Election prediction time

[Benguin]

14 minutes ago, RobHawk said:

Are you an ostrich?

Your head must be in the sand. Is your head in the sand? Are you flexible enough to get your head in the sand? My suspicion would be no.

[Sampson]

 

[Raj]

Penny M literally chucked Rishi under the bus when going on about him leaving the DDay early.

Never said a "BUT" it was full on attack which suggests she will be going for the leadership when they get trashed.

But  now the Tories are full on right wing I wouldnt put it passed them to get Farage back in the team if he does well in Clacton.

Hes a great debater  and has the personality  like BoJo, both talk bo11ox but it's just the Tory way after the last few bland "leaders" they have had.

[ozleicester]

2 hours ago, Sampson said:

This was the best answer of the night for me

 

 

dunno who this is... but good points well made

[fox_up_north]

Can't help but notice I've only seen a Tory leaflet and campaigning so far in my seat - High Peak - and he only won by about 400 physical votes last time

[BenTheFox]

I've only had a Lib Dem leaflet through my door. 

[Raj]

2 hours ago, Sampson said:

This was the best answer of the night for me

 

 

Spoke really well last night.

Definitely  champions league alot if not fighting for the title yesterday.

 

Thing with all these MP,s promises, even though the country is bust, all of a sudden they are finding billions from behind the sofa.

When challenged about the costing, yeah it's all costed dont worry, a few tweaks here and there and its sorted!!

Bunch of crooks

 

[Sampson]

 

 

[urban.spaceman]

OK.

 

 

I'm now at the "Sunderland Away" stage where Vardy scores a second in the last minute and Ranieri is trying not to cry.

 

THIS. IS. HAPPENING.

 

[BenTheFox]

3 hours ago, Sampson said:

This was the best answer of the night for me

 

 

I just love him 

[leicsmac]

7 minutes ago, Sampson said:

 

 

It would be hilarious if viewpoints like this didn't then get enough traction to affect policymaking.

 

5 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

OK.

 

 

I'm now at the "Sunderland Away" stage where Vardy scores a second in the last minute and Ranieri is trying not to cry.

 

THIS. IS. HAPPENING.

 

It's nice to see, but the last thing the future needs is something worse stepping into the void the Tories leave.

[kingkisnorbo]

Personally find it very troubling regarding Reform’s ascendancy. It shouldn’t be treated as a ‘win’ just because it further dissolves the Conservative’s. Hurtling quite fast towards a very right wing opposition.

[BeardyFox]

46 minutes ago, Sampson said:

 

 

I’ve had a worrying amount of similar conversations with people recently.

[Izzy]

18 hours ago, Paninistickers said:

Our elite political brains have all but evaporated. 

 

Random names of the recent (ish) past; Cameron, Duncan Smith and Miliband are still around. Beyond that; 

 

Clegg, George Alexander and David Laws... Brown & Balls, Mandelson , Burnham....Hague, Grieve, Rory Stewart, Gove....even Theresa May

 

 All still young enough to positively contribute yet hounded out of politics in many cases. 

 

I’m out of touch with the current crop of politicians but do enjoy listening to Alastair Campbell and Rory Stewart on ‘The rest is politics’ podcast.

 

Two people with different opinions and beliefs yet they debate like adults and clearly still have something to offer.

 

Sometimes I wish we didn’t have political parties at all and instead just had the best and most qualified people in parliament regardless of political persuasion. 
 

You’d like to think this country had enough talent from across the whole political spectrum to come together and all work for the greater good.
 

Imagine the very best politicians from all parties collaborating and doing great shit together. 

 

I’m talking nonsense I know.

 

Edited 8 June by Izzy

[urban.spaceman]

4 hours ago, Sampson said:

This was the best answer of the night for me

 

 

Flynn and the SNP are in quite a fortunate position because Scotland rejected Brexit AND very few people outside of Scotland know about the SNP’s record or potential criminal activity. 
 

Labour have been between a rock and a hard place since Corbyn’s disastrous leadership. 2019 was such a bruising defeat that it should have taken a decade or more to come back and be electable again. It was a Brexit election and Labour absolutely cannot afford to make this one about it too especially when literally everything else is broken.

