Madeleine McCann

[Chandler]

JH, you've used my The Times 'low pixellation' reference as your 'get out of jail card' but it doesn't wash. All of the observations in my previous post about the image (and not all of them were mine) can be validated by others.

Pixellation levels determine the level of difficulty in telling a true image from a false one. If the infamous photo was a high resolution image any attempts at doctoring it would be immediately evident even to the partially sighted at first viewing. The fact that the snap is of low resolution undoubtedly makes it harder to reveal the forger's hand. But it doesn't make the task impossible.

Admittedly none of my earlier observations taken individually could be considered a knock out blow (my point on hair difference rattled the gumshield though). However, when taken collectively the observations suggest that tampering is more likely than not. And if I was to express that likelihood in fractions I would put it at 2/3 to a 1/3 - a two to one majority.

OK enough already as our friends across the pond would say. In an earlier post in a parallel universe I promised to look into whether the Portuguese police were just merely incompetent or whether they had been stood down in the McCann case. I vow I will do this but I am going to allow myself to be sidetracked yet again. This time it's 'Spud Gun Productions' that causes me to deviate from the straight and narrow. A most interesting piece of propaganda.

It is immediately evident that this is the work of professionals who know how to create a narrative and to stir emotions. It unashamedly mimics and is very effective counterpoint to previous efforts put out by 'Team McCann.' But who made it? Hard to tell.

Could it be British? Possibly, but the third person reference to 'Her Majesty's British Government' is a little peculiar if not a little too clever by half.

Portuguese provenance perhaps? The fado sound track towards the end is a bit too obvious methinks (by the way does anyone know the opening track and the performing artist?). And, one or two inconsistencies in punctuation aside, the script is idiomatically familiar - not a trace of a foreign accent there (except for 'Whitehouse' maybe).

And what about our American friends? It's very slick, very knowing and very American in style. But all the spelling appears to be Anglicised. However one or two Americanisms are evident ('hot-wired' is the best example here - it is worth noting also that 'Spud Gun' is American in origin). But why might the Yanks be involved in the McCann case? That's one for later.

I won't deal with all the slide show's takes on events (debunking the producer's frankly idiotic inference that most of the McCanns' party were accessories - something that you have to accept unfortunately if you buy into the 'McCanns Murdered Maddie' nonsense - requires a post all to itself). I'll just deal with just one - but in my next post. And it will be more my take on the subject rather than the producer's. And what or who is the subject here you may well ask?

He is the enigma inside a puzzle wrapped up in a mystery. The one party in this case I freely confess I may well have been wrong about - but remember even the great Hercule Poirot occasionally got his red herrings mixed up. And the mixed up red herring in this case is the unfathomable, inscrutable, aphasic 'Angloport.'

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Mr Robert Murat...

Edited 29 September 2007 by Chandler

[Guest]

Case solved!

[Webbo]

'

Ladies and gentlemen, I give you Mr Robert Murat...

I believe at the start when Murat was questioned, a colleague of his, a Russian web site designer was questioned too, so it's possible that he was responsible for the video. That doesn't make him a murderer/abductor though, just some one who's peeved about the situation.

You've obviously put a lot of thought into this, but you get your information from the same place as the rest of us, the newspapers and TV and therefore your opinions are no more valid than anybody else's. If your prose wasn't so melodramatic and your tone so superior people wouldn't be so dismissive of your many conspiracy theories.

[Jon the Hat]

JH, you've used my The Times 'low pixellation' reference as your 'get out of jail card' but it doesn't wash. All of the observations in my previous post about the image (and not all of them were mine) can be validated by others.

Actually my point was more that you lost credibilty in your argument than that your argument was wrong in itself.

[Chandler]

Lisa, babe, nice to hear from you again. You're jumping the gun a bit on Mr Murat. When I said he's an enigma I really meant it.

Futter, you're an ungrateful sod. Surely you must realise there's a price to be paid for the assists that keep you ahead of the common herd on the great moral panics of the age? In this case it's putting up with my insufferable genius. So no more whining about my smug, superior attitude.

