Madeleine McCann

[Daggers]

Not really. You could just be a nutter who believes he is something he is not.

You are, as Chandick might say, a man of great perspicacity.

[Chandler]

In an earlier post I mentioned that there was a certainty, a probability and a possibility at the heart of this case.

So lets look at the CERTAINTY - The McCanns are innocent.

I'd like to have it placed on record for the third time that I don't particularly care for 'Chilly MickoJockoLander' Gerry and his Scouse bint Kate. I really don't like the narcissistic, jingoistic, blathering provincial cultures that spawned them.

And I loathe medical professionals.

It is probably true to say that some Glaswegians and Liverpudlians do have a better sense of humour than most Germans

So when news first broke of Madeleine's abduction there was a strong temptation to go along with the widely held view that her kidnapping was at least partly due to her parent's negligence. Severe as this sentiment was, it was not wholly unreasonable for people to feel this way.

Over time though, I began to notice how many people began to spill out of the 'neglect' camp into, putting it brutally, the 'infanticide' camp. A Times poll published shortly after the McCanns return to Rothley found that up to 80% of those questioned thought that they had something to do with Madeleine's disappearance (this put me in mind of certain PC types who felt that the US 'deserved' to be attacked on 9/11 because of that country's worldwide oppression of Muslims: trendies who later morphed into 9/11 Truthers who now grieve over the 'victims' in the twin towers rather than gloat over the comeuppance of the 'oppressors', piously oblvious to their 180).

Former occupants of these offices would be delighted to know that spotty Nigel BA Hons Lower Second (Media Studies & Golf Course Management Combined Major) now holds regular 'weep ins' for them.

However, as one Gordon Brown knows only too well, the polls can be volatile. I believe that the jury of public opinion is slightly more out than in on the McCanns (though traditional class bias and a peculiar media driven PC prejudice which demands that all victims be black isn't helping them). That is because the public is confused. And it's confused because of the recycled information that it is being drip fed to provoke an EMOTIONAL rather than a RATIONAL response.

In my next post I will show EXACTLY how this has been (and continues to be) done.

Edited 13 October 2007 by Chandler

[Yaxx]

In an earlier post I mentioned that there was a certainty, a probability and a possibility at the heart of this case.

So lets look at the CERTAINTY - The McCanns are innocent.

Whilst I'll admit that you do make some valid points in your posts, they are invariably wrapped up in reams of shite. Is it really a CERTAINTY that the McCanns are innocent? NO, of course it isn't. However, I would agree that in all PROBABILITY they are indeed innocent.

As fascinating as it is, I've pretty much kept out of this debate since being suitably vilified for daring to say that I might actually know a little bit more of what's going on than most. Yet in many ways this is a microcosm of the larger debate that continues to rage. I appreciate that, for many, what I have said so far in my posts carries no more weight than any other 'person close to the investigation'. Nevertheless, if you were to read my posts again you will note that I have thus far been proven right, particularly in respect of there being 'a lot more going on behind the scenes than you realise'. I have no intention of delving into the Chadleresque world of hypothosis, nor do I subscribe to the conspiracy school of thought. Rather, I've endeavoured to bring a more informed opinion to proceedings. In that vain, I'd just like to draw your attention to a couple of extracts from a four-page article in ES magazine, which came with friday's edition of the London Evening Standard. And remember, not all journalism is crap.

"It is probably no coincidence that the news Control Risks had been hired was leaked shortly after the McCanns were made suspects. The very act of taking the company on makes the parents' guilt seem less likely: it would be a brave and arrogant criminal who hired Control Risks to find a child he or she had murdered. The company, experts on kidnapping, is bulging with former policeman, spies and ex-SAS whose natural instincts and aptitudes have been sharpened by years of training to tell when someone is lying to them."

"If they have hired CR, says Patrick Grayson, senior partner of the corporate intelligence firm GPW, I can't think of a better company to take on a challenging and delicate case like this. They are well suited due to their wealth of experience and their global reach."

"Control Risks is so trusted it's sometimes referred to as the 'commercial arm of MI6'. If anyone can find Madeleine McCann, they can."

And, perhaps more importantly......

"Control Risks also, according to grudgingly admiring industry rivals, has one of the most up to date forensic laboratories in the UK."

I doubt that recent comments in the press attributed to the FSS and Leicestershire Police with regards the DNA analysis have really been leaked from them. Nonetheless, both organisations need to tread very carefully in terms of what they say and do, else they could potentially be heading for a very big fall.

