Happy Fox Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 As keeps being repeated over and over again. How many of those 94 were 5/10 minutes at the end of a game as sub. Out of the ones he did start after he signed how many were shoved out wide. There are mitigating circumstances here. As also keeps being repeated he scored as many as Schlupp did from 9 league games as Shlupp got in 21. Anyway, this is as boring as Beckford now. http://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/en/martyn-waghorn/leistungsdaten/spieler_61674_gesamt.html 45 times substituted on 33 times substituted off 250 minutes per goal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark_w Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 250 minutes per goal. 1 in 3 isn't bad for our third choice striker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 23 October 2012 Author Share Posted 23 October 2012 How many chances does he need for people to realize he isn't good enough? 94 appearances and 19 goals good enough return or not in your eyes? Why are we still making up statistics? 89 appearances, 44 starts, 45 as sub, 17 goals, you seem to be including his loan spells at Hull and Charlton, and his games at Sunderland, or maybe his international games. I don't know, where you got those figures from, but his stats for us are all I care about. How many chances does he need? I don't know, but it is more than 3 starts and 5 sub appearances in a year before I write him off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finnegan Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Neither is Schlupp, but people don't feel the need to rip him a new one do they? I'm not condoning the abuse but then I've never actually heard any at the game and this place is always full of negative retards, so I've learnt to block it out. Of course people should get behind him while he's the best cover we have but at the same time there's no harm in people like Mablo pointing out we need better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 23 October 2012 Author Share Posted 23 October 2012 http://www.transferm...674_gesamt.html 45 times substituted on 33 times substituted off 250 minutes per goal. Oooh, cracking stats site that, I've been looking for a goals per minute stat, now I see where you got those stats from. Incidentally, David Nugent goals per minutes 242 in the championship Vardy 272 in the Championship Beckford 291 Schlupp 313 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitchandro Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Neither is Schlupp, but people don't feel the need to rip him a new one do they? I've not seen Schlupp miss the amount of sitters Waghorn has. That's not an exaggeration, there's been some really diabolical displays of finishing. And Schlupp was played on the right for a lot of last season as well, since we're talking about Waggy being out of position, rarely was he up front. But statistics and facts aside, you can still form your own opinions on what you see of a player and what you think of him. To me, Schlupp looks to have more potential, that goes for a finisher and all round play. And Schlupp's more versatile as well, he looks to have potential on the left wing as well as a left back, so I couldn't really understand it when Waghorn was getting on the bench and he wasn't. But that's slightly off topic. It's not ripping him a new one to suggest he's not good enough. Some have been overly harsh but I don't think that many people have ripped him a new one. But when there's a thread that attempts to be a bit overly kind to his performances you're bound to get a backlash. I thought he was superb in his first season here, but things have changed, he's regressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Flair Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 The problem with Waghorn is, he's always been wasteful. When he was on loan in the season he did well for us, he was massively inconsistent and often went missing in big games. It's no surprise he's found it difficult to make an impact with very few chances to play, he's not and never will be an impact player in my opinion. If he get's a prolonged run in the side he might just reach the level we thought he could, but if he's just going to be a bit part player then there's no point in him as he's the pits in this role. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manwell Pablo Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 or BECAUSE HE WAS INJURED For 2 and a half years ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfox Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 As keeps being repeated over and over again. How many of those 94 were 5/10 minutes at the end of a game as sub. Out of the ones he did start after he signed how many were shoved out wide. There are mitigating circumstances here. As also keeps being repeated he scored as many as Schlupp did from 9 league games as Shlupp got in 21. Anyway, this is as boring as Beckford now. Yes he has had loads of 5-10 minute chances at end of games, but I don't blame Pearson, Eriksson or whoever to bring him on for that amount of time. That doesn't stop the fact that he hasn't done anything for this football club in three years, the season we signed him permanetly he looked an entirely different player to the one we seen a season before, then he got injured loaned out to Hull then came back. Then he has had a few chances with us here and there, and frankly his best game for us in the last two years was the one against Leeds at the end of last season. Apart from that he has done bugger all, he had a chance to prove his worth in the Cup against Burton and he failed to take it, on that note im not surprised to see him on the bench rather than starting; however he seems more in Pearson's plans than the likes of Danns and Gallagher who did woeful against Burton. I think the reason people prefer Schlupp is because he has the pace, people love pace and he has impressed in the cup before and with those goals it makes people stand up and take note, of what a huge talent he may be. While Waghorn recently, has had a couple of chances especially in the past month, he has come on a few times maybe for 20 mins or so, people may say that's not long enough, but it doesn't overshadow the fact that he has had incredible chances to score in all of those games, he should of bagged against Wolves all he needed to do was put it to the side of the keeper and it was in, but he decided to go near post, then he smashed the post, few minutes later he got the ball on the edge of the 18 yard box and fell over it, while in his sub appearance against Burnley, he seemed pretty sharp, but yet again he was clean through on goal and then fell over the ball, when he should of really killed off the game to make it 3-1, while at the weekend it seemed he was our worst player on the pitch along with Dyer. How many chances does Waghorn need? To me has had quite enough, and hasn't took his chance in any of those occasions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark_w Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Oooh, cracking stats site that, I've been looking for a goals per minute stat, now I see where you got those stats from. Incidentally, David Nugent goals per minutes 242 in the championship Vardy 272 in the Championship Beckford 291 Schlupp 313 It's great isn't it, not only has Happy Fox proved that Waggy is our second best striker, but I can prove Fryatt is better than Beckford as well. Fryatt 273 Beckford 291 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corky Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 He didn't go to Derby kingfox. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan LCFC Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Form is temporary, class is permanent. Martyn Waghorn was a good striker for us in 2009/10. And ever since then, over two years, has looked out of his depth in 95% of games he's played in. I hope he succeeds but I don't see it myself, one of the most limited technical footballers I have ever seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 I'm not condoning the abuse but then I've never actually heard any at the game and this place is always full of negative retards, so I've learnt to block it out. Can't remember what game it was but I've heard him booed from SK4 when he came on. Which is a disgrace. there's no harm in people like Mablo pointing out we need better. I have personally as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 I've not seen Schlupp miss the amount of sitters Waghorn has. That's not an exaggeration, there's been some really diabolical displays of finishing. Does that mean he isn't getting into the correct position then? And Schlupp was played on the right for a lot of last season as well, since we're talking about Waggy being out of position, rarely was he up front. You can't say that, apparently it's a bullshit excuse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfox Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 He didn't go to Derby kingfox. Just Hull then, must of imagined him playing for Derby in a dream once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corky Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Can't remember what game it was but I've heard him booed from SK4 when he came on. Which is a disgrace. Waghorn? It's a far cry from Scunthorpe away when people were chanting for him to replace Yakubu. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manwell Pablo Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Just Hull then, must of imagined him playing for Derby in a dream once. It was rumoured. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corky Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Just Hull then, must of imagined him playing for Derby in a dream once. Given his popularity around that time Sven would've been lambasted if he'd allowed Waghorn to join Derby. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfox Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Also another reason I think Waghorn hasn't had many chances is because we have had much better strikers than him. 2010/2011 - Yakubu, Gallagher, Kamara, Vassell and Fryatt were all better options. 2011/2012 - Nugent, Vassell, Beckford and Schlupp(Due to Cup form) were all better options Now this season, Nugent and Vardy are better options, while I also prefer Schlupp while Futacs hasn't been given a chance, now most likely another striker is going to come in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitchandro Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Does that mean he isn't getting into the correct position then? You can't say that, apparently it's a bullshit excuse. Well I never said it was a bullshit excuse. I've not even really commented on his goalscoring record, merely the amount of good chances I've seen him miss. It's not necessarily about the positions he's getting in, but like I said, he was rarely playing in the centre up front. We've been poor creatively for some time up until this season, the only time we were really creating a load of chances was under Sven (and at times under Sousa) in 10/11, and in that was before Schlupp had broken through. In that season Waghorn was very poor in front of goal. I sympathised with him back then in the same way you are now - he had been impressive in 09/10 and we all wanted him to do as well the season after, but he's been a let down ever since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrumFox Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 One big difference between Waghorn, and Danns/Beckford/Vassell is that he is still young can and will still improve, those 3 are all past their best and going down hill, another big difference is attitude, you get the impression that Waghorn would run through a wall for this club. So can we afford to have a young talented player in the squad and on the bench for the season to help him improve and develop, then yes, should he start ahead of Vardy or Nugent? No, but he is part of the development squad for a reason, he is still developing. ...so that would require 2 or 3 more starts before you could judge him? You know Danns is 29 and Beckford is 28 right? The time most players hit their peak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark_w Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Just Hull then, must of imagined him playing for Derby in a dream once. This would explain an awful lot of your views about numerous players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soar Fox Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 Waghorn's goal against Leeds was about as meaningful as Beckford's goals in the cup. Nothing game on the last day of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain... Posted 23 October 2012 Author Share Posted 23 October 2012 For 2 and a half years ? Have you already forgotten what you wrote? And to use yours and several others pathetic arguement against you the messiah that is Nigel Pearson deemed this to be the case since his arrival here and he's got us to the top of the league in October so any decision he makes therefore has to be correct .Only now because of injury and unfortuante circumstances has he found himself starting That i because he has been injured the whole tie Nigel has been back until the West Ham game, last season, where he came on as a sub, and the Leeds game where he started. He didn't play under NP before that... ...BECAUSE HE WAS INURED Form is temporary, class is permanent. Martyn Waghorn was a good striker for us in 2009/10. And ever since then, over two years, has looked out of his depth in 95% of games he's played in. I hope he succeeds but I don't see it myself, one of the most limited technical footballers I have ever seen. Since that season he managed 921 minutes in the first 16 games of the season under Sousa and a bit of Sven, scoring twice, but we were just awful for the majority of that period, and he never completed 90 minutes under Sven. Then for the rest of that season made 18 more "appearances" totaling 250 minutes of football at an average of 13.8 minutes per appearance, scoring twice in the process. Last season he made 4 appearances for us, 135 minutes scored 1 At Hull he made 5 appearances and scored 1. So far this season he has played 135 minutes of league football and not scored, but I just don't think that is enough football to write off some one who has proven how good they are not that long ago is getting international recognition and is only 22. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingfox Posted 23 October 2012 Share Posted 23 October 2012 This would explain an awful lot of your views about numerous players. Numerous players? That would just be Waghorn and De Laet then. I didn't really have awful views on Drinkwater and James, Drinkwater was very inconsistent last season which was true and seemed very overrated, this season he has come on leaps and bounds and im really happy to see him playing well, I don't have a problem with James I just didn't think he was the type of midfielder we should of brought and that is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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