You're right though about my information sources being the same as virtually everyone else's. S'funny then how between 50 -80% of the general population believe there might be something in the theory that a qualified doctor over sedated and killed her first born (conceived by IVF) then roped her husband and friends in as accessories after the fact by persuading them to help her first hide and then dispose of her daughter's body (in no fewer than three different scenarios at the time of writing).

The great unwashed delude themselves into accepting this falsehood as truth because they have prejudices which the Job Comforter media are only too happy to feed through innuendo, cynical recycling and purveying disinformation. By laying my prejudices to one side (let's just say that in my book Glaswegian/Scouser medics are amongst the most self absorbed, narcissistic breeds on the planet) and by painstakingly constructing timelines from press reports (believe me it is a very time consuming job) a different reality reveals itself - just like a jig saw puzzle does when you don't force the pieces together.

But the pieces that reveal the role played by Robert Murat might be missing...

[Rincewind]

Quote "You're right though about my information sources being the same as virtually everyone else's. S'funny then how between 50 -80% of the general population believe there might be something in the theory that a qualified doctor over sedated and killed her first born (conceived by IVF) then roped her husband and friends in as accessories after the fact by persuading them to help her first hide and then dispose of her daughter's body (in no fewer than three different scenarios at the time of writing). " unquote

if that is so 50-80% of the population have been reading too many Agatha Christie novels or watching too much Morse. It is true though that 50-80% of the population have no qualifications in forensics or knowledge of how REAL police work is carried out but think they do. Probably the same ones.

I prefer to leave all the details of this case to the people who are qualified in the fields needed.

Edited 30 September 2007 by Nightguard

[Ultra]

By laying my prejudices to one side (let's just say that in my book Glaswegian/Scouser medics are amongst the most self absorbed, narcissistic breeds on the planet)...

Big assumption to make.

Can't speak about Kate, but my contacts at Glenfield don't have a bad word to say about Gerry. They tell me he's a very accomplished cardiologist.

But until this issue is laid to rest one way or another, neither parent can resume a working life.

[Phube]

Big assumption to make.

Can't speak about Kate, but my contacts at Glenfield don't have a bad word to say about Gerry. They tell me he's a very accomplished cardiologist.

But until this issue is laid to rest one way or another, neither parent can resume a working life.

Interesting, because my contacts at Glenfield tell me (although he is/was a good cardiologist) he was a thoroughly unpleasant man to work with/for!

But you find that people don't tell the truth in bad times... "he was a star pupil etc. (when we know he was a skiving chav...)" is always trotted out when a child dies!

[stez]

Interesting, because my contacts at Glenfield tell me (although he is/was a good cardiologist) he was a thoroughly unpleasant man to work with/for!

But you find that people don't tell the truth in bad times... "he was a star pupil etc. (when we know he was a skiving chav...)" is always trotted out when a child dies!

i know it shouldn't but it always makes me smile when i hear that, and i think 'was he/she, was he/she really?'

[Chandler]

OK folks so it's on to 'deconstructing' the role and personality of one Robert Murat as you Media Studies types might say.

Like most others, when I heard that Murat had been interrogated and been declared an 'arguido' I thought that he had been made a scapegoat by the Portuguese police who were just after a quick result.The alibi's provided by his relatives were watertight and the search of his mother's property smelt like an attempt to frame him. That was the first time round.

However, when the lumberjacks moved in again on the house several weeks later I was perhaps a little less certain of his innocence and because I didn't really have a handle on the case (although I was aware of funny goings on regarding the possible state protection of paedophile rings and of a certain reluctance to investigate child abductions in Portugal) I mentally conceded that the police might have just cause to investigate him. But I still thought it more likely than not that they were trying to resolve a local difficulty by stitching Murat up.

And then came the bombshell: his lawyers statement about the McCanns which told them dilpomatically to **** off out of Praia da Luz. Ostensibly the reason for the tirade was that the McCanns were causing havoc in the area and disrupting commerce. But it was quite clear what the subtext to the attack was - it's the McCanns who are the real arguido's and not my client.

