Madeleine McCann

[Kent Fox]

So chaps, stick around for the Chandler exclusive. I'll even try and relieve your perosnal tedium by posting pics of Ms Wet T Shirt Praia da Luz 2007 (if someone can kindly tell me how to work the image thingy button)!

If it's Kate McCann, you can fcuk right off

[Steven]

Im gonna get hammered for this,l but im bored of it all.

Sorry!

Agree with you about the juvenile way adults have behaved but from the perspective of the 4 year old no.

[AoWW]

Your former school's headmaster/mistress says you shall burn in hell for that remark.

Don't worry, I'll save you a good seat.

Ho hum... I'll get over it.

I resigned myself to the 'burning in hell' fate long before now. At least in hell it should be nice and warm and toasty!

[Zingari]

new development

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7024934.stm

[l444ry]

Chaps,

I got bored with this whole thing too until I realised that there might be something more to this case than meets the eye. In my view, the orchestrated debate about the complicity of the McCanns in the disappearance of their daughter is the conjuror's sleight of hand to stop the great unwashed from seeing what MIGHT lie behind this tragic affair.

I probably dislke the McCanns even more than 1444ry (brace yourself for a thorough debunking sir!) but they had virtually no window of opportunity to murder their daughter hide her remains and dispose of her (which is why the PJ are continually having to revise their theories and they get away with this because the great unwashed are reknowned for their goldfish like memories). Also, it must be bourne in mind that any theory about their role demands that at least three other members of their party were accessories (Tanner, Oldfield and Payne).

So chaps, stick around for the Chandler exclusive. I'll even try and relieve your perosnal tedium by posting pics of Ms Wet T Shirt Praia da Luz 2007 (if someone can kindly tell me how to work the image thingy button)!

At the risk of provoking one of your intellectual thrashings, may I bring to your attention this article from one of your preferred sources? As you will see, the PJ think there was an ample window of opportunity.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/arti...in_page_id=1770

Edited 2 October 2007 by l444ry

[Chandler]

The big problem that everyone has who believes that the McCanns had something to do with the disappearance of their daughter is that they do not ask searching questions about the provenance of negative stories about them in the British media.

Well, allow me to enlighten you about the origins of most of the smears, sorry, articles about the McCanns. With very few exceptions most of the material comes from the Portuguese press. And guess where most of their information comes from - the Judicial Police (PJ) in Portimao. And guess exactly WHO has been ILLEGALLY supplying the latin hacks with their libellous bilge...

Goncalo Amaral. The same man who is due to face charges for battering a confession out of Leonor Cipriano (after she had reported her nine year old daughter Joana missing) that both she and her brother killed her daughter for having sex with him, then refrigerated her corpse and finally fed her remains to swine. Leonor and bro are now serving 16 years. And this once happy family used to live in a small village just seven miles from you know where...

The same man whose antics precipitated the resignation of Chief Inspector Olegario Sousa, the official police spokesman on the McCann investigation who was both appalled by the PJ's treatment of the McCanns and at the way fellow oficers were briefing 'friendly Portuguese journalists' behind his back.

The same man who yesterday was forced to quit the investigation for giving an ILLEGAL interview to Diario de Noticias complaining that the British police were only investigating what the McCanns wanted them to (he was really complaining about the launch of a Leicestershire police enquiry into a tip off posted on the Prince of Wales website that a vengeful former maid at The Ocean Club was involved in the abduction of Madeleine - Amaral was really dismissed for diplomatic reasons as the Portuguese government didn't want to risk a rift with London)

Now before I tell you what kind of stories about the McCanns originate in our own press here is an old piece from a newspaper (that some of you on here respect and are happy to quote from) about how the Portuguese police generally handle cases of child abuse.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Portugal's elite linked to paedophile ring

Abuse was reportedly going on at Lisbon orphanage for 20 years

Giles Tremlett in Lisbon

Wednesday November 27, 2002

The Guardian

A scandal over a paedophile ring run from a state orphanage gripped Portugal yesterday as it threatened to engulf diplomats, media personalities and senior politicians.

Photographs of unnamed senior government officials with young boys from Lisbon's Casa Pia orphanage were among the evidence reportedly available to police after they arrested a former orphanage employee called Carlos Silvino.

A number of former residents, and the mother of one boy who is still there, have denounced sexual attacks on children at what is known as Lisbon's most famous orphanage.

Mr Silvino, it was claimed, abused children himself and procured boys for a powerful group of clients.

He has publicly denied the allegations and was expected to repeat that denial at a closed-door bail hearing in Lisbon yesterday.

