Palace vs Leicester - Pre match thread (14th September 3pm)

[Dan LCFC]

16 hours ago, jayfox26 said:

Yep seems that way. I'm hoping things may change once all the new signings are available and settled in. We haven't necessarily played badly in the games so far this season and we seem organised, but like you say, if we continue being so defensive, it will be difficult to win games. 

Best one to prove this was @The Doctor he found some game state xG tables which basically tell me that we're going nothing with the game even and only really attacking when behind.

 

It's only three games but the trends do worry me. This isn't a method that is going to yield wins.

[Gazza M]

                   Mads

Justin   Faes   Okoli    VK

 

             Skipp  Winks 

                Buonanotte

                     

Fatawu        Vardy     Mavadidi 

 

[TheLittleBigMan]

We're gonna rip these lot a new one. High octane slick football.

 

0-3

Breathless. 

[FoxOnWheels]

If it’s the same as the last 3 games just **** him off and not waste anymore time, we let him have 5 more games and end up 8 games without a win what team then stays up from that it doesn’t happen 

[MGLCFC]

18 minutes ago, TheLittleBigMan said:

We're gonna rip these lot a new one. High octane slick football.

 

0-3

Breathless. 

Wrong forum mate - This is the LCFC forum not Man City

[Ric Flair]

3 hours ago, Dan LCFC said:

Best one to prove this was @The Doctor he found some game state xG tables which basically tell me that we're going nothing with the game even and only really attacking when behind.

 

It's only three games but the trends do worry me. This isn't a method that is going to yield wins.

Doesn't help that despite trying to be defe sive, we gift teams at least 1 goal in the opening 30 minutes.

[Dan LCFC]

5 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

Doesn't help that despite trying to be defe sive, we gift teams at least 1 goal in the opening 30 minutes.

To me it's just an inevitability when you're setting out to defend. If you carry so little going forward you are going to let the opposition grow in confidence to eventually put more and more numbers forward and get that goal.

 

After the way Rodgers had us playing in his latter time I do appreciate that there is at least an attempt to make us tougher to play through. We are battling and we're going to be a pain - it's really not dissimilar to his Forest side.

 

But I just think we're going to constantly sell ourselves short. I think if we had somebody like I don't know, Iraola, we would take the odd fisting but we'd pick up a few more surprise wins through simply being more ambitious. I really do think over a 38 game season setting up this way we'll do well to win 5 times.

 

If he plays Ndidi attacking midfield at Palace then that's me done with him to be honest because what's the point. I don't believe in that method and that to me would prove it's what he's standing for.

[dr.o.ball]

9 hours ago, FoxOnWheels said:

If it’s the same as the last 3 games just **** him off and not waste anymore time, we let him have 5 more games and end up 8 games without a win what team then stays up from that it doesn’t happen 

What part of, it's a big ask to make us competitive in the prem, do you not understand.

[Guppys Love Child]

1 hour ago, Dan LCFC said:

To me it's just an inevitability when you're setting out to defend. If you carry so little going forward you are going to let the opposition grow in confidence to eventually put more and more numbers forward and get that goal.

 

After the way Rodgers had us playing in his latter time I do appreciate that there is at least an attempt to make us tougher to play through. We are battling and we're going to be a pain - it's really not dissimilar to his Forest side.

 

But I just think we're going to constantly sell ourselves short. I think if we had somebody like I don't know, Iraola, we would take the odd fisting but we'd pick up a few more surprise wins through simply being more ambitious. I really do think over a 38 game season setting up this way we'll do well to win 5 times.

 

If he plays Ndidi attacking midfield at Palace then that's me done with him to be honest because what's the point. I don't believe in that method and that to me would prove it's what he's standing for.

I think I'm the same if that happens, and if Mavadidi also only makes the bench then IMO he's a bit clueless and blind to our most affective setup.

[Wrighty22]

Where is the best place to have a few beers before the game close to the ground?

[Collymore]

1 - BDCR needs to be binned. Bueanotte needs to be in the side. 

 

2 - Ndidi need to be replaced with Skipp. 

 

3. I feel we need to be more dynamic with Justin and Kristiansen taking it turns to venture forward making it harder for the opposition to setup and giving us more options. With this, Ricardo should be considered to play Justin's position. 

