Steve Cooper: The Tactics Thread

[Bluearmyfox28]

On 24/07/2024 at 11:33, Greg2607 said:

What happened to pre-season also being about getting minutes into people's legs? It could just be that he wanted Fatawu to get some game time.... it doesn't automatically mean he's our starting LWB. 

 

with staggered return dates etc, we still have to put out an 11 in these games. 

 

I wouldn't start to worry too much about it, or deconstruct it, until it's happening in the final pre-season game ahead of the season opener... 

Yup, Cooper literally said “what was most important, was getting all the lads out there, maybe not in their natural positions but so they could get minutes”. meltdown after one Pre season game is mental  

 

I will say though when reviewing our manager options I posted on here that Cooper likes his wingers to play inverted and that doesn’t suit Fatawu therefore wouldn’t be shocked to see him become a wingback…

 

My biggest concern was the lack of depth we had/have.

[cruzFOX]

I reserve judgement on super cooper after we’ve played a few games in the league. Manager looks like he is willing to adjust and balance to get the team ticking right. Not as rigid as Enzo in his ways it appears

[sbfox]

9 hours ago, Gamble92 said:

You could play more or less any tactics with Man City and win the league and it wouldn't be down to some amazing philosophy. 

 

To say oh it won the league and ignore the unbelievable resources at his disposal compared to the rest and put it down to the tactics is ignorant in the extreme. 

 

It was a bit like a player scoring 20 goals and winning the golden boot and saying he's the best striker you can't say anything. When in reality he's just a flat track bully who scored against all the poor teams.

 

We beat who we should have beat, because they all respected us way too much and we painfully passed them to death at the back while they all sat back and let us. Anyone who played against us quickly found us out and luckily there wasn't enough time left for it to go totally tits up. Nearly managed it though. 

Hard disagree on all of the above, but that's the great thing about opinions, right! 

[sylofox]

13 hours ago, sbfox said:

Yeah but all football can be distilled down to potentially 90 minutes of not scoring... 

Correct

And 90 minutes of boredom 

Or 90 minutes of entertainment.

[Lillehamring]

13 hours ago, Bluearmyfox28 said:

Yup, Cooper literally said “what was most important, was getting all the lads out there, maybe not in their natural positions but so they could get minutes”. meltdown after one Pre season game is mental  

 

I will say though when reviewing our manager options I posted on here that Cooper likes his wingers to play inverted and that doesn’t suit Fatawu therefore wouldn’t be shocked to see him become a wingback…

 

My biggest concern was the lack of depth we had/have.

This seems a little odd - playing that inside right position that McAteer played is basically where fatawu ended up when he was playing wide right - cutting inside onto his left foot - i can't see how it's such a different position that he would go from being great to it 'not suiting him'?

[Lillehamring]

Palermo - 1st half.

 

Well, i'm on board with Cooper trying a different system, but that just didn't work.

 

Fatawu seemed completely isolated, and mavididi was having to come inside just to get close to the play.  Ndidi as a #8 in the championship was ok, but the idea of him playing as a #10/second striker is absolute madness, he simply doesn't have the touch or range of passes for the position. Ricardo seemed to have been tasked as the FB who drops into a back 3, while justin did get forward but almost every time just turned back.

 

I think most of our chances came from turning over possession, everything we tried to create just broke down with a poor pass.

 

Positives? lots of energy, good work rate, Okoli looked much better....  But generally underwhelmed.

 

Be interesting to see what he changes for the 2nd half.

[Lillehamring]

2nd half

 

Given that palermo pretty much parked the bus, this was clearly an exercise in breaking a team down and, tactically, it's safe to say it was a failure.

 

I'm inclined to think that some of this might be due to not having the right personnel - specifically Ndidi playing so far forward - in these games you need a player in that position who can unlock a defence, Ndidi is totally not that sort of player.  My deeper concern was that he gave most players 70 minutes, which would suggest this is something like his 1st XI - and i wasn't impressed with the lack of attacking substitutions, it was crying out for going daka and cannon up front and all we get is a defensive substitution, with hamza coming on.