I was stunned. There was no way that Murat's lawyer could have issued such a statement without his client's consent. I am no legal beagle but I would have thought that one of the unwritten rules of practising criminal law would be that suspect's counsel should never antagonise the victims.

Murat's lawyer could not have done a better job of alientating the McCanns. Perhaps, this was (misguided) retribution? Had someone from 'Team McCann' done a little lobbying in Portimao urging the PJ to reopen the file on his client?

Whatever, amateur sleuth and timeliner Chandler decided to look a little more closely at Robert Murat...

[l444ry]

OK folks so it's on to 'deconstructing' the role and personality of one Robert Murat as you Media Studies types might say.

Like most others, when I heard that Murat had been interrogated and been declared an 'arguido' I thought that he had been made a scapegoat by the Portuguese police who were just after a quick result.The alibi's provided by his relatives were watertight and the search of his mother's property smelt like an attempt to frame him. That was the first time round.

However, when the lumberjacks moved in again on the house several weeks later I was perhaps a little less certain of his innocence and because I didn't really have a handle on the case (although I was aware of funny goings on regarding the possible state protection of paedophile rings and of a certain reluctance to investigate child abductions in Portugal) I mentally conceded that the police might have just cause to investigate him. But I still thought it more likely than not that they were trying to resolve a local difficulty by stitching Murat up.

And then came the bombshell: his lawyers statement about the McCanns which told them dilpomatically to **** off out of Praia da Luz. Ostensibly the reason for the tirade was that the McCanns were causing havoc in the area and disrupting commerce. But it was quite clear what the subtext to the attack was - it's the McCanns who are the real arguido's and not my client.

I was stunned. There was no way that Murat's lawyer could have issued such a statement without his client's consent. I am no legal beagle but I would have thought that one of the unwritten rules of practising criminal law would be that suspect's counsel should never antagonise the victims.

Murat's lawyer could not have done a better job of alientating the McCanns. Perhaps, this was (misguided) retribution? Had someone from 'Team McCann' done a little lobbying in Portimao urging the PJ to reopen the file on his client?

Whatever, amateur sleuth and timeliner Chandler decided to look a little more closely at Robert Murat...

Chandler, whilst I don't subscribe completely to your theories they are nevertheless still interesting. Why do you not give links and sources to them so that they carry more weight and let people judge the issues for themselves rather than judge you for supplying the message?

[Jon the Hat]

Interesting, because my contacts at Glenfield tell me (although he is/was a good cardiologist) he was a thoroughly unpleasant man to work with/for!

But you find that people don't tell the truth in bad times... "he was a star pupil etc. (when we know he was a skiving chav...)" is always trotted out when a child dies!

To be fair, you could get that description for the majority of consultants from at least one person they work with, and usually many more.

[Rincewind]

Peoples perceptions of others are different. I've known people who I find hard to get along with yet others who meet them tell me they are great company. Visa versa as well. A doctors advice to a patient may seem bossy/pigheaded to some but welcomed by others. Some dont like to be the one that is told what to do.

But saying that when people are asked by the media to say a few words they are I would imagine asked to leave the nasty bits out. They want sympathy from the public not a couldn't give a toss attitude.

[Chandler]

Before I kick off again on Murat did anyone catch the Sky News' retrospective on the MM case last night? Martin Brunt (somewhat to my surprise, I must admit, after his appalling coverage of Kate McCann's questioning in Portimao, just before she and her husband were declared arguido's) was pretty easy on the McCann's this time round (and even easier on Mr Murat who, we were informed, was told by the Portimao police that they didn't think that he had abducted Madeleine) and pretty heavy on the 'incompetence' of Portuguese police ( their latest MM theory just in - she fell down the stairs)

OK, the life and times of Robert Murat, Angloportish divorcee (ex wife Dawn and three year old daughter Sofia who looks just like MM currently residing in UK) former poulterer (good ol' Bernard 'bird flu' Matthews!) and second hand car salesman (Inchcape & Merisa) in his previous existence in Norfolk and lately wannabe Algarvian realtor (according to The Times of the 15/5/07 amongst others).

