Steve Cooper: The Tactics Thread

[kingfox]

Early initial thoughts, 3-4-1-2 when in possession surely needs tweaking. During his time at Swansea and Forest, Cooper used a number of back three systems, whether that being 3-4-1-2, 3-5-2, 3-4-2-1. 
 

Decision number one has to be getting Fatawu on the right, if Cooper wants to remain with 3-4-1-2, then he may have to consider starting Ricardo at LW/LWB or even at CM. Then potentially use Justin as a RB who comes in to join a back three. 

 

Or you tweak things slightly by going 3-4-2-1 when in possession, then use Mavididi and Fatawu as two 10’s who can drift out wide. 

Edited 23 July by kingfox

[Scotch]

I was very vocal about trying Fatawu at LWB. I would like to retract that. 

[kingfox]

Would something like this be viable 🤔 New Striker and Winger/CAM to come in for Daka and McAteer.

 

Starting Formation

 

In Possession 

 

I’d be sacking off the Soule deal and go for Cameron Puertas instead. 

[Dan LCFC]

It's very early days for Cooper and ultimately these are only friendlies where he'll be testing things out, but Fatawu on the left is a big no for me and I swear to god if Ward sees any gametime I will flip. He'll be on a hiding to nothing.

[Iran]

Mavididi as 10 was certainly an interesting tactical switch and one that I really liked and could get behind!

Edited 24 July by Iran

[Iran]

6 hours ago, Scotch said:

I was very vocal about trying Fatawu at LWB. I would like to retract that. 

Agree with you retracing that. We definitely need to have Fatawu as close as possible to the opposition's goal.

[coolhandfox]

Our wingers were a major strength last season, and his pick a formation without wingers and decided to play them both out of position.

 

Would love to hear his reasoning.

[Foxes96]

Looked to be similar setup in possession to Enzo with a 3-2-4-1. Difference being that the 1 x FB pushes up to provide the width, rather than inverting as we saw last season.
 

Concern with this is, it doesn’t suit all our players. I would be worried about Justin/ Ricardo playing that role all season without breaking down. Also, as stated above Fatawu was wasted on the left, therefore the width from the FB pushing on really needs to be on the left hand side, leaving Fatawu to hug the opposite touchline. This would also benefit Mavididi who can cut inside into one of the 10 positions. 
 

Based on who we have current could set up as below. Does mean Ricardo misses out which is a big miss, so may have to play as a LB/LW or as one of the CDM’s to get the best out of the rest of the team. Imagine Soulé is being targeted for that CAM/ second striker role, which would be a very exciting front 4. 

 

out of possession 

                         Hermansen 

Justin - Vestergaard - Okoli - Kristiansen 

   Fatawu  -  Ndidi  -  Winks  -  Mavididi

                      Alves  -  Daka
 

in possession 

                         Hermansen 

          Justin - Vestergaard - Okoli 

                       Ndidi  -  Winks

    Fatawu - Alves - Mavididi - Kristiansen 

                              Daka 

[Finnegan]

This is going to be ****ing horrific isn't it. 

 

I've got absolutely no optimism or enthusiasm at all. 

 

Last year, even when all the right personnel weren't available, Enzo had a clear system in mind that suited the players we either had or were having and he stuck to it. And it was a smart system, it worked. We started doing it straight away from the first friendly. 

 

I ****ing hate wing backs, it's nearly always shit and it's a complete waste of our best two attacking chance creating outlets. Who the **** looks at the squads performance last year and thinks the smart thing to do is change Mavididi and Fatawu's roles and play two strikers. 

 

I appreciate inverted full backs is still a slightly new and niche idea but it's a smart one, it gets you all the defensive cover you need and it let's your better ball playing attacking midfielders get forward in to wide areas instead of full backs who often aren't as good on the ball. 

 

Man is supposed to be a scholar of the game, how can he not look at an idea that's working and not realise it's better than bloody wing backs. Ugh. 

 

[escape2victory]

Looked to me in the 1st half at least, was a 3-4-2-1 with Ricardo and Fatawu as wingbacks and Mavididi and McAteer as the 10’s.