What has most shocked the Portuguese have been the revelations that systematic sexual abuse of children at the home had allegedly been going on for more than 20 years and had been known to police and other authorities for most of that time.

A former president, General Ramalho Eanes, was allegedly among those who knew about abuse at the home but failed to stop it.

The identity of the mysterious group of powerful paedophiles remained a secret yesterday, with only one person prepared to admit she knew at least some of the names.

Former secretary of state for families, Teresa Costa Macedo, said she had sent a dossier containing photographs and testimonies from children to the police 20 years ago but they had done nothing about it, while she was subjected to a campaign of threats.

"He [silvino] was just one element in a huge paedophile network that involved important people in our country," Mrs Costa Macedo explained in a newspaper interview. "It wasn't just him. He was a procurer of children for well-known people who range from diplomats and politicians to people linked to the media."

The material sent to the police, which yesterday appeared to have been lost, was damning proof of the activities of the paedophile ring, Mrs Costa Macedo said.

"There are photographs, an account of the methods used to spirit children out of the orphanage and testimonies of a number of children," she explained.

Mrs Costa Macedo said that many of the photographs were found at the house of a Portuguese diplomat in the town of Estoril, 20 miles from Lisbon. Four children who had gone missing from the orphanage were discovered at the house, where they had spent several days allegedly under lock and key.

President Eanes was introduced to five boys who told him of the abuse occurring at the orphanage in 1980 but failed to act on it, according to Mrs Costa Macedo.

There was no suggestion that General Eanes, a popular and respected figure who did not comment on the allegations yesterday, was involved in the paedophile ring.

Portuguese police insisted yesterday they had no record of the documents sent to them by Mrs Costa Macedo.

She said she had been the target of a campaign of intimidation to make her stop investigating the case.

"I received anonymous threats, by phone and post. They said they would kill me, flay me and a lot of other things," she said.

That campaign had started again yesterday, she said, with threatening phone calls made to her home.

Portugal has increasingly been under the scrutiny of anti-paedophile groups who have denounced its lax laws and uninterested courts for creating a paedophiles' paradise in Europe.

Belgian and Dutch paedophile groups are reported to have operated in Portugal, with foreigners travelling to the island of Madeira to seek out young children.

Investigators from the Swiss-based Innocence in Danger group, which claims children regularly disappear from the poorer streets of Portuguese towns and cities, say they too have been harassed and threatened.

Mr Silvino claimed his accusers were making up their allegations. "It is all lies," he said.

The orphanage's director and deputy director were sacked on Monday as the government pledged to clear up the case as soon as possible.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Believe me, nothing has changed in Portugal since Casa Pia. In fact, things have got worse...

I hope I'm getting through to you 1444ry. The PJ are using the Portuguese media to smear the McCanns because the abduction, procurement, abuse and murder of children is largely a state sponsored industry in Portugal protected by fascistic, Salazarian throwback thugs like Goncalo Amaral.

And if you will kindly refrain from constantly interrupting me with the recycled garbage which you consider 'evidence' (but which even the Portuguese prosecutors consider too feeble to use at trial) then maybe, just maybe, you will allow other members on this board to discover the POSSIBLE reasons behind Madeleine's disappearance.

Edited 3 October 2007 by Chandler

[Rincewind]

[Chandler]

This svelte siren is currently deputising for 'Ms Wet T Shirt Praia da Luz 2007.' Still a little tired Nightguard? When not giving coy looks to the papparazzi this foxy chick spends most of her time being ignored by the Portuguese police...

[James.]

I've sometimes wondered if Chandler and l444ry are the same person.

The fact that they are arguing and debating in this thread has bizarre and potentially worrying implications but I can't help but notice their writing styles amongst other more subtle similarities.

That said, I may be talking complete arse.

[Kent Fox]

I'll be glad when this is all over.

The posts are so long now it is getting ridiculous.

No offence meant to either l444ry or Chandler, but I am finding it quite tiresome trying to keep up with the length of the argument you pose.

I know I could just bog off and not read it, but I still have an interest in the case and pop in to see if someone has posted something new.

All i ask, is based on nobody knowing a bloody thing about what's what, can't we keep the posts a bit shorter??

Cheers, Chaps

[Raj]

I'll be glad when this is all over.

The posts are so long now it is getting ridiculous.

No offence meant to either l444ry or Chandler, but I am finding it quite tiresome trying to keep up with the length of the argument you pose.

I know I could just bog off and not read it, but I still have an interest in the case and pop in to see if someone has posted something new.