He seems to have had a bit of a peripatetic, upsy downsy kind of existence. Born in the UK then out to Potugal then back to UK (following death of father when he turned 13 in 1986) and then back to Portugal again after a gap of nearly 20 years. Loses an eye in his teens and then at the ripe old age of 23 marries a woman eight years his senior who already has a son aged 11. Alistair Campbell would spin him as a 'survivor.' A criminologist might term him dysfunctional...

Also noteworthy was that he used to freelance as a translator for Norfolk constabulary whilst he was flogging dodgy motors (remember that he performed a similar role for the police in Portimao). Curiously (according to The Times), they needed his services to enable them to communicate with the large Portuguese community in the county. Well, I don't remember that from my Geography 'O' Level (probably the reason why I failed it - yes, once upon a time you could fail one).

Sometime in 2005 he decided to up sticks with wife Dawn and baby Sofia and 'return' to Portugal. After four months wife and baby head back to Norfolk but he stays on with mum at 'Villa Liliana.' 'Totally devoted' to Sofia he commutes regularly to UK but the relationship with wife, we are told, just fizzles out. He then becomes intimate with a German work colleague (Michaela Wulczuch) who still lived with her Portuguese pool cleaning ex husband (Luis Antonio) 'for the sake of their daughter.' This bizarre menage a troi becomes public knowledge when Murat stayed with the family in their home in Lagos (not the Nigerian capital!) immediately following his designation as an arguido (a status he requested for himself) before another flit back to the UK to continue renovating a property he had purchased in Devon.

Some of you may also remember that when Murat was taken to Portimao to be interrogated, Norfolk constabulary very quickly spirited his ex and daughter away from their Hockering home on Monday May 14th. She emerged blinking into the lens's of the papparazzi from the house of a 'friend' (Caroline Steward) in a nearby village four days later. The Screws, of course, had predictably managed to find rather older, more compromising photo's of Dawn (the kind that somehow both manages to boost its circulation and 'shock' its readership at the same time).

OK some iddy biddy questions -

1) Couldn't help noticing how his freelance interpreting with Portimao police neatly followed on from a similar stint with their Norfolk counterparts (fiercely committed to stamping out lawlessness in the burgeoning expat Portuguese community!). Was this some sort of 'unofficial transfer?' Twenty years is, after all, a long, long time in which to forget your alma mater.

2) How did he get a job as a police interpreter when, according, to Veronica Fennell (a work colleague at 'Remax', the realtor where he met his girlfriend Michaela) she had to do the translating as she felt that 'he wasn't up to scratch?'.

3) Why did Norfolk constabulary deem it necessary to spirit Dawn and Sofia out of their Hockering home: surely Dawn could have driven herself and daughter to her 'friend' nearby? Murat had neither been arrested nor charged and was in a completely different legal jurisdiction - under what authority was this action taken?

Was it the catch-all clause 'drive dodgy mate's ex to police safe house and debrief' I wonder???

Edited 1 October 2007 by Chandler

[Webbo]

What's your point?

[James.]

What's your point?

I was left thinking the same thing.

On a side issue one thing that puzzles me about you Chandler is why you choose a Leicester City forum to air the findings of whatever kind of investigation and timelining you find yourself involved in during and after "events" such as Madeleine's disappearance.

Particularly as you rarely, if ever, post any comments about Leicester City.

Do you post on other forums? I would have thought a site specifically for the discussion of conspiracy theories (there must be one, right?) may prove a much more rewarding and satisfying outlet to publicise your sometimes intriguing other times fruitless posts.

Anyway, I'm not complaining, just thinking out loud.

[Chandler]

I was left thinking the same thing.

On a side issue one thing that puzzles me about you Chandler is why you choose a Leicester City forum to air the findings of whatever kind of investigation and timelining you find yourself involved in during and after "events" such as Madeleine's disappearance.

Particularly as you rarely, if ever, post any comments about Leicester City.

Do you post on other forums? I would have thought a site specifically for the discussion of conspiracy theories (there must be one, right?) may prove a much more rewarding and satisfying outlet to publicise your sometimes intriguing other times fruitless posts.