 

i like the system but the wingbacks are key and quite a specialist position that we don’t really have in the squad. Ricardo/De Cordova-Reid could do a job on the right but none of Fatawu/Kristiansen/Thomas are suited to the left wing back role Imo 

[Mark]

I’ve no time for Cooper as long as Ward is in goal and Fatawu is a wing back in the opposite side, it’s braindead management which we’ve seen before and nothing gets done before it’s too late. Okoli’s performance terrified me too.

 

I wonder now with all the coaches leaving with Maresca we’re starting from scratch again, it’s a problem letting a manager have full control over the staff previously we used to have some sort of carry over when a manager left.

[RedSoxUK]

Can see something in possession like this considering Soule being a serious target. However would be a lot more fluid than Enzo's strict system.

 

              Hermansen

  Faes - Vestergaard - Okoli

            Ricardo - Winks

Fatawu - Soule - Mavididi - Reid

                       Vardy

 

 

Out of possession 

 

               Hermansen

Fatawu -  Okoli - Vestergaard - Justin

            Ricardo - Winks

       Soule - Mavididi - Reid

                      Vardy

 

Don't like it using Fatawu like that but doesn't look like Cooper fancies an inverted Ricardo. However Mavididi behind the striker looked effective. Similar to his use of Brennan Johnson really where he used 10s behind a striker. 

 

Saelemaekers also makes sense in that LWB/LW role over Reid. Either way Fatawu should be on the right side and will, so yesterday's line up/tactic just won't be the same for Spurs.

[iancognito]

1 hour ago, coolhandfox said:

Our wingers were a major strength last season, and his pick a formation without wingers and decided to play them both out of position.

 

Would love to hear his reasoning.

When else does he experiment? Best to try now than when we're 2 down in a league game

[Finnegan]

14 minutes ago, Mark said:

I’ve no time for Cooper as long as Ward is in goal and Fatawu is a wing back in the opposite side, it’s braindead management which we’ve seen before and nothing gets done before it’s too late. Okoli’s performance terrified me too.

 

I wonder now with all the coaches leaving with Maresca we’re starting from scratch again, it’s a problem letting a manager have full control over the staff previously we used to have some sort of carry over when a manager left.

 

I don't think we've given Cooper much remit over the recruitment staff. Glover is still here and will have rubber stamped any target you'd imagine. If he sees something in Okoli I'm happy to wait and watch. 

 

I'm not overly concerned about Ward yet. The Danes appear to either still be on holiday or only just back, I'm sure Mads will be first choice and Iversen is possibly being moved on. 

 

The tactics do concern me though. It's more square pegs round holes shit and for what? 3421 ffs? 

[Mark]

5 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

The tactics do concern me though. It's more square pegs round holes shit and for what? 3421 ffs? 

Probably thinks it worked so well at Forest when it didn’t

[Finnegan]

1 minute ago, Mark said:

Probably thinks it worked so well at Forest when it didn’t

 

Honestly this is what terrifies me. The only slim hope we had is that Forest were such a dumpster fire with no track record of playing "his" football that he just had to improvise. But if he shows up here with the same garbage, ugh. 

 

[Trent Steel]

ugghh we are in a right mess, i thought it would be different under cooper

[Trent Steel]

25 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I don't think we've given Cooper much remit over the recruitment staff. Glover is still here and will have rubber stamped any target you'd imagine. If he sees something in Okoli I'm happy to wait and watch. 

 

I'm not overly concerned about Ward yet. The Danes appear to either still be on holiday or only just back, I'm sure Mads will be first choice and Iversen is possibly being moved on. 

 

The tactics do concern me though. It's more square pegs round holes shit and for what? 3421 ffs? 

Mads will go to Chelsea

[Finnegan]

Just now, Trent Steel said:

Mads will go to Chelsea

 

Narh he won't. They're looking at cheaper options. I don't doubt Enzo wants him but they know they're about twenty million short of our valuation. 