All i ask, is based on nobody knowing a bloody thing about what's what, can't we keep the posts a bit shorter??

Cheers, Chaps

Too fcuking right!

P.s...kent fox -Dont tell anyone else but i dont even read them now!...sssshhhhh our little secret okay!?

[l444ry]

I'll be glad when this is all over.

The posts are so long now it is getting ridiculous.

No offence meant to either l444ry or Chandler, but I am finding it quite tiresome trying to keep up with the length of the argument you pose.

I know I could just bog off and not read it, but I still have an interest in the case and pop in to see if someone has posted something new.

All i ask, is based on nobody knowing a bloody thing about what's what, can't we keep the posts a bit shorter??

Cheers, Chaps

You cheeky b****r Kent. I've hardly ever posted anything longer than three paragraphs in this thread or elsewhere on the forum.

[Raj]

After several weeks bombardment of media red herrings inspired (planted) by Clarence Mitchell on behalf of the McCann camp perhaps it's worth remembering one thing-:

In Portugal a witness is obliged to answer all questions. The McCanns asked to be given arguido status in order that they would not have to answer.

Leaked reports of the interview say that Kate McCann grew hysterical when shown the video of the cadaver dogs. She is said to have refused to answer questions. There was then a stand off which was resolved when she was allowed to make a phone call to Gerry. It was at this point that both of them agreed to become arguidos.

It is worth repeating this as it does have a direct bearing on the current situation.

It might be a question of sematics, but it is factually incorrect to say that the police named them suspects. And it might also be said that once they took that status upon themselves, it was they who walked into a trap. Indeed, if they are being framed, then it is reasonable to say that they have framed themselves; and quite possibly some or all of the friends they were with on the night.

It is the McCanns who by fleeing from Portugal have stalled the investigation. And it is one thing to explain alleged discoveries of DNA through the media and to make noises about hiring expert witnesses to demolish that 'evidence': but since that evidence is known only to the police this is a smokescreen, the whole exercise is cynical self justification.

It is odd that both they and their spokesman Clarence Mitchell, repeatedly say they are happy to return to Portugal and co-operate with the police at any time; when they have engaged a lawyer known for fighting extradition cases; and they patently have no intention of returning to Portugal and are doing all they can to avoid those questions.

Edited 4 October 2007 by Raj

[Kent Fox]

You cheeky b****r Kent. I've hardly ever posted anything longer than three paragraphs in this thread or elsewhere on the forum.

Hahaha!

Guilty as charged

[l444ry]

Hahaha!

Guilty as charged

I hereby refuse to answer any further accusations and will remove myself from the vicinity forthwith, pleading my innocence (of course)!!

[Raj]

I hereby refuse to answer any further accusations and will remove myself from the vicinity forthwith, pleading my innocence (of course)!!

[Chandler]

OK fellas we've now got our luscious lovely out of her winter woolies and into her 18-30 kit. But will her T shirt be all wet next time? Better than Ritalin for attention deficit chavs methinks. But her charms have made little impression on the Portuguese police who appear determined to ignore her.

Perhaps they're all gay...

[Zingari]

OK fellas we've now got our luscious lovely out of her winter woolies and into her 18-30 kit. But will her T shirt be all wet next time? Better than Ritalin for attention deficit chavs methinks. But her charms have made little impression on the Portuguese police who appear determined to ignore her.

Perhaps they're all gay...

do you mean this lady ? charlotte pennington

http://gazetadigitalmadeleineandthemedia.b...pful-nanny.html

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article...#39;/article.do

Edited 5 October 2007 by I Zingari

[Kent Fox]

do you mean this lady ? charlotte pennington

http://gazetadigitalmadeleineandthemedia.b...pful-nanny.html

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article...#39;/article.do

Having read both of those links I have come to the dramatic conclusion that she is fcuking nuts.

Who wears a flou...flur..f..bright yellow coat in a boat in the ocean whilst allegedly carrying out a dirty deed?

If it was that late, how could she see he (she?) was kicking at something?

Who was the mysterious stranger / Englishman under the stairs? She bumped into him - I'm surprised he didn't bump her off too.

Utter BS!

Or is it (Twilight Zone music begins)

[Zingari]

Having read both of those links I have come to the dramatic conclusion that she is fcuking nuts.

Who wears a flou...flur..f..bright yellow coat in a boat in the ocean whilst allegedly carrying out a dirty deed?

If it was that late, how could she see he (she?) was kicking at something?