 

Mercifully, there won't be many games where teams park the bus against us, so hopefully we won't have to see this 'system' too often.

Edited 26 July by Lillehamring

[JimJams]

Do all the analysis you like people, but it genuinely looks like Cooper has no idea what the fxxk is going on at the minute!

 

 

[FoxTimmy2]

1 minute ago, JimJams said:

Do all the analysis you like people, but it genuinely looks like Cooper has no idea what the fxxk is going on at the minute!

 

 

Agreed. I don't even think he's set on Hermansen as our number one.

[Tazfox]

Ndidi as the CAM/closest player to the striker is not a good decision, he's not cut out for that role. 

[Fazzer 7]

I can't ever remember feeling less excited for a new season to start, frankly. 

[Lillehamring]

2 minutes ago, FoxTimmy2 said:

Agreed. I don't even think he's set on Hermansen as our number one.

probably why he went straight into the starting line-up, eh?

[Muzzy_no7]

If we are being honest it looks like a complete mess at the minute. 

[Corky]

The attack does not look strong. Dewsbury-Hall going is a blow and even a motivated, settled Iheanacho offers probably the most of any of the strikers.

 

Said in the match thread that the squad doesn't look up to this level.

[Lillehamring]

2 minutes ago, Corky said:

The attack does not look strong. Dewsbury-Hall going is a blow and even a motivated, settled Iheanacho offers probably the most of any of the strikers.

 

Said in the match thread that the squad doesn't look up to this level.

The key thing from the post match interview was (again) (i paraphrase) "we're trying some things with players until we get other players in" - so we can only hope that we'll get a creative AM and ndidi can go back to the double pivot spot.

Personally i'd rather have seen soumare there tonight. 

 

And you only use Daka in games where it's more open and end to end - in these games, he's useless - i think Cannon would have caused them more problems in those tight areas.

[Richmondfox]

7 minutes ago, Corky said:

The attack does not look strong. Dewsbury-Hall going is a blow and even a motivated, settled Iheanacho offers probably the most of any of the strikers.

 

Said in the match thread that the squad doesn't look up to this level.

Winks/CBs need a midfielder who can turn with the ball and make something happen. Ndidi isn’t skilful or creative and can only do the slot in pass for Fatawu otherwise he folds.
 

Hamza and Soumare are a liability in midfield and will make Winks’ job even harder. 

[Fox92]

We need a striker and someone creative behind. 

[davieG]

I dint realise that they're only a Series B team.

[cropstonfox]

Don't read too much into these friendlies.

It's just about getting minutes into the legs.

We all know unfortunately that individually

and collectively that this squad hasn't got a chance of competing at Premier League level.We need reinforcements .possibly  ten signings required.

[sbfox]

I need some smart to tell me exactly what system Cooper is trying to play. We just look...bad right now. 

[Sunbury Fox]

I fear that we are going to be "2023/24 Sheff U level" bad this season unless we bring in some more quality urgently. 

[coolhandfox]

10 minutes ago, Sunbury Fox said:

I fear that we are going to be "2023/24 Sheff U level" bad this season unless we bring in some more quality urgently. 

Even with the current squad we have more quality than Sheff U squad.

[ozvaldo]

Stinky Winky will guide us to the lowest premier league points total of all time, unless he’s sacked before May. 

[Lillehamring]

1 hour ago, davieG said:

I dint realise that they're only a Series B team.

To be honest, other than some rather sturdy, deep lying defending, they really didn't do anything - i don't think they were a better team going forward than shrewsbury were.

 

It feels like it was a game set up as a test to practice breaking this sort of team down - of which, as Cooper said post-game, we did half a job - we got through them, but had no end product.

[Lillehamring]

1 hour ago, cropstonfox said:

Don't read too much into these friendlies.

It's just about getting minutes into the legs.

We all know unfortunately that individually

and collectively that this squad hasn't got a chance of competing at Premier League level.We need reinforcements .possibly  ten signings required.

I think that's unfair - unless by 'competing' you mean a top half finish.

It wasn't great in the final third today, but a couple of new players in key positions should make us competitive up to mid-table.