[Chandler]

So rather than wait for me to demonstrate that the McCanns are 100% innocent of infanticide Yaxx the Custody Sergeant at Lutterworth Nick decides to leap in with a bit of hair splitting and pompously declare that in all probability they are innocent.

The great chump also tells us that he does not subscribe to the 'conspiracy school of thought.' Hasn't it occurred to you, you great thick plodding oaf that the whole scheme to frame the McCanns (for that is EXACTLY what it is) by the PJ is, at the very LEAST, a police conspiracy and that the only question for us to consider is how high up the food chain does this plot go?

The fact that you have failed to place the McCann abduction in the broader context of child disappearances and abuse scandals in Portugal and that you have ignored local police collusion in these matters (including officers at Portimao handling the so called 'investigation' in to Madeleine McCann's disappearance) shows that your professional interest and self styled expertise in this case is woefully ill informed.

And anybody who could pass off a quote like this without comment...

"Control Risks is so trusted it's sometimes referred to as the 'commercial arm of MI6'. If anyone can find Madeleine McCann, they can."

... is either a spook himself or has the mental age of six.

[Fez of Mahrez]

Say what you want about Chandler but at least every post is an occasion.

Rather one post from Chandler than a million from kids in Ticket News & Travel about which f**king Fox Travel bus they're on.

[Zingari]

Say what you want about Chandler but at least every post is an occasion.

Rather one post from Chandler than a million from kids in Ticket News & Travel about which f**king Fox Travel bus they're on.

i agree ; and i include yaxx in that too , and i'm starting to think chandler has his tongue firmly in cheek with his insults

keep it up lads ( or lasses )

#

ps whats all this about the other nanny being interviewed ?

Edited 15 October 2007 by I Zingari

[l444ry]

Say what you want about Chandler but at least every post is an occasion.

Rather one post from Chandler than a million from kids in Ticket News & Travel about which f**king Fox Travel bus they're on.

They sure are..... but his insults are the only things you can rely on. The rest of his half-baked concoctions would make far more sense if he backed them up with something more substantial than the stupid puzzles he keeps setting.

[Zingari]

They sure are..... but his insults are the only things you can rely on. The rest of his half-baked concoctions would make far more sense if he backed them up with something more substantial than the stupid puzzles he keeps setting.

thats what makes them interesting

[l444ry]

thats what makes them interesting

Oh!!! Just wish he'd make them a bit harder then. His conspiracy theory was being touted within a fortnight of Madeleine's dissapearance, only it took about half a page in a well known tabloid. Just wish he'd come to the end of his kylie monologue so that we could move on!!!

[Zingari]

Oh!!! Just wish he'd make them a bit harder then. His conspiracy theory was being touted within a fortnight of Madeleine's dissapearance, only it took about half a page in a well known tabloid. Just wish he'd come to the end of his kylie monologue so that we could move on!!!

I think alot depends on how you read his posts .

i think of him just as having a bit of a laugh ( not about the subject matter of course ) more than it being very serious investigative journalism

[Chandler]

Half baked concoctions eh 1444ry? Would you like to take that piece of chewing gum out of your mouth, shove it up your mirconium spattered sphincter and kindly give the rest of the class just one example of one of my 'half baked concoctions?'

If you wish to describe my 'Half an Englishman' riddle as a 'stupid puzzle' then what does that make someone like you who failed to provide the 'stupid solution?'

Dumb or Dumber?

[breadandcheese]

Half baked concoctions eh 1444ry? Would you like to take that piece of chewing gum out of your mouth, shove it up your mirconium spattered sphincter and kindly give the rest of the class just one example of one of my 'half baked concoctions?'

How about this little beauty as an example? The great Man U 7 Roma 1 conspiracy to stop the England 2010 world cup.

<a href="http://www.foxestalk.co.uk/forums/index.php?showtopic=35868&st=0" target="_blank">http://www.foxestalk.co.uk/forums/index.ph...=35868&st=0</a>

In the Madeleine McCann case, I do however agree with you that I think the McCanns are innocent and also that there are worrying parallels with earlier cases in Portugal, so have to question whether there is some kind of sinister Belgium style paedophilia ring. Robert Murat I know nothing of so would be interested to know how and why you link him.

Edited 16 October 2007 by breadandcheese

[Zingari]

hasn't raymond chandler solved it yet ?

[Lemon Harpic]

The English press are being quite breathtakingly arrogant in their approach to this.

It is nothing short of idiotic to attack the Portugese Police for suggesting that Madeleine was killed by her parents. The police are the experts and they know that in the vast majority of cases like this the killer (she is dead. Face it) is someone the victim knew. I think we can rule out the other kids so who else does that leave?

