UK Riots

[hejammy]

1 hour ago, Leicester_Loyal said:

 

Your first statement read as if someone who has legitimate concerns about migration (illegal or legal, not specified), is a Nazi, which is a serious hole to go down. 
 

The people with these concerns should be listened to and heard, rather than called a Nazi, racist or far right, that’s how people end up on the right. 
 

It’s an adult discussion to have and I think if legitimate concerns are ignored then many people will be pushed into voting Reform in 4 years time. 

I think the problem is - certainly of the far right that have been protesting is that they are not interested in conversation - their main gripes are - "But they are taking out jobs". "Immigration is costing us too much" " They are murderers and terrorists" etc etc.

 

How do you converse with someone who has such a warped viewpoint. You can give them the counter arguments however I fear that it will fall on deaf ears - in reality a lot of them are just interested in causing mayhem, inciting racial divide and either have drug, alcohol or both running through their system.

 

Genuinely I think those that have legitimate concerns need a platform for their concerns to be heard in a civilised manner. Talk to their local MPs and councillors, go to the press perhaps, inciting violence will never get you to your preferred outcome.

[StanSP]

25 minutes ago, hejammy said:

Genuinely I think those that have legitimate concerns need a platform for their concerns to be heard in a civilised manner. Talk to their local MPs and councillors, go to the press perhaps, inciting violence will never get you to your preferred outcome.

Pretty much this - it also doesn't help when those MPs who promised to help and get elected upon, then don't turn up to parliament to vent or air their views and questions, but instead are happy to use X or Instagram or whatever platform they choose. 

[hejammy]

4 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Pretty much this - it also doesn't help when those MPs who promised to help and get elected upon, then don't turn up to parliament to vent or air their views and questions, but instead are happy to use X or Instagram or whatever platform they choose. 

Exactly - anyone that actually thinks Farage, Tommy Robinson etc will help them with their genuine concerns needs to take a long hard look at themselves. The named two are an absolute disgrace and are using the people that follow them as "puppets" - or rather play things for their twisted and warped viewpoints. Both of them are a joke of a human. But what I will say is that the PM needs to come out and give them the opportunity to have their voices heard. If their opinions have been formed by the rhetoric Farage and Robinson have been spewing then let those people have the opportunity to hear the counter arguments as to why that particular viewpoint is false/uneducated or misguided. 

[bovril]

Brexit has made it almost impossible to discuss immigration sensibly in this country both because the campaign was so fantastical and short sighted and also because the campaigners were so arrogant and abusive. Really the greatest example of shooting yourself in the foot I've seen in UK politics. 

[Footballwipe]

I think it's interesting that the sentences yesterday (particularly the three year sentence for the idiot who punched a copper) have managed to piss off both the left and the right.

 

The right wing whataboutery is either the ridiculous argument that A) the attacker from last week won't have anything done until Jan 25, B) that the men who attacked the police at Manchester Airport haven't been imprisoned, or C) have just shouted MUSLIM GROOMING GANGS

 

Meanwhile, the left wing whataboutery are pissy that he got three years whilst the Just Stop Oil protesters got five years "for attending a zoom meeting" .

 

Of course, there's more to all of these. I think a lot of people spouting this also know full well that there's more to all of these other scenarios, but they're choosing to ignore it all to push the agenda. Really is a plague on both houses.

 

Is it any wonder people fall for misinformation and misrepresentation of situations when it's being so deliberately peddled to fit narrative and agenda?

[leicsmac]

2 minutes ago, Footballwipe said:

I think it's interesting that the sentences yesterday (particularly the three year sentence for the idiot who punched a copper) have managed to piss off both the left and the right.

 

The right wing whataboutery is either the ridiculous argument that A) the attacker from last week won't have anything done until Jan 25, B) that the men who attacked the police at Manchester Airport haven't been imprisoned, or C) have just shouted MUSLIM GROOMING GANGS

 

Meanwhile, the left wing whataboutery are pissy that he got three years whilst the Just Stop Oil protesters got five years "for attending a zoom meeting" .

 

Of course, there's more to all of these. I think a lot of people spouting this also know full well that there's more to all of these other scenarios, but they're choosing to ignore it all to push the agenda. Really is a plague on both houses.

 

Is it any wonder people fall for misinformation and misrepresentation of situations when it's being so deliberately peddled to fit narrative and agenda?

This whole issue just shows how big a problem it has become.

 

If everyone is getting different "truths", then public discourse becomes very, very difficult. And when you don't have discourse, then you get conflict.

[pmcla26]

Slow/properly regulate immigration (slow/properly regulate being the key words), create a country where people who work hard are rewarded financially and feel stable to support their families, and show some humility and relatability in the party running the country (that goes for current and past) to the average UK citizen and none of this happens. 

[ramboacdc]

We all carry our healing rocks with us don't we?

[Robo61]

1 hour ago, pmcla26 said:

Slow/properly regulate immigration (slow/properly regulate being the key words), create a country where people who work hard are rewarded financially and feel stable to support their families, and show some humility and relatability in the party running the country (that goes for current and past) to the average UK citizen and none of this happens. 

What though do you mnean exactly by slow/properly.   As far as I can see the vast majority of immigration is regulated the last government right or wrong simply chose to allow nearly a million immigrants into the country last year,  this will be lower this year so will have slowed.  The remainder is all but impossible to regulate without the Uk becoming a rogue state.