Who was the mysterious stranger / Englishman under the stairs? She bumped into him - I'm surprised he didn't bump her off too.

Utter BS!

Or is it (Twilight Zone music begins)

i thought similarly and i feel you may be right about her , she seems to be a little bit of an attention seeker ( aspiring actress; goes by different names; Pennington, Wighton Whiton Alice etc etc , but i really know nothing other than what has been in the press etc .

[Chandler]

The responses above to my posting of Charlotte's image clearly demonstrate why there is a plinth reserved for me in the pantheon of genius and why others (mentioning no names, Kent Fox) are consigned to crawl on their bellies in the gutters of ignorance.

So, exactly how did our most recent contributors come to the conclusion that our Charlotte was 'fcuking nuts?' Look again at the blog which provided them with their information. It is a most interesting piece of work. Take a step back and see how it has influenced their opinion about our 'attention seeking' part time actress.

And if a whole load of questions don't come rushing out at you all at once, well, all I can say is that you really don't have an eye for detail.

Then there's the small matter of the Evening Standard link. Mentioning no names again, Kent Fox, but someone who skived out of English comprehension is labouring under the massive misapprehension that it was Ms Pennington who happened across the English tourist hiding in the stairwell leading to the McCann's appartment. No it wasn't - it was an unnamed MALE colleague. So it's an F, detention and 500 lines for you chum.

But our Charlotte did catch a glimpse of half an Englishman outside the McCanns appartment on the night Madeleine disappeared...

Edited 6 October 2007 by Chandler

[Rincewind]

That is brilliant. Half a gimpse by an un-named third party and at once in a Sherlock Holnes deductive persona she deduces that a shadow in the dark is an Englishman. Was he wearing a pin-striped suit and a bowler hat and carrying an umbrella by any chance? I am sure that if this was a positive identification it would have been acted upon.

Maybe she is as somebody suggested an attention seeker. The sort of person that likes to be in the limelight whether it be in the papers, on TV or on a messageboard. If she was a member of FT she would be posting loads of long messages with facts that were already known or irrelevant. I am sure others will recognise the type of person without mentioning names Chandler.

If she got this information from a third party and this person has not been located then this evidence would not be admissable in court as it is hearsay (correct me if I am wrong law students).

Edited 6 October 2007 by Nightguard

[Chandler]

Mr Nightmondroy,

Not only do you have a problem with English comprehension you also have a problem with the English language itself. A glimpse of 'half an Englishman' is a semantically different statement to 'half a glimpse of an Englishman.' And Pennington's observation was a both a direct and quite separate experience from that of her MALE colleague.

The facts of this case may be known as you suggest. But the big problem is remembering them all and interpreting them correctly.

AND THAT IS SOMETHING THAT YOU AND THE REST OF THE GREAT UNWASHED OUT THERE APPEAR UNABLE TO DO.

So if you will kindly desist from interrupting the great Hercule Chandler with your facile and ill judged remarks maybe you will allow others to find out who was behind the abduction of Madeleine McCann.

So what was it about the mixed race vision experienced on the night of Madeleine McCann's disappearance by eminently shaggable Charlotte...

and by all of this eminently less shaggable crew

that had this eminently mature shag diving under a blanket?

Edited 11 October 2007 by Chandler

[Rincewind]

Far be it for me to comment on your English grammar but I thought 'half glimpse of an Englishman' sounded better than 'a glimpse of half an Englishman' Which half was it? The top or the bottom? You have not explained how she or her male companion summised that the figure was in fact English. (Star Trek also got it wrong at the beginning of the original series. Boldly go instead of go boldly. )

Maybe the police thought what she or her friend saw was not clear enough evidence. If there was no clear description or the description was passed on by word of mout it would collapse in court.

And I do not like your attitude towards other people. If you cannot conduct a debate in a civil manner then don't bother. I have said little on this case as I am not privy to all the evidence or know the people involved be it the family solicitors or police. I do not claim to know everything about what happened then quote newspapers to back me up. I thought the staement about seeinfg a figure in a stairwell did not seem right that is all. I was using logic to challenge it.

Again I ask as it would be by a lawer in a courtroom, how do you know that the person seen under the stairs was an Englishman if a it was dark and the person/s only caught a glimpse of the figure.

Remember you are not allowed to call a barrister or a judge a part of the great unwashed.

Edited 11 October 2007 by Ian Nightmondroyd

[Rincewind]

If you want to know what happened to Madeline McCann just read the Sun:D The latest story by them is great.

Edited 11 October 2007 by Ian Nightmondroyd