 

[Mark]

27 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

I don't think we've given Cooper much remit over the recruitment staff. Glover is still here and will have rubber stamped any target you'd imagine.

I meant the coaching staff, it's just the group he had at Forest in Alan Tate, Steve Rands and Danny Alcock. I checked up on what Forest fans thoughts were when we were initially linked and alot of the suggestions were he needed better people around him, the whole coaching setup just screams Championship to me.

[Scotch]

10 hours ago, Lesta2014 said:

Hoping it’s because he wanted left footer there tonight and kristienson ain’t back yet to play it? 

Even at that though, I've saw enough of VK to be convinced he's not a LWB. I mean he is operational there but doesn't really offer an flair or attacking intent. 

[James_lcfc]

1 hour ago, Finnegan said: 

Who the **** looks at the squads performance last year and thinks the smart thing to do is change Mavididi and Fatawu's roles and play two strikers. 

 

 

SC said he watched every single game from last season - Seems he thinks he can get more out of those two.

 

I agree with all points…It’s worrying.

 

Playing it off as a friendly is fine, as long as he is willing to accept that certain things don’t work and doesn’t have a set in stone system in mind.

[StriderHiryu]

10 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

If he doesn't build his team around Fatawu at RW then he can do one as far as i'm concerned. 

 

Yep, playing Fatawu at wing back is why he didn't look that great at Sporting. Yes he could do a job there, but as we saw last season, you want him running at his man over and over. He can terrify any opponent, even Premier League defences.

 

10 hours ago, kingfox said:

 

Or you tweak things slightly by going 3-4-2-1 when in possession, then use Mavididi and Fatawu as two 10’s who can drift out wide. 

 

I'm hoping that is the change he's going to make and he only started Fatawu for balance. But being linked with Soule... it feels like him and Mavididi would be the 10's, so Fatawu would still be left wing back. Luke Thomas was available yesterday but used as LCB instead of LWB. 

 

1 hour ago, Finnegan said:

 

Last year, even when all the right personnel weren't available, Enzo had a clear system in mind that suited the players we either had or were having and he stuck to it. And it was a smart system, it worked. We started doing it straight away from the first friendly. 

 

 

I agree with this. From game one under Enzo the team looked extremely well coached, with a very clear identity and patterns of play already in place. It's a fact that Cooper is not as good as Maresca, and whilst we all knew that, it's a shame that he changed so much. He might claim he hasn't, but he's changed the role of two of our best players last season in Ricardo and Fatawu.

 

 

Overall though, it's still early days and the match did not feature Vestergaard, Vardy or Faes. Kristiansen was also unavailable. 

[ClaphamFox]

31 minutes ago, Trent Steel said:

Mads will go to Chelsea

No.

[Scotch]

2 minutes ago, StriderHiryu said:

 

Yep, playing Fatawu at wing back is why he didn't look that great at Sporting. Yes he could do a job there, but as we saw last season, you want him running at his man over and over. He can terrify any opponent, even Premier League defences.

 

 

I'm hoping that is the change he's going to make and he only started Fatawu for balance. But being linked with Soule... it feels like him and Mavididi would be the 10's, so Fatawu would still be left wing back. Luke Thomas was available yesterday but used as LCB instead of LWB. 

 

 

I agree with this. From game one under Enzo the team looked extremely well coached, with a very clear identity and patterns of play already in place. It's a fact that Cooper is not as good as Maresca, and whilst we all knew that, it's a shame that he changed so much. He might claim he hasn't, but he's changed the role of two of our best players last season in Ricardo and Fatawu.

 

 

Overall though, it's still early days and the match did not feature Vestergaard, Vardy or Faes. Kristiansen was also unavailable. 

I'm obviously trying not to read to much into our second pre-season game of the season but the more worrying part was after the game when Cooper was being interviewed and very much (to me anyway) implied that the system was here to stay, the only change being new signings coming in. 

 

For me, that's worrying because even if we do get players in that fit this tactic, it still leaves the likes of Fatawu, not really having a natural place in it.