 

What are your suggestions on how work can be better rewarded financailly (for some of course it is very well rewarded).  You surely can't be suggesting that the new government has to take the flack for this after 14 years of incompetance and rewarding its backers.

[StanSP]

Taken great pleasure reading the sentencing articles from BBC today of those who were given jail time after rioting in Liverpool and Rotherham/Teesside. 

 

One of them was a former school governor! And he was the main instigator! His partner being young enough to be his son (grooming gangs, you say ).

 

One of the other men was 'against fascism and abhors any form of racism' yet knocked a kid off his bike during one of the protests, and threw rocks towards a building with asylum seekers in it. Facepalm. 

 

And another guy 'has been subjected to threats because of his involvement' in the riots. Awww diddums! 

[David Hankey]

39 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Taken great pleasure reading the sentencing articles from BBC today of those who were given jail time after rioting in Liverpool and Rotherham/Teesside. 

 

One of them was a former school governor! And he was the main instigator! His partner being young enough to be his son (grooming gangs, you say ).

 

One of the other men was 'against fascism and abhors any form of racism' yet knocked a kid off his bike during one of the protests, and threw rocks towards a building with asylum seekers in it. Facepalm. 

 

And another guy 'has been subjected to threats because of his involvement' in the riots. Awww diddums! 

Moronic behaviour from morons.

[Daggers]

42 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Taken great pleasure reading the sentencing articles from BBC today of those who were given jail time after rioting in Liverpool and Rotherham/Teesside. 

 

One of them was a former school governor! And he was the main instigator! His partner being young enough to be his son (grooming gangs, you say ).

 

One of the other men was 'against fascism and abhors any form of racism' yet knocked a kid off his bike during one of the protests, and threw rocks towards a building with asylum seekers in it. Facepalm. 

 

And another guy 'has been subjected to threats because of his involvement' in the riots. Awww diddums! 

One of the women in Middlesborough was a SEN learning support assistant.

 

The school locked down its Twitter account within seconds of her being identified, they were flooded with messages.

 

Her son was one of the ringleaders of the riot.

[Daggers]

Over 500 nicked so far.

 

 

[Daggers]

"Wolves are not coming back to the wild in Britain in the foreseeable future, because society is not ready" - Source

 

Shame, because I think they could sort out the current fash problem.

 

 

[StanSP]

What an absolute idiot

 

 

Disgusting thing to do. 

[Wymsey]

Why does it seem like some working in councils and safeguarding etc get in trouble for violence?..

Edited 8 August by Wymsey

[urban.spaceman]

1 hour ago, StanSP said:

What an absolute idiot

 

 

Disgusting thing to do. 

 

 

[Tommy G]

Knowing our justice system people that have been handed 2 or 3 year sentences will be let out in 6 months for “good behaviour” 

[urban.spaceman]

Unfortunately Oakeshott is only 50.

 

 

 

[HighPeakFox]

27 minutes ago, urban.spaceman said:

Unfortunately Oakeshott is only 50.

 

 

 

I believe the name of this woman is already in the public domain.

[urban.spaceman]

 

 

 

 

Edited 8 August by urban.spaceman

[Trav Le Bleu]

Anyone else feel that last night's non-materialisation of riots, rather than being because, "yeah, we showed them alright!" was a little... "the drums have stopped... It's quiet... Too quiet."

[Bryn]

2 hours ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

Anyone else feel that last night's non-materialisation of riots, rather than being because, "yeah, we showed them alright!" was a little... "the drums have stopped... It's quiet... Too quiet."

 

Nah, football's back this weekend so they don't need to entertain themselves by rioting.

[Jon the Hat]

13 hours ago, Daggers said:

Yet again, I never said they were. 

 

I do think you'd struggle to find a concern about immigration that I think is worthy of associating with the far right, though, and if you lie with dogs you get fleas.

 

If anyone went to a riot after Southport in the knowledge of what happened and was likely to happen again, I suspect their primary concern wasn't a "legitimate concern" about immigration.

 

And, the whole initial use of the inverted commas was to mock anyone claiming that's why they had been there as I simply don't believe it.

 

This isn't to say I don't think that some people think they harbour concerns about immigration - but almost every single one I've heard isn't legitimate. Maybe you hold one I've not heard. 

There are legitimate concerns resulting from the Government's failure to process asylum claims in the timely manner, and the resulting groups of mostly young men hanging around for months or years with nothing to do as they are not allowed to work legally.  I can understand why locals are concerned about groups of youths hanging around, albeit there is no doubt an underlying level of xenophobia mixed in there, I think that is a relatively normal human response which a lot of people are not equipped to deal with.  Mix in a bit of living in appalling overcrowded council housing with mould and leaks etc. and those awaiting processing are living in hotels - albeit they might be crappy hotels and living in them is pretty shit - and I can also understand the bitterness developing.  The reality is this comes from the failure to find solutions to the problems of poverty and lack of hope for this white underclass which has developed over the past decades, and then we see that those who have little or nothing to lose don't react like the rest of us to the police or the threat of jail etc.

[Jon the Hat]

9 hours ago, StanSP said:

What an absolute idiot

 

 

Disgusting thing to do. 

Of course he is part of the Free Palestine brigade.  Nasty ****ers.