 

4. He needs to decide on the CB pairing now and go with it, not chop and change. He'll know more than anyone the importance of a consistent defence. I'm thinking it might be Faes Okoli for now but I have a feeling we might see Coady Okoli when Coady is fit again. I think they'd complement each other well.

 

5. Cooper needs to take some risks. Not massive ridiculous risks but I think fans will respect him if we are seen utilising our attacking strengths more even if this doesn't equate to points straight away. Setting up not to lose, which is unlikely not to work anyway, can be sensible at first maybe when assessing squad, but I really hope he can grow a pair and be more proactive going forward. 

Edited 12 September by Collymore

[CrazyKopCorner]

I'd go                     

                   Mads

Ricky    Vesty    Okoli    Justin 

             Skipp  Winks 

            Buonanotte                

Fatawu           Mavadidi 

               Vardy 

[Ric Flair]

3 hours ago, Dan LCFC said:

To me it's just an inevitability when you're setting out to defend. If you carry so little going forward you are going to let the opposition grow in confidence to eventually put more and more numbers forward and get that goal.

 

After the way Rodgers had us playing in his latter time I do appreciate that there is at least an attempt to make us tougher to play through. We are battling and we're going to be a pain - it's really not dissimilar to his Forest side.

 

But I just think we're going to constantly sell ourselves short. I think if we had somebody like I don't know, Iraola, we would take the odd fisting but we'd pick up a few more surprise wins through simply being more ambitious. I really do think over a 38 game season setting up this way we'll do well to win 5 times.

 

If he plays Ndidi attacking midfield at Palace then that's me done with him to be honest because what's the point. I don't believe in that method and that to me would prove it's what he's standing for.

Yeah, totally agree pal.

 

Those defending his tactics and team selection from the off have excused him because of the top 6 opposition in our two home games. If he continued this against the rest if the league then we must act fast and get him gone.

[AKCJ]

Hermansen

Ricardo Faes Okoli Justin

Skipp Winks El Khannouss

Buonanotte Vardy Mavididi

 

Iversen, Coady, Kristiansen, Ndidi, Fatawu, Ayew, BDCR

[jayfox26]

There isn't necessarily an issue with us setting up defensively and being organised, so long as we can play quick counter attacking football and get at teams a little more. It's fine setting up tactically defensive but the team selection shouldn't be ultra defensive and we should never ever, use a midfield 3 of Winks, Skipp and Ndidi because that straight away stops us having any creativity and being able to carry the ball forward when we get possession back. 

 

As regards the full back/ wingers situation, with the way Cooper wants us to play, we should rotate these positions based on opposition. If a team is weaker down their left, start Ricardo bombing on and have either VK or Justin as the holding lb and if they are weaker down their right, have Justin as the holding rb and VK bombing on down the left. 

 

Skipp and Winks are fine as the deep midfielders and then we can rotate between Buonanotte and El Khannouss as the attacking mid.

 

Ayew to start against Palace with JV off the bench and them Edouard to start after Palace possibly rotating with JV and Ayew being rotated with the wingers. 

[FoxesTalker]

Think this will be a 3-2 defeat. So far Cooper's approach seems to be conservative, so it's unlikely that Mavididi will start especially as it's away from home. To echo the sentiments already though, there has to be a balance in terms of attacking threat and Mavididi offers that, in fact this game could be ideal for him.

[FoxOnWheels]

2 hours ago, dr.o.ball said:

What part of, it's a big ask to make us competitive in the prem, do you not understand.

Why is it a big ask? We’ve got enough in the squad to stay up plenty worse sides than us have stayed up, that won’t wash with me if we had a points deduction then yes but we’re very competitive last 10/15 in games when we actually ask them questions if we’re gonna start the game shit scared of every side then it will be a big ask

[LcFc_Smiv]

39 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

Yeah, totally agree pal.

 

Those defending his tactics and team selection from the off have excused him because of the top 6 opposition in our two home games. If he continued this against the rest if the league then we must act fast and get him gone.

But we haven't played the rest of the league yet. I think the point is that too many on both sides are making concrete statements based off the first handful of games. I think we will be relatively defensive Saturday away from home, I'd like to think we go all out against Everton, if we don't that's where questions should be asked.