 

They’ve also had the situation where every single time they announce a policy or plan or anything with a costed number against it, the Tories have either nicked it and used it for something else (non-doms) or otherwise made it unaffordable or difficult to achieve (28bn Green plan).

 

That’s why Starmer has been talking about a ‘decade of national renewal’ without giving too much away. Hold the line until an election is called then drop the manifesto with a clear plan of fixing things over at least two parliaments. They have to fix as much as they can in the first parliament before they can start talking about rejoining anything.

 

I’m not sure whether Farage getting a seat would be a blessing in disguise or not. Knowing him he wouldn’t turn up much but if he did, they could keep reminding the country of what a disaster his sole policy has been. 
 

I digress. Flynn is free to point these things out and campaign on them but Labour are not. Labour HAVE to get elected and cannot risk keeping the Tories in. 

[Paninistickers]

4 hours ago, Sampson said:

This was the best answer of the night for me

 

 

Outstanding answer. 

 

More fuel to the fire that every vote away from the hideous two big parties is worth the protest. 

 

Both  just exist to govern. To 'win' a competition as if it's the apprentice or the premier league. Policy formed not being ethics or principle or intellectual theory ....but entirely by focus groups to  gain extra % in the polls. 

 

Both parties need hounding out of business. As the previous poster says, wouldn't it be nice if the best individual political brains actually governed together for the national good? 

 

 

[Sampson]

37 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

Flynn and the SNP are in quite a fortunate position because Scotland rejected Brexit AND very few people outside of Scotland know about the SNP’s record or potential criminal activity. 
 

Labour have been between a rock and a hard place since Corbyn’s disastrous leadership. 2019 was such a bruising defeat that it should have taken a decade or more to come back and be electable again. It was a Brexit election and Labour absolutely cannot afford to make this one about it too especially when literally everything else is broken.

 

They’ve also had the situation where every single time they announce a policy or plan or anything with a costed number against it, the Tories have either nicked it and used it for something else (non-doms) or otherwise made it unaffordable or difficult to achieve (28bn Green plan).

 

That’s why Starmer has been talking about a ‘decade of national renewal’ without giving too much away. Hold the line until an election is called then drop the manifesto with a clear plan of fixing things over at least two parliaments. They have to fix as much as they can in the first parliament before they can start talking about rejoining anything.

 

I’m not sure whether Farage getting a seat would be a blessing in disguise or not. Knowing him he wouldn’t turn up much but if he did, they could keep reminding the country of what a disaster his sole policy has been. 
 

I digress. Flynn is free to point these things out and campaign on them but Labour are not. Labour HAVE to get elected and cannot risk keeping the Tories in. 

I do understand the point of view and hope you’re right that Labour will drift leftwards over the years after they have power, however I’m cynical. I’m very interested in Labour’s manifesto next week, as a couple of years ago Starmer was public about rejoining the single market, giving eu citizens who are long term residents in the uk future votes and wanting higher minimum wage and take water and energy firms under public control, but has taken them from his website.
 

How much of that is them realising just how  bankrupt the country is and the hope that these are more goals for the next election I’m not sure. It does give the depressing feeling that Labour have drifted over to the right and just become another moderate centre right party though.

Edited 8 June by Sampson

[StanSP]

5 hours ago, Sampson said:

This was the best answer of the night for me

 

 

And this retort, for me... 

 

 

 

 

[Sampson]

Sunak definitely just doesn’t give a **** anymore and wants it done so he can swan off to California. He’ll be hiding in a fridge next 

[Daggers]

3 hours ago, Sampson said:

 

 

Even the little old racist can’t call replacement theory “replacement theory”, because she knows she’d be slammed for it for being a racist. 
 

Know your place, funny coloured skinned people. As long as you make her curry or Chinese you are OK, but don’t you go being Muslim. 
 

I’ve always contended we should turn the Isle of Wight into an internment camp for voters of far right parties. I now think I’ve been wrong - we should use the Falklands. 