I don't know why the English media are so certain of the parents' innocence. Obviously, they did not care whether their daughter lived or died or they would not have left her in the apartment. Clearly, they did not love Maddie, so the crocodile tears and fake concern we see from Kate and Jerry on a daily basis marks them out as liars. Is it any wonder the Portugese police concentrated on the mum and dad, and gave the highly dubious tabloid fantasy of the creepy paedo sneaking out from under the bed and whisking McCann away into the night the contempt it deserves?

By pressuring the Portugese authorities away from the most - indeed only - logical candidates, The gutter press may have succeeded in letting Madeleine's real killer walk away Scot-free. Anyone who buys The Sun has that little girl's blood on their hands.

[James.]

The English press are being quite breathtakingly arrogant in their approach to this.

It is nothing short of idiotic to attack the Portugese Police for suggesting that Madeleine was killed by her parents. The police are the experts and they know that in the vast majority of cases like this the killer (she is dead. Face it) is someone the victim knew. I think we can rule out the other kids so who else does that leave?

I don't know why the English media are so certain of the parents' innocence. Obviously, they did not care whether their daughter lived or died or they would not have left her in the apartment. Clearly, they did not love Maddie, so the crocodile tears and fake concern we see from Kate and Jerry on a daily basis marks them out as liars. Is it any wonder the Portugese police concentrated on the mum and dad, and gave the highly dubious tabloid fantasy of the creepy paedo sneaking out from under the bed and whisking McCann away into the night the contempt it deserves?

By pressuring the Portugese authorities away from the most - indeed only - logical candidates, The gutter press may have succeeded in letting Madeleine's real killer walk away Scot-free. Anyone who buys The Sun has that little girl's blood on their hands.

Thank f**k Lemon Harpic is back. This thread was utter nonsense until the above moment of startling vision and clarity.

[Strokes]

Thank f**k Lemon Harpic is back. This thread was utter nonsense until the above moment of startling vision and clarity.

I totally agree with him, there is no reason to not to suspect the parents and certainly no reason to be sure they didn't do it.

[James.]

I totally agree with him, there is no reason to not to suspect the parents and certainly no reason to be sure they didn't do it.

Yes, apart from a total lack of real evidence. May as well charge them right now. In the f**king bag.

I have neither the time or motivation to deconstruct Mr Harpic's farcical post. Whether someone else on here has is another matter.

[Nationwider]

I totally agree with him, there is no reason to not to suspect the parents and certainly no reason to be sure they didn't do it.

Whilst I wouldn't rule them out 100%, the odds on them killing their daughter (accidentally or otherwise), hiding the body, maintaining the sang froid to successfully dupe the police, their friends, family and the media, and then embark on such a freakshow media circus tour whilst the world (literally) watched them every step of the way, are truly outlandish.

That would probably make them two of the greatest and most successful super criminals ever. Hats off to them if that's the case. Stranger things etc.....

On the balance of probabilities, they didn't kill their daughter physically with their own hands.

But in my eyes, they've committed a crime on a par with that, and are serving their own private life sentence in hell.

[Dr The Singh]

The English press are being quite breathtakingly arrogant in their approach to this.

It is nothing short of idiotic to attack the Portugese Police for suggesting that Madeleine was killed by her parents. The police are the experts and they know that in the vast majority of cases like this the killer (she is dead. Face it) is someone the victim knew. I think we can rule out the other kids so who else does that leave?

I don't know why the English media are so certain of the parents' innocence. Obviously, they did not care whether their daughter lived or died or they would not have left her in the apartment. Clearly, they did not love Maddie, so the crocodile tears and fake concern we see from Kate and Jerry on a daily basis marks them out as liars. Is it any wonder the Portugese police concentrated on the mum and dad, and gave the highly dubious tabloid fantasy of the creepy paedo sneaking out from under the bed and whisking McCann away into the night the contempt it deserves?

By pressuring the Portugese authorities away from the most - indeed only - logical candidates, The gutter press may have succeeded in letting Madeleine's real killer walk away Scot-free. Anyone who buys The Sun has that little girl's blood on their hands.

Whoohoo, he's back, I missed you Lemony!!!!

[l444ry]

The English press are being quite breathtakingly arrogant in their approach to this.

It is nothing short of idiotic to attack the Portugese Police for suggesting that Madeleine was killed by her parents. The police are the experts and they know that in the vast majority of cases like this the killer (she is dead. Face it) is someone the victim knew. I think we can rule out the other kids so who else does that leave?