[ClaphamFox]

28 minutes ago, FoxOnWheels said:

Why is it a big ask? We’ve got enough in the squad to stay up plenty worse sides than us have stayed up, that won’t wash with me if we had a points deduction then yes but we’re very competitive last 10/15 in games when we actually ask them questions if we’re gonna start the game shit scared of every side then it will be a big ask

At work yesterday I was speaking to one of our senior managers. He's from Manchester and is a Man Utd fan but lives in west London and is a season ticket holder at Craven Cottage as his 9-year-old son is a Fulham fan. He was saying they couldn't believe how poor we were when we played them other week. He reckoned that before the game most Fulham fans were expecting it to be tough as we'd come up as champions and they thought we'd have a proper go at them, and they were genuinely surprised by how nervous our players looked and how passive we were after they went 2-1 up. 

 

It seems ridiculous to say that Saturday is a massive game because it's so early in the season, but it does feel that way as it will tell us a lot about what to expect from Cooper this season. Another passive away performance and routine defeat and things will start to look very grim; however, a positive display that shows we intend to go for it away from home might set a few minds at ease. 

Edited 12 September by ClaphamFox

[FoxOnWheels]

20 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

At work yesterday I was speaking to one of our senior managers. He's from Manchester and is a Man Utd fan but lives in west London and is a season ticket holder at Craven Cottage as his 9-year-old son is a Fulham fan. He was saying they couldn't believe how poor we were when we played them other week. He reckoned that before the game most Fulham fans were expecting it to be tough as we'd come up as champions and they thought we'd have a proper go at them, and they were genuinely surprised by how nervous our players looked and how passive we were after they went 2-1 up. 

 

It seems ridiculous to say that Saturday is a massive game because it's so early in the season, but it does feel that way as it will tell us a lot about what to expect from Cooper this season. Another passive away performance and routine defeat and things will start to look very grim; however, a positive display that shows we intend to go for it away from home might set a few minds at ease. 

That’s the issue Fulham are a decent side but not a team we should fear playing or there’s zero point in being in the league if scared of teams like that, put your best players on the pitch tweak tactics for who your against but ultimately go out and go for the win which we aren’t doing currently

[pmcla26]

51 minutes ago, ClaphamFox said:

At work yesterday I was speaking to one of our senior managers. He's from Manchester and is a Man Utd fan but lives in west London and is a season ticket holder at Craven Cottage as his 9-year-old son is a Fulham fan. He was saying they couldn't believe how poor we were when we played them other week. He reckoned that before the game most Fulham fans were expecting it to be tough as we'd come up as champions and they thought we'd have a proper go at them, and they were genuinely surprised by how nervous our players looked and how passive we were after they went 2-1 up. 

 

It seems ridiculous to say that Saturday is a massive game because it's so early in the season, but it does feel that way as it will tell us a lot about what to expect from Cooper this season. Another passive away performance and routine defeat and things will start to look very grim; however, a positive display that shows we intend to go for it away from home might set a few minds at ease. 

I think we're more nervous playing this style of football than we would be playing one closer to what we were used to last season. Our players haven't sat in a low block for over 12 months and now Cooper is expecting it to be an effective method. 

[Ric Flair]

1 hour ago, LcFc_Smiv said:

But we haven't played the rest of the league yet. I think the point is that too many on both sides are making concrete statements based off the first handful of games. I think we will be relatively defensive Saturday away from home, I'd like to think we go all out against Everton, if we don't that's where questions should be asked.

And if so, it's no coincidence Cooper's away record as a manager is diabolical at this level. 

[Ric Flair]

39 minutes ago, pmcla26 said:

I think we're more nervous playing this style of football than we would be playing one closer to what we were used to last season. Our players haven't sat in a low block for over 12 months and now Cooper is expecting it to be an effective method. 

The thing is, I'm not convinced we are sitting in a low block. We're picking a cautious and workmanlike team but asking some of them to do the role of creative players which they're extremely limited at. So we get the worst of both worlds.

[dr.o.ball]

33 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

And if so, it's no coincidence Cooper's away record as a manager is diabolical at this level. 

It is but the excitement Cooper created at the Forest ground was unbelievable, he kept them up and revolutionised the club and it could happen here. 

[ClaphamFox]

16 minutes ago, dr.o.ball said:

It is but the excitement Cooper created at the Forest ground was unbelievable, he kept them up and revolutionised the club and it could happen here. 

And then he got sacked because he couldn't sort out their away form and their home form started to ebb a bit. Unless Cooper demonstrates that he can set up and motivate a team to play away from home, his shelf life in any job will be severely restricted. You can't build a long-term strategy around being crap in half the games you play.