the bottom line, which for a football club tends to be ensuring the maximum loss isn't breached. What is interesting is what was forecast in recent years for outgoings because we've been the utter pits at moving players on. If Rudkin and Co managed to put forward the case that £100m would be generated in the year for the likes of Soyuncu, Tielemans, Praet and Maddison etc and we got nowhere near that then suddenly the budget is blown apart. The wage structure tends to be pretty fixed in any given year in whats likely to be incurred and maximum bonuses forecasted and he'd not have been solely responsible for ensuring every player was on an average of 95k a week for example, but the structure itself will have been developed over a few years with a total amount allowable and then would be down to negotiations and sign off by the footballing operations area rather than finance as long as it all came in under that. A strong negotiator or strategist would have an eye on the bigger picture which we were hurtling towards. It's hard to make a case for him being in the dark about the financial situation after the summer of 2022 and then just a few months later heading up the area that will have been trying to give Leeds £20m for Jack Harrison and in excess of £100k a week. Sometimes people get caught in the cross fire and might be the fall guy, it's pretty understandable as to why the spotlight is heavily on him. And if that were the case, and he failed to sell x y and z, they would or should have said we need to sell a different asset. Be it Barnes or anyone else remotely actually desirable that would garner interest. Or if year on year they believe that to be HIS fault, he should have been removed. Or perhaps they shouldn't have approved £50m worth of players in the championship. Edited 26 March by Babylon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 10 minutes ago, Babylon said: And if that were the case, and he failed to sell x y and z, they would or should have said we need to sell a different asset. Be it Barnes or anyone else remotely actually desirable that would garner interest. Or if year on year they believe that to be HIS fault, he should have been removed. Or perhaps they shouldn't have approved £50m worth of players in the championship. This is it, nobody has been removed from their post. Simon Capper resigned to go to Newcastle but other than that there's been little change at director or board level to suggest the club think catastrophic mistakes have been made. The internal review after relegation and at that point the financial implications must have formed part of that and once again it was business as usual. Concerning more than comforting that is. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StanSP Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 1 hour ago, VintageFox73 said: I wish the big six would just fook right off and get that super league going ! The super league wouldn't actually have meant they leave the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terraloon Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March (edited) 1 hour ago, UniFox21 said: The next thing is club owned networks between leagues. The City group, Chelsea, Man Utd etc all utilising ownership models should be one of the next things to be focused upon. Multi club ownership isn’t just applicable to the ones you mention. Brighton, Villa , Palace and indeed Leicester are in that number Edited 26 March by Terraloon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
urban.spaceman Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 1 hour ago, Barrowblue said: I prefer the big Five..... & Tottenham. We could ask the mods to autocorrect it like when you write “willy puller” 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 2 hours ago, CosbehFox said: June 2018. International TV rights - big six argue they should have a greater share and follow the pattern of domestic rights because it's the popularity of the big six that in effect accounts for how large the TV deal is. Leicester City on 7th June 2018 sided with the big clubs on a ratio based system rather than an equal split = part of the 14 PL clubs required to vote through such a change. Funny how this has been left well alone by certain posters in this thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClaphamFox Posted 26 March Author Share Posted 26 March 2 minutes ago, StanSP said: The super league wouldn't actually have meant they leave the league. They wanted to participate in a closed shop ESL worth hundreds of millions of pounds of extra revenue while simultaneously being allowed to use that massive income injection to dominate the PL, while the rest of the PL would have to get by on a fraction of the money under strict PSR rules and without any possibility of promotion to the ESL Unsurprisingly, this didn't go down well. Competing in a closed shop ESL is clearly completely incompatible with continued participation in the PL, so if they really want the former they'll have to give up the latter. But something tells me their fans might have something to say about the prospect of giving up domestic football... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 11 minutes ago, Ric Flair said: This is it, nobody has been removed from their post. Simon Capper resigned to go to Newcastle but other than that there's been little change at director or board level to suggest the club think catastrophic mistakes have been made. The internal review after relegation and at that point the financial implications must have formed part of that and once again it was business as usual. Concerning more than comforting that is. Indeed, which makes you think they also believe it's a collective issue rather than just Rudkin. I've tried to point out, that there has been a whole raft of issues. Some man-made, some not, and that has all piled up to create the situation we are in. You can't just point to X and say that caused it. People try to simplify it here too much. From the club loading us with debt to build the training ground, more debt to expand the stadium. Injuries to key assets (some awful luck, some I still think are down to Rodgers). Covid. Given too much power to Rodgers (somewhat understandable considering how good we were for a large chuck of time). Yeah there is some real tangible stuff like sticking with Rodgers roo long, but even that is fraught with issues... did that sacking and then relegation push over FFP? You can list 100 things. Problem x, caused problem y, impacting problem z, and so on. And we'll never know, who did, or said what. So, that's why I just go for collective blame and trust that if someone was indeed failing spectacularly individually, they would just be removed, just like they do with poor managers. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st albans fox Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 20 minutes ago, Ric Flair said: Funny how this has been left well alone by certain posters in this thread. I don’t know the detail of this but assume that the international revenue is distributed on a sliding scale with those finishing higher up receiving a bigger proportion rather than just the rich six having a bigger lump than the other 14 ? I can appreciate why we thought that was in our interest as we sought to drive the gap between us and other similar sized clubs (eg palace) even wider Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filbertway Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 2 minutes ago, st albans fox said: I don’t know the detail of this but assume that the international revenue is distributed on a sliding scale with those finishing higher up receiving a bigger proportion rather than just the rich six having a bigger lump than the other 14 ? I can appreciate why we thought that was in our interest as we sought to drive the gap between us and other similar sized clubs (eg palace) even wider Which should weaken our hand when we're trying to claim that we are paragon's of virtue. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sol thewall Bamba Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 6 minutes ago, st albans fox said: similar sized clubs (eg palace) About spat my drink out at that 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
st albans fox Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March 2 minutes ago, Sol thewall Bamba said: About spat my drink out at that Revenue streams from fanbase and sponsorship must be fairly similar ???. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spudulike Posted 26 March Share Posted 26 March So Simon Jordan thinks the regulations are a blunt instrument that need to be changed but says that LCFC should be hit with it ... and he's already decided we are guilty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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