[LiberalFox]

I feel like such thinking is far more widespread than people realise. I don't know what the way forward is. When it comes to Islamophobia I think the UK is actually less racist than mainland Europe. 

 

Yet all bigotries have their routes in common themes of xenophobia, supremacism, entitlement and anti-social tendencies. 

 

There's a tendency among liberal types to just turn everything into a matter of education. If I can discredit the reasoning behind a bigoted position then I win the argument. The thinking goes that people have been conned into believing things that aren't true and so there is this obsession with fact checking and confronting bigotry with reason. 

 

Yet I feel the driver of bigotry isn't lack of knowledge. I think many liberals know this too but pretend not to notice because they have no idea how to win an emotional argument. 

 

 

[leicsmac]

2 minutes ago, LiberalFox said:

I feel like such thinking is far more widespread than people realise. I don't know what the way forward is. When it comes to Islamophobia I think the UK is actually less racist than mainland Europe. 

 

Yet all bigotries have their routes in common themes of xenophobia, supremacism, entitlement and anti-social tendencies. 

 

There's a tendency among liberal types to just turn everything into a matter of education. If I can discredit the reasoning behind a bigoted position then I win the argument. The thinking goes that people have been conned into believing things that aren't true and so there is this obsession with fact checking and confronting bigotry with reason. 

 

Yet I feel the driver of bigotry isn't lack of knowledge. I think many liberals know this too but pretend not to notice because they have no idea how to win an emotional argument. 

 

 

It's because there is no way to win such an emotional argument if the opposition is really that zealous, not in the numbers that would be necessary anyway.

 

So you have to focus on logic and knowledge based arguments and hope like hell that's enough to keep some very dark times away.

[Paninistickers]

1 hour ago, Daggers said:

Even the little old racist can’t call replacement theory “replacement theory”, because she knows she’d be slammed for it for being a racist. 
 

Know your place, funny coloured skinned people. As long as you make her curry or Chinese you are OK, but don’t you go being Muslim. 
 

I’ve always contended we should turn the Isle of Wight into an internment camp for voters of far right parties. I now think I’ve been wrong - we should use the Falklands. 

I'm gonna take a more sympathetic view. I kinda got the tone of what she meant, but she didn't quite articulate it as someone 'educated' might. And,.of course,.she isn't a seasoned professional in front of a.camera..all of us may struggle to articulate our thoughts when put on the spot with a mic and camera

 

She's likely concerned at the pace of change. Older people always have been, it's not new. The old city working class neighbourhoods she'd have known would now be,.in some cases, 99% non white. 

 

I'd imagine that she also feels that many new immigrants don't appear to assimilate too well. It's not like they arrive with the American dream and have pot roasts and watch the superbowl. Many arrive in Europe to, pretty much, to continue to live as they were living. Like Brits in Spain. I think that's a fair argument. 

 

What she doesn't perhaps know is she was conned by Brexit. Helluva lot of brexiteers were voting for tough immigration rules. Instead, Brexit has replaced white, Christian east European immigrants on freedom.of movement rights with brown, non Christian immigration on student visas.  Which, personally, I kinda enjoy the irony. 

 

 

Edited 8 June by Paninistickers
Mic and camera

[SkidsFox]

2 hours ago, Sampson said:

I do understand the point of view and hope you’re right that Labour will drift leftwards over the years after they have power, however I’m cynical. I’m very interested in Labour’s manifesto next week, as a couple of years ago Starmer was public about rejoining the single market, giving eu citizens who are long term residents in the uk future votes and wanting higher minimum wage and take water and energy firms under public control, but has taken them from his website.
 

How much of that is them realising just how  bankrupt the country is and the hope that these are more goals for the next election I’m not sure. It does give the depressing feeling that Labour have drifted over to the right and just become another moderate centre right party though.

It is depressing that nothing much is likely to change post 5 July. Maybe more spending to bring down nhs waiting lists (which is good), but overall things won't change. Well, maybe we'll be spared the sight of our political leaders trying to blame everything on refugees in small boats, or on youngsters eating too many guacamole snacks. Maybe.

[purpleronnie]