Anyway, I'm not complaining, just thinking out loud.

Patience Futter, patience JTB. The relevance of all this will become clear I promise you.

Re. posting on LCFC let's just say that I have become just a little weary of local footie fan culture. I prefer to go to games and switch off after them and focus on other things. 'Monday morning quarterbacking' isn't my basket at present.

Yes, I do post on other boards, particularly conspiracy boards. Surprisingly, no one on them to the best of my knowledge and belief has grasped the POSSIBLE significance of Madeleine McCann's disappearance. The belief that 'the McCanns did it' is widely held by New World Order freaks too who (wrongly) see parallels with the Jonbenet Ramsey case (where the late mother probably was the killer).

I want to first try out my theory on a representative sample of public opinion to see how it goes down. And a footie fans forum is as representative a place as any. There is the strong local interest in the case to factor in too.

Then I can go and preach to the whacko's...

[l444ry]

After several weeks bombardment of media red herrings inspired (planted) by Clarence Mitchell on behalf of the McCann camp perhaps it's worth remembering one thing-:

In Portugal a witness is obliged to answer all questions. The McCanns asked to be given arguido status in order that they would not have to answer.

Leaked reports of the interview say that Kate McCann grew hysterical when shown the video of the cadaver dogs. She is said to have refused to answer questions. There was then a stand off which was resolved when she was allowed to make a phone call to Gerry. It was at this point that both of them agreed to become arguidos.

It is worth repeating this as it does have a direct bearing on the current situation.

It might be a question of sematics, but it is factually incorrect to say that the police named them suspects. And it might also be said that once they took that status upon themselves, it was they who walked into a trap. Indeed, if they are being framed, then it is reasonable to say that they have framed themselves; and quite possibly some or all of the friends they were with on the night.

It is the McCanns who by fleeing from Portugal have stalled the investigation. And it is one thing to explain alleged discoveries of DNA through the media and to make noises about hiring expert witnesses to demolish that 'evidence': but since that evidence is known only to the police this is a smokescreen, the whole exercise is cynical self justification.

It is odd that both they and their spokesman Clarence Mitchell, repeatedly say they are happy to return to Portugal and co-operate with the police at any time; when they have engaged a lawyer known for fighting extradition cases; and they patently have no intention of returning to Portugal and are doing all they can to avoid those questions.

[Rincewind]

My theory is that this forum isn't run by human mods but aliens from the planet FUXXXQQOG. A slightly less believable theory than all the McCann's therries but one that could be investigated by Mr Chandler all the same.

[Raj]

Im gonna get hammered for this,l but im bored of it all.

Sorry!

[Milky]

Im gonna get hammered for this,l but im bored of it all.

Sorry!

We all were about 2 months ago.

[Raj]

We all were about 2 months ago.

I was then but i didnt want to say anything!

[AoWW]

Im gonna get hammered for this,l but im bored of it all.

Sorry!

Sadly, I agree.

[lookwhaticando]

Sadly, I agree.

Your former school's headmaster/mistress says you shall burn in hell for that remark.

Don't worry, I'll save you a good seat.

Edited 2 October 2007 by lookwhaticando

[Chandler]

Chaps,

I got bored with this whole thing too until I realised that there might be something more to this case than meets the eye. In my view, the orchestrated debate about the complicity of the McCanns in the disappearance of their daughter is the conjuror's sleight of hand to stop the great unwashed from seeing what MIGHT lie behind this tragic affair.

I probably dislke the McCanns even more than 1444ry (brace yourself for a thorough debunking sir!) but they had virtually no window of opportunity to murder their daughter hide her remains and dispose of her (which is why the PJ are continually having to revise their theories and they get away with this because the great unwashed are reknowned for their goldfish like memories). Also, it must be bourne in mind that any theory about their role demands that at least three other members of their party were accessories (Tanner, Oldfield and Payne).

So chaps, stick around for the Chandler exclusive. I'll even try and relieve your perosnal tedium by posting pics of Ms Wet T Shirt Praia da Luz 2007 (if someone can kindly tell me how to work the image thingy button)!