I don't know why the English media are so certain of the parents' innocence. Obviously, they did not care whether their daughter lived or died or they would not have left her in the apartment. Clearly, they did not love Maddie, so the crocodile tears and fake concern we see from Kate and Jerry on a daily basis marks them out as liars. Is it any wonder the Portugese police concentrated on the mum and dad, and gave the highly dubious tabloid fantasy of the creepy paedo sneaking out from under the bed and whisking McCann away into the night the contempt it deserves?

By pressuring the Portugese authorities away from the most - indeed only - logical candidates, The gutter press may have succeeded in letting Madeleine's real killer walk away Scot-free. Anyone who buys The Sun has that little girl's blood on their hands.

Team McCann began all this tit-for-tat leaking to the press. It was due to Aunty Phil and the rest of them that the PJ felt the need to respond with their own leaking. But now the McCanns have upped the ante even further with the employment of Clarence Mitchell. Virtually every British newspaper reports daily the scraps which this government spin doctor feeds them. Whether the McCanns are guilty or not this propaganda offensive is doing them no good at all.

The misinformation being peddled out is a disgrace.

[Nationwider]

While we're on the subject of the media influencing public opinion, let's all enjoy this little savlo of headlines from last week's Meldrew-ite Daily Express:

October 8:

October 9:

October 12:

October 13:

Aimless thrashing around for headlines at the expense of a four year old girl, or high-quality journalism?

[Zingari]

While we're on the subject of the media influencing public opinion, let's all enjoy this little savlo of headlines from last week's Meldrew-ite Daily Express:

October 8:

October 9:

October 12:

October 13:

Aimless thrashing around for headlines at the expense of a four year old girl, or high-quality journalism?

is the free curry offer still on in the last express ? only i can't read the small print .

[breadandcheese]

The English press are being quite breathtakingly arrogant in their approach to this.

It is nothing short of idiotic to attack the Portugese Police for suggesting that Madeleine was killed by her parents. The police are the experts and they know that in the vast majority of cases like this the killer (she is dead. Face it) is someone the victim knew. I think we can rule out the other kids so who else does that leave?

I don't know why the English media are so certain of the parents' innocence. Obviously, they did not care whether their daughter lived or died or they would not have left her in the apartment. Clearly, they did not love Maddie, so the crocodile tears and fake concern we see from Kate and Jerry on a daily basis marks them out as liars. Is it any wonder the Portugese police concentrated on the mum and dad, and gave the highly dubious tabloid fantasy of the creepy paedo sneaking out from under the bed and whisking McCann away into the night the contempt it deserves?

By pressuring the Portugese authorities away from the most - indeed only - logical candidates, The gutter press may have succeeded in letting Madeleine's real killer walk away Scot-free. Anyone who buys The Sun has that little girl's blood on their hands.

Not only has this topic spurred Chandler back to posting, but also Lemon Harpic.

I'm surprised at your inability to criticise the Portugese police. Their leaks to the media have been nothing short of appalling for what is sensitive and confidential information that has found it's way onto the front pages. Indeed, if somebody is ever arrested, it will be interesting to see if a defence lawyer makes a case about the fairness of any trial due to the press leaks traced back to the Portugese boys in blue. Their conduct in that is disgraceful.

[Kent Fox]

While Chandler is concocting his next piece of riddle for this thread, I wonder where he stands on the 'who killed Diana' debate??

I bet he knows, but we mere thickies will have to wait for 700 posts before we get a picture clue.

Over to you, Special Agent Chandler.

Oh, and I am not your enemy. Just so you know, I just think you talk bollocks. However, I also think that you do it on purpose. So now, I just laugh at what you have to say.

It's funny

[Rincewind]

There is only one thing for sure that killed Diana. She WAS NOT wearing a seatbelt.

A bullet to the head would have given more creedence to the theory that she was murdered.I find it hard to believe that a group that planned an assination would come up with a plan that relies on the occuopant of a car not wearing seatbelts and the driver to crash into a wall in a tunnel killing vrtually all occupants of the vehcle. Do they not have more sophisticated methods than this? If as some said it was the secret service wouldn't they have done so as to aportion blame towards some terrorist group?

As for the main topic of this thread I agree with a previous poster that although it cannot be 100% certain that Madeline parents had nothing to do with her dissapearance, they would have to be the most masterly crimminals to ever have existed to have fooled everyone who has been involved in the investigation. There is virtually no evidence linking them that would prevail under close examination.

Edited 16 October 2007 by Nightguard